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Choosing/spec'ing VHF radio?

5K views 28 replies 17 participants last post by  eherlihy 
#1 ·
I have a friend that has offered to "gift" me a VHF (and HF) radio for the boat. He wants me to spec it out for him. It's yer typical "waddaIknow" from radios? ;)

Perusing the listings on several sites and winnowing out the $1000+/- units; I have a helluva time figuring what I need vs what I want.
I don;t see the need for displays that show like GPS, tho the capability to plug in a GPS for futue AIS (?) would be nice. I don't have a need for a "system" to tell me where I am or plot where ta go. NO auto-pilot, weather station, radar, etc. to link to.

What I *would* like is a PA/hailer capability, a plug-in for potential future GPS co-ord for AIS, and an all-freq available currently selection. I'd like to get something that I won't need to upgrade/replace in a few years when the specs on new stuff supercedes current offerings.

Above all , it hasta be simple! Pull down menus and needing the manual or a Doctorate in EE just ta turn it on are NOT my cuppa tea. What I'm seeing for sale seems ta be common garden variety for less than $129 and some up grades to those at nearer$180; then a jump up to the *would like* specs in the 350-500 range and further still , the jump to $800+ !

Next.. I know dot.all from HF, so I'll let that one rest...for now.

Main issue is.. I don't wanna spec something that will cause my benefactor to grit his teeth and say "ouch!". Obversely; I don't want any gracious and spendy gift radio to go largely unused, functionwise. That'd be wasteful!.

SO.. can I get by on an inexpensive..say $180 "kit" rig?
Or should I include a few "bells and whistles" for the mid-price mark?

Decisions...decisions??!!
 
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#2 ·
I think a lot of people will agree that ICOM is one of your better brands. I bought one last year that was reasonable with all the features I wanted. I wanted a unit that a RAM (remote access microphone) could be hooked up to. I have a sailboat and often, sailboats have their VHF's inside the cabin, mine as well. I've hooked up my radio and hopefully in the spring, I will hook up my RAM.
 
#3 ·
"I have a friend that has offered to "gift" me a VHF (and HF) radio for the boat."
Usually those would be two separate radios, and an HF SSB radio with antenna tuner and whatnot could hit a thousand bucks all by itself.

VHF today probably should mean VHF with AIS transceiver, not just receiver, and that means GPS as well. Without the RAM nonsense, that still won't be cheap either.

The question is whether your friend knows what they're getting into, and you might gently ask about that.

I'd also suggest looking at Standard Horizon for the VHF, they might have the finest customer service in the business as well as a great product.
 
#6 ·
Ditto the RAM remote mic - without it we end up using a handheld in the cockpit, with its inferior range, or just not using (or simply not hearing) the cabin-mounted radio.

OTOH, if you don't have one, a VHF handheld isn't a bad idea either.

Personally, I like Icom radios which I have for HF and amateur. My boat came with a Standard Horizon VHF (with RAM mic), and I have to admit they offer a great set of features for the money. I'm thinking seriously of their GX2150 with built-in AIS receiver as my next upgrade, unless I go for a full transponder. Even then, my current VHF is SC101, not full Class D, so it will be upgraded one of these days anyway.

Last tip/suggestion/strong suggestion: any new VHF will be DSC capable. GET AN MMSI number and PROGRAM it in the radio. If you have a GPS, CONNECT it to the radio.
 
#7 · (Edited)
The FCC mandates that all NEW VHF transceivers have a built-in full Class D DSC capability. So, unless you're talking about a used radio, that's a given.

Re: brands, Icom is certainly very popular. Lots of companies make good VHF radios. I tend to prefer Standard Horizon; mine is the GX5500, same as the Coast Guard decided upon.

This model does not have AIS capability. I don't care, because I think most inexperienced boaters -- and a few experienced ones -- tend to exaggerate the value of AIS. It's risen to almost magical proportions. I wonder how mariners have been able to make out for several centuries without it :)

To use the DSC capability, you'll need to hook up a GPS to the radio, with GPS sentences taken either from a chartplotter, a standalone GPS, or other device (like a laptop with a hockey-puck GPS attached).

You'll also need an MMSI number to plug into the VHF and, possibly if you get one, the HF radio as well. Tip: if you plan to travel abroad (Canada, Mexico, Bahamas, etc.) DO NOT get the MMSI number from Boat US or other organization. Get one from the FCC only. If you get an HF radio, you'll need license(s); these cost upwards of $200, so be sure you apply for all transmitting devices at the same time (VHF, HF, radar, EPIRB, satellite, etc.) to avoid multiple charges. The FCC will automatically issue you an MMSI number with your license application and this is the one you should use to program into the radio(s).

A loudhailer function is marginally useful. An automated foghorn can be very useful, particularly if you sail in northern waters.

The RAM mic is a useful addition for some (I have one). Depending on your boat and your preferences, however, you can buy a simple waterproof VHF radio to install in the cockpit, with a small antenna on the pushpit or radar arch, for just about the same money as adding a RAM mic, and have total redundancy.

A waterproof handheld VHF is also a good idea. I have several (ham and marine) and like the Standard Horizon HX851 with the built-in GPS very much. It floats, too :)

You must have a VERY good benefactor if he/she is willing to spring for an HF transceiver as well. Now you're talking real money :)

Bill
 
#8 ·
Deltaten-

I see you sail a 1980 Watkins 27 footer with wheel steering and sail the upper Chessie. How you plan to use the boat (day sailing or multi-day cruising) can affect what you get for a radio. If you plan to sail solo vs. with crew most of the time can impact our recommendations too.

In my opinion, get anybody’s handheld that floats if you plan to day sail by yourself most of the time. If you want to spend a little more, get a fixed VHF in the cabin with RAM at the pedestal. If you sail at night on a regular basis, then a VHF with AIS is a real nice safety feature.

We’ve had both icom and standard horizon units and have been happy with both. We sail the Great Lakes, often at night, often in/across shipping lanes, often just the two of us or me solo. There is nothing like having a big freighter pop out of the fog, mid-Lake Michigan, to help you spec out you radio and navigation package. We currently have the Standard Horizon GX2150 with built-in AIS receiver in the cabin wired to a RAM and GPS chart plotter at the pedestal. The combination sounds an alarm when a big boat is within our sailing area and shows where it will be at its closest approach.

I guess, in the short run, how you will use your boat should determine what you get now. How long you plan to keep the boat can also drive your choice as I seldom see people yank out their radio when they move up to the “next boat” (and you know that will happen one day).
 
#9 ·
MSN, all;

For now, it will be me solo puttering the N. Chessie, mostly daylight and probably for short-term/couple day trips... at least for this season. Eventually, the plan is to be on the water between the Chessie and Corpus Christie somewhere, full time ;)

While I *had* considered a handheld, I was recommended a permanent cabin mount, as it will fare better at distance and be less likely to take a swim :D

Would you consider AIS to be mandatory on the ICW ?

Oh! BTW.. my W-27 has tiller, not wheel steerage. Mo' room in the 'pit :)

Thanx,
Paul
 
#11 · (Edited)
I guess it's time to roll play. You're at the tiller and that fixed VHF is somewhere down below. I can tell you that it is unlikely that you will hear anything being said and if you do hear something, it is unlikely that you will understand what is being said.

This will prompt you to get an external speaker in the cockpit just to hear and understand what is said. Now you can hear and understand what is being said but the damn mike is down below. Maybe you can get a long mike cable but I've never seen one.

That is why I suggested a handheld as your first radio. Under $150 for a floater and you're good to go.

If you are convinced that a fixed unit with a longer reach is what you need right now, then something like the Standard Horizon GX1600 with a RAM3 in the cockpit would work well for you. Welcome to StandardHorizon.com Of course, the DSC safety function would be crippled due to no GPS data.

Standard Horizon has the GX1700, which is basically the GX1600 with built-in GPS Welcome to StandardHorizon.com About $210 thru Amazon.com

Both radios can be installed below and the only thing in the cockpit would be the RAM3 remote mike. About $90 thru Defender.com http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|344|2028693|2028957&id=1133628

Don't forget the antenna ($40) and co-ax run up the mast (about $1 per foot plus connectors).

Can't speak to the ICW . . . never been there.
 
#10 ·
Don't worry about loudhailer capability. If the radio that you like has an output, it's a bonus, but don't focus on it- you'll never use it.
a RAM mike is a great idea, but the same purpose can be served, arguably more reliably, with a longer mic cable and an external speaker, at a lower cost. Mount your radio close to the companionway and a RAM on a small boat is almost unnecessary, because the mic will be close at hand. A radio with controls on the mic is a great idea.

Regarding superior transmit/receive range with fixed mount vs. Handheld: Consider how you use your radio. Will you regularly need to contact vessels or marinas more than 5 miles away? if so, then range is important. If not, then the extended reach of a fixed mount over a handheld is of little value.
 
#13 · (Edited)
All good advice here, but if you are going to cruise south, I would opt for the AIS built into the radio. We have an ICOM with the AIS receiver option as an addon and I wish I could trade it for the newer model with integrated AIS. I would also opt for the facility to add the extended mic, but you don't have to buy the the extra mike until you feel the need to spend the extra money. We just reach down below and extend the cable so far. We like the ICOM brand, but then I tend to buy cars built within 500 miles of the Alps, performance counts and the price is about the same.....

Oh and the Canadian ICOM rep lives in St. Catharines and it's his AIS receiver that is putting the Welland shipping on the web, just so you know.
 
#23 ·
If you are sure you are going to stay in US territorial waters, the BoatUS MMSI generator is fine.

But if you have any plans to go into other countries' territorial waters, only an FCC issued MMSI will be kosher.

As others have mentioned, inputting an MMSI into a radio is a one or two try event (models vary -- read the user manual carefully) before you have to send it back to the shop for a reset.
 
#15 ·
In today's world, with the offerings that are out there for VHF, there is no way I'd go with anything but my Standard Horizon 2150x, with AIS.
You can feed it GPS very easily from even a hand held provided you have one with a cradle/stand like my Magellan has.
 
#16 ·
I suggest that a handheld VHF without DSC is the first radio that you should have. The reason for going without DSC is that the MMSI is associated with the vessel, and not the radio. It would be a pain to get a good handheld, and then have to leave it behind because you are sailing on OPBs, or upgrade your boat. A good (5W+) handheld is also more useful than a RAM if you ever have to ditch.

After getting a good handheld, I would then look at a fixed mount VHF for communication over longer ranges. The fixed mount unit will also integrate with a GPS to provide DSC. AIS would be nice to have, but you can always buy a standalone AIS receiver, or transceiver.
 
#18 · (Edited)
You may want to double check that....

Here is a quote from the Standard Horizon HX851 handheld User Manual, page 34;
WARNING
A user MMSI can be inputted only once (as per government regulation). Therefore please be careful not to input the incorrect MMSI number. If you need to change the MMSI after it has been programmed, the radio will have to be returned to Factory Service...
 
#20 ·
UPDATE: my mistake - br3nt is right. The MMSI is associated with the INDIVIDUAL and not the vessel, as I indicated in my previous post. The MMSI database entry, however, does identify the vessel, hailing port and emergency points of contact.

So, while you can edit the MMSI Database to indicate that you and your MMSI registered radio are changing vessels, it still seems like a pain to have to do this if you go sailing on a friend's boat, and want to bring your handheld VHF.

I hope this helps.
 
#22 ·
eh-
"it still seems like a pain to have to do this if you go sailing on a friend's boat, and want to bring your handheld VHF."
This is why a handheld VHF should be licensed as a PORTABLE device, not a conventional fixed station. Last time I looked the FCC still licensed them--including the MMSI--as a ship's station license, but as a PORTABLE ship's station license, if you requested it.

That lets them know that whatever vessel is associated with the license, may not be the vessel in question. I have an EPRIB that is also licensed with a note that it is used as a portable, and may be on different vessels. NOAA doesn't care, FCC doesn't care, the only folks who care are the USCG if they need the SAR paperwork filled out. Well, technically, if your handheld ever wanders off the mothership (and if a license is required) like to a dink? Technically, that's probably when "portable" is required. I doubt anyone would ever call you to task if it wasn't.

"Description of vessel: white with white hull, white deck, white sails" Oh yeah, that's gonna help find it. (VBG)

"Portable" just tells them it could be anything in that vicinity, pretty much like "white".
 
#25 ·
OK, need a little more info about your boat. Do you have a plotter? Are you comfortable wiring things together at the level of soldering wires together?

Personally, I'd avoid radios with AIS, because I'm a strong believer in having an AIS transceiver that sends and receives. AIS in the radio is nice but not worth the $$ imho if you are going to buy a transmitter anyway.

easiest to use just add power would be the standard horizon gx1700 with gps.

My personal favorite is the SH 1600.

ANd I'm a big fan of NEMA 2000 for easy integration ot a plotter, so that would be the new Lowrances on a budget or simrads/Garmin if not.
 
#26 ·
Can't wait to hear what you got.

I'm a big fan of the RAM mic in the cockpit. Big tip...... remove it and put it away when not in use, they usually have a twist off connector. UV kills them.

Hailer is nice, but not mandatory.

If you are daytime sailing in reasonable viz, there is no need for AIS. Where there is a need, such as at night, in dense fog, bad weather or offshore, you really need a transponder, not just a receiver on a VHF. Someone asked about the ICW. I can not imagine being in conditions on the ICW that would make AIS all that necessary. If you can't see on the ICW, you should probably have the hook down. Then, you would more likely need to transmit your location, rather than receiving others.
 
#27 ·
xymotic;
No, no plotter or any other e-device with the possible exception of a Garmin GPS. Failing that, paper charts and depth sounder is it. Mk 1 eyeball, tuned to wx band and a wetted finger in the air ;).

Still tying to decide which one ta go with; but it appears my best bet for starters is a plain-Jane handheld. Nowhere I'm going to go ...at least for a season or so, will be out of range. No built-in GPS or other system needed. Looking more at battery longevity, variations in power sourcing and alkaline e-pak availability.

Still a month +/- from splash, so there's still time :D
 
#28 ·
Are you cruising relatively close? human head to human head the the range of a handheld is about 7 miles before the curvature of the earth gets in the way. Here in the puget sound we're never more than 3 miles from shore, and the CG has nice towers atop mountains so a HH makes a lot of sense.
 
#29 ·
If it helps, here is a list of what I have for comms, and the order in which I purchased them;
  • First purchase - iCom M34 (now obsolete by the M36) handheld VHF - I covered the bottom with red SOLAS reflective tape, so that I would have a chance at finding it if it went into the drink.
  • Second purchase - Garmin GPSmap478 Chartplotter (no longer available, and the Garmin GPSmap 640 is NOT an equivalent IMHO)
  • Third purchase - (after several years of sailing with the above on OPB) a Sailboat
  • Fourth purchase - an iCom M-422 (now obsolete by the M-412) fixed VHF with DSC
I integrated the M-422 with the GPSmap 478 (NMEA 0183) to provide DSC function.
 
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