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Trailer sailer

24K views 60 replies 28 participants last post by  Erin33 
#1 ·
First off let me state this is my first post and I have zero sailing exp. Me and my wife (mostly me) are looking at getting into sailing as I belive it will be one of the most most peaceful things to do. I was wondering if the sailing community could assit me in finding the right boat for us with our requirements.

1. Own a jeep that can pull 3500 lbs
2. Must be safe as wife is scared of the water :p
3. Can be operated mostly by one person
4. Decent interior for few days to a week stay
5. We plan to tow in and out after each excursion, for money saving reasons.
6. Hoping for 24-27 foot range
7. Safe sailing for stright of Georgia area

Our main usage based on our lifestyle would be going to a island tossing a anchor out and staying a few nights just to enjoy mother earth. I dont need the fastest or most shinny, a good interior and peace of mind that the boats safe is our goal. Another side question too..been seening a few sailboats with 50+ hp on the back .. is this a good thing for safety reason or would I feel just as safe on a boat with a 9.9 ? Again looking to sail not ski, but if its a safe thing to have for just incase moments ill get it.


Thanks so much in advance
Brad
 
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#2 ·
1. Own a jeep that can pull 3500 lbs
Many trailer sailers are around 2,000 lbs.

2. Must be safe as wife is scared of the water
Nothing will quell her fear, if she cannot at least learn basics you could be the one to fall overboard and she would watch you drown.

3. Can be operated mostly by one person
It's called "single handing" and it's really not rocket science.

4. Decent interior for few days to a week stay
Not may trailer-able boats are comfortable enough for more then a few days unless you really like roughing it.

5. We plan to tow in and out after each excursion, for money saving reasons.
rigging and de-rigging are time consuming.

6. Hoping for 24-27 foot range
are on the big end for towing. (may need a stronger vehicle)

7. Safe sailing for stright of Georgia area.
where you sail is more about ability then the boat.

50hp outboard on a sailboat, is most likely "motor sailer" boats like Mac26

Most smaller outboard sailboats are "displacement hulled" and can only do maybe 5-7 mph or knots

If you cannot stand upright inside a boat.. staying on it in less then ideal weather is boring and cramped.
 
#3 · (Edited)
So the only boat name I heard is mac26..is that the recommendation ? And yes my spouse is nervous of the water but I belive this to be a good thing...as soon as you lose respect you get cought with your pants down looking like a dumba**. Im hoping to hear of a few brands to suit these needs im aware there are lots of boats out there but im hoping to find the right one for us.
 
#4 ·
No. Mac = McGregor motor sailers are a love hate thing. Not a true sailboat not a true power boat. But they have a cult like group of owners that love them.

Most people starting out with trailer sail boats will go for boats in the 18-23 ft range. I had a hunter 23 but sold in in less then a year because it made me realize I wanted larger. much larger.

I would suggest you get some sailing time on rented boats, or find a club or make friends with people that own a sailboat. wants are very very different then needs when it comes to boats.

Get some basics on sailing books and check out the millions of vids on youtube on how to sail. how to rig, tow, etc a boat.

Catlaina, Hunter, Precision, Pearson, are some.. there many others. new and old out there.
fixed keel and centerboard or swing keel boats.
 
#28 · (Edited)
No. Mac = McGregor motor sailers are a love hate thing. Not a true sailboat not a true power boat. But they have a cult like group of owners that love them.
Not totally true. The Macs are mostly NOT powersailers, most models are standard sailboats up until after the 26S.

Don't reject Macs because the current models are powersailers. The 25 is in the American Sailboat Hall of Fame in fact.

Sorry, but I have to call this out as it seems to be repeated on here constantly. Mac does not necessarily = No.

EDIT: I went back and read the whole thread and of course this is sorta covered. I just wanted to say that my family of 4 uses a M25 exactly as you want and it is a great boat for it. We will be doing coastal cruising with it this summer and I have little concern. This is the use it was intended for after all.
 
#5 ·
Denise has given you very good advice; go back and read her responses carefully. They are deceptively short, but almost all are dead on. The only issue I have is with the weight she suggested. I had a Catalina 25 with the swing keel. The boat's dry weight was something like 4000 lbs. Add on the trailer, and you're looking at about 5000 lbs. Tack on an engine, water, fuel, gear, etc., and you're at least at 5500, possibly closer to 6000 lbs.

According to CATALINA 22 CB sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com, even the Catalina 22 is 2250 lbs. Tack on 600-800 lbs for the trailer, plus gear, engine etc., and you're exceeding the capability of your tow vehicle.

The MacGregor 22 (MACGREGOR 22 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com) might be towable by your jeep.

All that being said, none of those would be my first choice (and, again, I owned a C25) for a week-long trip. None will offer standing headroom except if a "pop-top" is engaged.

Again, I agree with all the other points Denise raised, too.
 
#6 ·
There's a lot of boats that fit what you want to do, however as Dense said, 24 - 27 are on the big end for towing with the vehicle you have. I think ideally you should be looking in the 20 - 22 foot range, something with a swing keel and a pop top, such as a Catalina 22, MacGregor 21, Southcoast 22 just to name a few, If you want to make your wife feel safe and have a larger cabin area in a boat this size take at the Westerly 22's, not the fastest thing on the water but very stable and spacious in the inside for a 22 footer. I trailer my Catalina 22 to and from each time I go out, usually takes me 45 minutes or so to rig and take down, not that bad actually since I do it on my own, and with one of these boats you really don't need more than a 9.9 outboard.
 
#7 ·
I plan to take many classes/lessons my uncle aucally tteaches out of Vancouver so ill be sure to soak up the info. Im not against going smaller I just assumed if I went smaller id lose the comforts inside the boat. And as for Macgregor should I be looking at the ones for 15k ish and the 50 Hp or is the older and much cheaper one good for my needs. Ive been reading alot about Macgregors not being great with winds over 15 knots. Im trying not to blacklist Macgregor but im not hearing the best about them.
 
#8 ·
Thanks catman22 ive heard alot of decent reviews of the catalina. What makes this better then say a Macgregor is it materials ? Because at first glance its almost the same looking.

Sorry if these are silly question. .Like I said no experience :p
 
#9 ·
That is a hotly debated topic here. What most will agree is that Macgregor built boats to a price-point, just like Catalina, Hunter, O'Day, and most other "production" boat builders. Roger built his to a lower price point than the others. Does that mean that the Mac's are bad? Not for some purposes, like lake sailing. Would I personally own one? Under the right conditions, yes. But they don't meet my needs. I add that so you understand that I'm not trying to be unfair. They are decent boats, but they are "entry level" and while there are AVID Mac fans (especially of the 26's) who trailer them everywhere and stay on them for weeks at a time, that's not really my idea of fun. The lack of headroom would make it uncomfortable for me for any length of time (I'm 5'10'), and the cabin lay-out isn't to my liking.

Generally, Macs are seen as being of lesser build quality than Catalinas, Hunters, or O'Days. To my eye (and everyone has their own take), Catalina tends to focus more on sailing performance, Hunter on creature comforts, and O'Day kind of split the difference. On ANY used boat, regardless of the manufacturer, the biggest thing you need to look for is how well it has been maintained. In some cases, a certain Mac will be a better boat than a Catalina, etc. if the Catalina hasn't been well maintained.

You keep jumping back to the "50HP engine". Most sailboats have displacement hulls. That means that their shape precludes them from ever getting "on plane" and thus going "fast". Most sailboats (except sailing dinghies, catamarans, etc.) max out at between 5 and 10 knots. You simply cannot push the boat to go much faster, regardless of how big the engine is. That being said, MacGregor, Lancer, and a few others have produced some motor-sailors. They are boats that can be used as powerboats when you want to (e.g., to tow skiers) and sailboats when you want. But they are almost universally panned as being not particularly good at either thing. That is, as a power boat, they go slow, don't maneuver as well, and the sail rigging gets in the way. And as a sailboat, the hull design that is required to allow it to work as a powerboat really doesn't let it sail well. All that being said, MacGregor sold a lot of those, and they are "great" boats for a certain segment of the market. If you're sure you fall into that segment, then they could be fun. But remember that, when you go to resell, most prospective buyers will be in the market for either a sailboat or a power boat, so you're going to have to wait for another "you" to come along before she'll sell.
 
#10 · (Edited)
bcbrad, welcome aboard.

One thing you may notice here is a lot of recommendations for boats that we don't see too often up here. For example, for every Catalina 25 on the market in my area, there are 10 C&C 24s. For every Oday 23, there are 10 Grampian 23s, etc.,

What is your purchase budget for the boat and trailer? Where do you plan to sail her. These are two very important questions which have a great bearing on what boat you should buy.

a Macgregor 25/26D or S series will suit your needs- light, easy and quick to rig, designed for trailer sailing, relatively comfortable. If you can find a Halman 20/Nordica20 or a Matilda, these are also great Canadian trailer sailers.

Here's a good shopping resource, for info at a glance: http://sailquest.com/market/models/index.htm
 
#11 ·
Thanks jim that was a very clear answer, because I know nothing about sailing I saw the 50hp as a possible safty line, again I have never sailed and know nothing about the stright of Georgia I thought it would be a vaid question for safty for a newby. But if your saying that a smaller eng. is fine for that type of sailing location im more op to find a good sailboat that ill be much happier with two years down the road (after learning how to sail ;))
 
#22 ·
West Wight Potter 19. Might be just about the perfect PNW trailer sailer.
https://sites.google.com/site/2001wwp19/

With your relatively light towing capacity, you are going to need a boat that has an "advertised" weight well under the limit. by the time you add gear, and an outboard, and fuel, and water and ... it doesn't take long to add another 500-750 lbs of stuff.

Because everything is smaller on a WWP 19 than a macgregor 22/25/26, setup goes faster- the mast goes up quicker, the stays and shroud installation and tensioning is quicker, and no water ballast to play with.Plus, it is short enough, with trailer to stroe IN the garage during the winter making it a whole lote easier to work on boat projects...and there are always boat projects.
 
#13 · (Edited)
They aren't silly questions. I've been following and searching some of the discussions on boats in that size range. I'm probably at least a year away from buying anything myself.

They're starting to blur together for me as well. ;)

I'm not sure if you're talking about a 22ft MacGregor or the 26 footer you mentioned earlier (the one with the 50 hp motor).

MacGregor appears to be aiming their boats at people like you and me. We want something big enough to be comfortable for spending a few nights on, yet light enough to be easily launched and trailered by something like a mid-sized SUV.

You don't get that without making some compromises. With the 26X and 26M (the motor sailers), MacGregor does that by using water ballast, thinner fiberglass, more spartan interiors, and in some cases lighter duty rigging than other boats. It's for these reasons that some people avoid them. I think MacGregor's argument would be that other boats are overbuilt and are heavier than they need to be. On the plus side, the MacGregors have positive flotation, - they can't be sunk even if filled completely with water.

From what I can tell Cat 22s are popular because they do a reasonable job of filling that niche but they are still more like a traditional sailboat and they have stood the test of time. They've been around for decades but are still in production so it is easy to find parts and other boats if you're interested in racing.

One thing to check on regarding your Jeep's towing capacity... We have a mid sized SUV and the limit for standard loads is 3500 but 4500 for boats.

MacGregor isn't the only once to use a water ballast system. One downside is that boats that use it rather than a weighted center board or keel is that they will "heel" more readily. This may freak out your wife until she gets used to it. Pretty much any monohull will heel noticeably in a stiff breeze so you're not really going to avoid it.
 
#16 ·
Stick your arm out the window of a vehicle going about 60 or 70 mph and you'll know why. Boats are more aerodynamic than something like a camper trailer. Air resistance is one of the bigger forces your vehicle has to overcome. That being said, you want to stay under that weight limit unless you don't mind replacing transmissions every few years.
 
#18 ·
Im abit lost on your comment shnool. If your thinking im posting this thread for some kind of entertainment, that would very incorrect. Ive just been posted here and have never been near water in my life, im just learning how to get the most out of it.
 
#19 · (Edited)
I can completely understand your logic. I grew up around power boats, so the whole idea of a 9.9HP, or (as was on my Catalina originally) an 8HP pushing a 25' boat seemed crazy. But the 8HP Honda and 9.9HP Tohatsu that I had on that boat pushed her to and above theoretical hull speed at about half throttle. That gave me a lot of reserved "oomph" for if I was fighting a headwind or a current. For reference, my nearly 11,000 lb Allmand has a 16HP diesel inboard.

So, having sorted some of the confusion out, Jones's questions are perfect, as are some of your answers. A $15,000 budget is a reasonable budget. On a smaller boat, like a 22, that will get you something new-ish (maybe into the 1990's), on a 25-27, that will get you something with a 1980's vintage.

Unfortunately, what you're going to struggle with (and we all do) is finding the boat that truly meets your needs. One of the tough things right now is that, as a novice (again, I was there 2 years ago, too) you don't REALLY know what you want. You may think you do, but with all due respect, that will likely change.

Trailerable boats are great, and there are a lot of people for whom they are a perfect fit. The idea of being able to head off to different sailing destinations on a moment's notice is cool! As is the ability to travel REALLY far (e.g., across the country, or even down to the US) with the boat is pretty neat. A trip that would take many days in my boat is a relatively short drive away (for example, it took us 3 days to go about 200 miles when we did the delivery of the Allmand a few months ago). That significantly opens up your sailing area. Plus, with the boat on the trailer, you have her close to home to make repairs/maintenance, and you don't have to pay storage fees or slip fees (assuming you have the room at home).

But there's also a down-side to a trailerable boat. The first is the time you'll need to set her up and to break her down. Someone mentioned 45 minutes for a 22' boat, and that's generally what I've seen others say. For a 25, I typically heard an hour, once you're good at it. So, your typical day will be get up, hitch up the trailer, inspect the tires, brakes, etc., then tow the boat to the lake/ocean. Find a ramp that is deep enough for you to launch (depending on keel size/type, this may not be as big of an issue), then get in line to launch. Spend an hour rigging the boat. Stow everything. Launch the boat, then park the tow vehicle. Go sail, make sure you're back in time to have daylight while you get your car and wait in line to pull her from the water. Haul the boat, wash her down, break everything down (again, about an hour or so). If there is a bad turn in the weather, you're stuck breaking it down in the rain/wind. If something happens at the ramp, you're stuck in line for a long time. Then you get to drive home while towing a long, sometimes awkward load behind you. Then you have to park the boat in her "home".

If you're day sailing, you're looking at losing easily 2-3 hours of your day doing the "trailer thing" and that may get old quickly. That's why many trailer sailors go for the weekend, or longer. But (generally) the smaller the boat, the less comfortable it will be to sleep aboard. The bigger the boat, the harder it is to trailer and launch. As you'll hear here a lot, in boating, everything is a compromise.

Some trailer sailors LOVE it, and never want to give it up. For some, the idea of setting up and breaking down the boat gets old, and they look at other options. One is, of course, renting a slip. That's typically the most expensive option, but if you want shore power, it's really the only option (there are lots of threads on solar and wind power, if you're interested). The next less expensive options are moorings and keeping the boat rigged on a trailer at a marina/boat yard. Given what you've said your goals are in a boat, if you decide to stick with a trailerable boat, this last option may be advantageous. You find a marina in a place where you'll sail most regularly and you keep the boat out of the water when you aren't using it, but still avoid having to break it down and set it up every time. It can also be broken down and towed to other venues when you want to. You still won't have shore power, and if you overnight you'll need to anchor or rent a slip, but it's a nice compromise that lets you get on the water faster.

What I'd respectfully suggest, though, is that you don't know enough to start to understand the compromises involved, and your best bet is to go look at boats. And I don't just mean one or two, I mean 15-20. Look at 18'ers, 20's, 22's, 25's, and if you can find them, a few 27's. Look at what you get with the different sizes, and decide which size best meets your anticipated use. Sit in the 22's cabin, and imagine the two of you (or more, if you have kids) sleeping there and then waking the next morning; how do you prepare breakfast? How do you handle your morning routine (shower, shave, teeth, etc.)? Where is the head located; does it offer enough privacy for your wife? What if one of you needs to "go" during the night, does it require waking the other person before the head can be used? Sit in the cockpit - is it big enough for your wife to sit comfortably while you're working the tiller (since most boats in that size range don't have wheels)? If you plan on having guests regularly, is the cockpit big enough for everyone?

Once you've been aboard a bunch of boats, then think about your intended use again. As I said, for some a 22 is a PERFECT boat. For me, with my family, there's no way we could make that work. Although we liked the IDEA of trailering our boat, the time lost rigging and breaking down the boat was a non-starter for us because we have 2 young kids. They would be going nuts during that time, and it wouldn't wind up being an enjoyable time. Eventually, we accepted this fact and went with a slip, and then went with a bigger, more comfortable boat. A trailerable may be just the ticket for you, but I want to make sure you have a good sense of what will be involved, because the last thing I want is for you to buy something that becomes an albatross.

All that being said, go back and read Denise's first post - I think she covered almost all of that, and in far fewer words than I did.
 
#20 · (Edited)
MacGregor does tout the idea of a 50 hp motor being a safety feature, - you can get out of bad weather quicker, but the others are right. The hull design of a typical keel boat puts a cap on its speed and it's based on the length of the boat. A 26ft keel boat is only going to go so fast and it doesn't matter how big the engine is. MacGregor gets around this problem by using a planing hull design, a daggerboard, and water ballast that can be dumped while underway.

If you're really new to sailing and water activities in general, I think the idea of joining a sailing club or taking some classes is an excellent one. There's a standard class for beginning keel boat sailers called ASA-101. They would get you on the water in a boat about the size of what you're looking at. Might give you a better idea of what you want before you end up spending $15,000 on something you'll end up selling less than a year later for less than what you paid.

In your mind sailing is a peaceful activity. It certainly can be that way but not knowing what you're doing when the wind starts to pick up can make for a really bad experience. If your wife is nervous around water then you may only have one chance to get her to buy into the dream. Her first ride on a sailboat should really be with somebody who knows how to sail it or there's a good chance she'll never set foot on one again.

Just to give you an example, my brother's boat was one he originally purchased with a buddy of his. It's a 23 foot Ensign. My brother knows how to sail but his buddy really didn't though he'd been out with my brother a number of times. Anyway, this guy decides to bring his two young daughter's out on the boat one day. The wind picks up, so they head back. They manage to get back into the bay but somehow ended up way too close to shore and snagged some power lines with the mast. Knocked the power out to a couple of houses but luckily he and his daughters (and the boat) were fine. If I had to guess I'd say that he probably had figured out how to sail the boat, but not how to stop it.

My brother became the sole owner of that boat shortly thereafter. The power lines ended up getting moved as well which was a good thing.
 
#21 ·
Hey Brad welcome

My truck is rated to tow 3500 lbs. In the real world the Catalina 22 we have, with gear on a trailer is all she can handle. I wish I could get a Cat 25, but I don't want to buy a heavy truck that gets 10 mpg. I think the 22 is okay for an overnight or two and its a lot of fun to sail. 5 hp pushes the boat at max hull speed, around 7 mph. Good luck
 
#23 · (Edited)
If I can just as this one last question out of the most mentioned trailer sailers so far mentioned in the 19-24 foot range, what would you guy/gals personally pick for sailing accross the Stright of Georgia (my wife loves Vancouver, and we live on Vancouver island and im trying to enjoy it just was much) assuming that ive taken lession and somewhat exp. What would you feel most safe in....as it gets fairy windy here ? This answer would really help me in keeping my eye out for the correct boats when they come up for sale..ill be use to look at many type but I dont want to buy a M26 and then try to sail across and people look at me like I have a death wish lol
 
#25 ·
...what would you guy/gals personally pick for sailing accross the Stright of Georgia (my wife loves Vancouver, and we live on Vancouver island and im trying to enjoy it just was much)...What would you feel most safe in....as it gets fairy windy here ?
As was mentioned above, MacGregors don't exactly have a great reputation for high build quality or high-end components. They build to a price point, and as long as you understand what that is, and your use case meets the build of the boat, then they can be fine. For example, if you live in Arizona and do mostly lake sailing, they can be a perfectly adequate choice. That being said, watch the video on this site:

http://www.macgregor26.com/index/gale_2_min.htm

That's a MacGregor 26 out in Southern California in gale force winds. There's a common saying here, that the boat will outlast the crew, and I think that video helps prove the point. Now, would I want to cross an ocean in a Mac26? No. Wouldn't want to do it in a stock Catalina 25 either. There are too many things that can go wrong, and with the risk of being exposed to REALLY nasty weather for several days in a row without being able to seek shelter, those just aren't the boats I'd pick. That being said, it's nice to know that even a boat with purportedly poor/mediocre build quality can survive being in those conditions for a while.

Unfortunately, I have no experience with your proposed sailing area. That looks like a big body of water, though, so I can see how the wind could build depending on the direction. Of course, you're smart enough not to intentionally go out in really nasty weather, so what you're looking at is a boat that can take a beating from a freak storm that might come up. I think most boats will meet those needs. But, if you want a good barometer, look on Kajiji or eBay for the boats that are for sale in your area and in your desired size range. The ones that you frequently see for sale will PROBABLY be fine for your intended use. In my area, that's the Catalina 22-30, and some Hunters, O'Days, and Irwins. Once I identified those, I read the owner review forums (here and on other sites), and helped affirm that the boat I was looking at (the C25) would keep my family and me safe, and she did. She even survived a hurricane. Or at least she would have, if the tugboat hadn't sunken in the slip next to us and listed into our slip.
 
#24 ·
I had a Catalina {Jaguar ] 22 Trailer sailer and happily stayed aboard with a friend for weekends. I have a few thoughts for you.

I am not sure I could have managed to raise a mast that was much bigger. Sure with three people it gets to be easier but with on or two I am not so sure.

Anything bigger than 20 ft a 4 wheel trailer is good. On any size having side guide poles makes things MUCH easier on recovery.

On 22 ft 6 to 8 hp is fine.

I would look for something that will resell easily as it is likely that if you get bitten you will want something different [bigger racy etc] after a couple of years.
 
#26 ·
bcbrad, Let me approach this from a little different tack! My feeling is that your tow vehicle's limitations vs your intended usage for the boat are at odds. I have read all of the posts and there is much good advice contained within. My question is whether you want to sail with your life partner or NOT! If she is already not kindly disposed toward the water, you need to make her feel safe and COMFORTABLE. I doubt that it's going to happen in a really small boat. Something that you need to understand is that interior space in a sailboat increases geometrically with an increase in length. Example: a well designed 25' boat will have twice the interior space of a 21 footer. Think female ie: her nest! Comfort and safety. A decent galley and toilet arrangements! Get her involved in the boat search. I assure you that she will have perspectives that have never occurred to you. Recommendations: At least a 25' boat / decent galley with counter space / enclosed head with pressure hand shower / foldable dodger for spray protection / tow vehicle capable of 6000 lbs (older Chevy Suburban with lots of carrying space) / tandem trailer with brakes, tongue extension & keel guide. Plan on trips of several days unless you spring for moorage due to the set up / tear down time mentioned. Give the wife sailing lessons to get her involved at the outset. "Ain't Momma happy, ain't nobody happy!" Best of Luck! You've got a beautiful area of the world to sail in! George
 
#27 ·
Sailing across the Strait of Georgia in a trailerable sailboat? I'm going to second the recommendation of gts1544 that "you're going to need a bigger boat!" My recommendation is based not just on comfort, but also on the conditions you will encounter should your sailing take you across the Straits of Georgia, Haro, and/or San Juan de Fuca. There are some challenging tides/currents in the region, and I would favor an inboard diesel over an outboard hanging off the transom that is typical of trailerable boats. (Working against a strong current in boxy waves with the prop cavitating is not a desirable situation, an inboard is going to keep the prop underwater.) Also, I'd prefer a fin keel and some real ballast - and both make trailering - launching - retrieving difficult. If I were to pick an ideal boat for these conditions it would be an Islander 28, a C & C 27 or 29, or a Cal or Ericson of the same length. And those boats are not trailerable - they belong in a slip.

If your ambitions are a bit more modest - like daysailing and occasional weekending, rather than venturing all around the PNW - and you are committed to trailering, I would look at the Compac Eclipse or Horizon Cat for the simple reason that it is so easy to raise and lower the mast. Put an extra-long shaft outboard on the transom; Tohatsu makes them under several brand names. (I've seen some Horizon Cats advertised with inboard diesels, but on newer and therefore $$$ boats.) These are well-made boats that are comfortable, stable, and easy to manage.
 
#29 · (Edited)
I think you were being a bit too quick to judge. In Denise's defense, the OP mentioned a Mac with a 50HP engine. Do any of the non-powersailers have 50HP engines? Where in this thread, except for the comments about the powersailers, has anyone said outright NOT to buy a Mac? As the owner of a Mac 25, would YOU recommend the powersailer to any/everyone?

Even in the part that you quoted, if you read in the punctuation that I believe Denise intended (we all make typos here), I think what she was saying was:

No. Mac = McGregor. Motor sailers [again, implied by the OP's reference to a 50HP engine] are a love hate thing. Not a true sailboat not a true power boat. But they have a cult like group of owners that love them
How does "cult like group of owners that love them" equate to Mac = no?
 
#30 · (Edited)
Jim,

Not judging, just clarifying. I read the post, he asked about seeing 50HP outboards and asked about the relative safety between that and a 9.9. He could be seeing both M26S and X or Ms and that would be very confusing at first. I was clarifying that the model needs to be specific to determine what is being discussed. When a person new to the sport hears very general negative information regarding a brand it needs to be specific as they might not know the context. Other brands have been in this situation, Tartan and Hunter comes to mind. When the OP is new, I think giving as specific info as possible without being verbose (way too late for me as usual) helps. I know it did for me when I started.

Just as an aside, I think this is one of the reasons for the popularity of the "Interesting Sailboats" thread. It is very specific and detailed and encourages that from its participants. PCP does a great job of keeping details accurate to prevent confusion.

And the cult thing wasn't what I was referring to in general. But, have someone refer to something you love as "cult" and some may not consider it a compliment.

Sorry if I seemed too sharp but I hope Denise will forgive. I just knew that when I was new and asking questions, many responses assumed base knowledge that I didn't have and I had to "unlearn" some "facts" that I had picked up.

Here are some smiles just to keep things happy :D :D :D :D :D
 
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