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Liveaboard Family Looking for a Miracle

62K views 274 replies 56 participants last post by  elspru 
#1 ·
I am wondering whether there is someone out there near MD with a boat that is going to waste due to, perhaps, just a busy lifestyle. Maybe that person could afford to pay it forward, so to speak, to a family in need. My husband, toddlers and i live aboard a 27 foot boat. It is very old, but we love it more than any life on land. It is a long story as to how we arrived here, but we are grateful to have a roof over our heads and our family intact. We can no longer use our credit, as we lost everything during bad times. The important thing is that we are together and happy, yet the harsh reality remains that our old boat is just that. Our transom is rotting and our core is definitely wet with all of our leaks. We can no longer move the boat because it puts too much stress on the transom, causing water to come in rapidly. If we could get any type of loan we would be fine, but as i said, we no longer have that luxury. We cannot even get a loan to replace our dilapidated vehicles which are on their last legs. Call me crazy or what you will for this post, but I am just a mother and wife trying to save her family. My husband works hard to take care of us, but as many of you may know, when you sink down into a hole financially, it can be nearly impossible to get back out again. If our home ends up at the bottom of the drink, we will truly have nothing left. If you can be of any help at all, it would be appreciated more than you will ever know. Thanks for reading this post. I can only hope for a miracle.
 
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#2 ·
Exactly what are you looking for? A free boat??? Help fixing the boat you have?? Just curious, what kind of boat are you, your husband and the toddlers living aboard currently? How did it get into such bad shape—certainly that did not happen overnight? Why did you not address the issue prior to it becoming such an issue, especially given that this boat is also your home??
 
#81 ·
Mokusiga-

Buh-bye... I'd point out that back in post #2, I asked Tiaraswake a series of simple questions, most of which were never answered. I'll quote the post here.

Exactly what are you looking for? A free boat??? Help fixing the boat you have?? Just curious, what kind of boat are you, your husband and the toddlers living aboard currently? How did it get into such bad shape-certainly that did not happen overnight? Why did you not address the issue prior to it becoming such an issue, especially given that this boat is also your home??
She never said what she was looking for.

She never asked for help fixing her current boat, which is a far more reasonable request than asking for a free boat.

She never posted photos of the boat in question or the transom or did anything that might help solve her problem.

She never said what kind of boat she, her husband and two toddlers were living on.

She never really addressed how this boat came to be in such bad shape that it is at risk of sinking shortly.

Here are all of her replies:

Let me first say that I am not trying to save a "lifestyle". My family hit hard financial times. Our cars were repossessed, our home foreclosed, etc. We moved so that my husband could start at another job. We cannot afford rent in this area so the cheapest thing is to live aboard. We survive much cheaper than any apartment would ever allow. Living on land would be four or five times more expensive here, at least. Secondly, we bought this boat with the only bit of money we had, because we couldn't afford an apartment. We knew nothing about boats and were told that the boat was in good shape by the previous owner. We believed him, in part because we were living in a tent and we needed a roof over our heads. That is why this issue with the transom exists. We didn't know the boat was going bad, but we needed somewhere to live.
We certainly aren't living an exotic lifestyle, and cannot live any more frugally than we already do, so that is not an option. We do not eat out or go out or anything. We get groceries each week and that is it. Please do not assume that I am just someone who doesn't want to give up some glamorous lifestyle. We live in a space as big as some people's bathrooms. We have lost everything and are only trying to get by.
Nice sob story, but doesn't answer any of the questions, nor give any information regarding the boat.

We have done plenty of work on this boat ourselves already.We are eager to learn and have had good times fixing things together. We have put some money into the boat and are good about keeping up with what it needs, however, the leaking transom means that in turn, our core is probably wet and would require either the inside or the outside of the boat to be ripped apart for a whole overhaul. Another boat does not mean that it would end up being junk in the long run because we do take care of things. It just so happens that this problem is far too expensive. I realize that people are trying to give good advice as far as moving to land, but these same people don't realize how cheap it is to live on the water. Even with insurance and slip fees, we don't pay much at all/ Rent in this area runs between 1600 and $2000 a month. Slip and insurance and electric costs us only 500 a month. So you can see that an apartment would not be within our reach. Now, before anyone tells me that we should live somewhere cheaper, let me say that there are not a lot of companies in my husband's line of work, so we go where the job is.
Fixing a leaking transom isn't necessarily an expensive repair. I've done it on a couple of boats. Yes, it would require the boat's aft end being taken apart a while..but saying that it is just too expensive to do without saying what boat it is or what else is wrong with it is just more sob story. Note, she doesn't say what her husband's line of work is, just that there aren't many companies that do it... and that they have to "go where the job is". Again, nice sob story, but AFAICT, there hasn't be any real investigation on what the actual problem with the transom is... just her say so, without any elaboration on how she came to the conclusions that it is "too expensive". Also, she says that the core is probably wet-if she had investigated the problem, she should know that it either is wet or it isn't. If it isn't, it may not be that big a problem.

A lot of the work we do for the boat doesn't cost us anything anyways, because my husband does a lot of things himself, as far as zincs go, and other things under the water. Even with maintenance, it is really cheap, and that was what we needed. Owning a house only gaurantees that someday the roof will need replaced, the water heater will go, etc. We have already been there and done those things. Believe me when i say that this is cheaper, unless of course you have a 60 footer, two deckhands and a boat yard to pay every time you need to pull it.
Again, lots of sob story here....but NO SUBSTANTIAL FACTS OF ANY SORT.

This whole thing is pretty ridiculous. I never expected anything to really come from the post, but it made me feel better temporarily. I am not going to try to convince people that boat living is cheaper. People are set in their own ways and will believe what they want, but the truth is, Tager knows what i am talking about, and so do the many people that live in this marina. Many of them were forced here because they hit hard times. It doesn't have to be expensive. Sure, it can be, but it doesn't have to be. I would spend more on an engine for a piece of crap RV that I know nothing about either, and i would have nowhere to park it or to get electric hook-ups. We have been living aboard for a year now, and we have learned a lot. The beautiful thing is that people in this atmosphere are friendlier than any in any neighborhood i have ever lived. They treat each other like family. When one person needs something, chances are that you can find someone who will offer to help you out or even barter services. It just so happens that we got a bad boat, so that fix would be expensive, but there is no way we would ever be able to spend nearly two grand a month on an apartment. Our fixes have only ever cost us a couple bucks at a time. Ok, so I am still trying to say that the boat is cheaper, but that wasn't my intention this time. People don't really know how bad things get until it actually happens. When you are sitting beneath the trees in a fabric enclosure with lightning and rain pouring down and your kids looking terrified, you have to change your thinking a bit. When you are in an expensive place, with your family in other states and very few companies to search for work, you have to find a means to survive. That is what we did. We coudn't think too much about years down the road and whether or not our old boat would still be floating or even whether it would be big enough to sleep our kids. We needed to get out of the rain and the boat was our only option. I wish that no one would ever go through what we did, but that is really the only way for people to understand. In the same aspect, no one knows about living aboard until they do it. The people that live here certainly aren't rich. I guess that's all. I'm sure i'll remember something else i wanted to say and have to post again.
AGAIN, mostly sob story, no real facts. Note, that her "friendly people who treat each other like family" obviously aren't taking care of TW or her family all that well.

Oh, yeah, and another boat wouldn't end up in the same situation as this. I never said that we couldn't afford to do any maintenance, because we have. Regular maintenance, which we can afford due to cheap living and helpful neighbors, has been done; inexpensively i might add. The problem lies in that we cannot afford a major overhaul to replace the transom and probably the core. Regular maintenance would have avoided this issue if the previous owners would have done their part, therefore backing up the whole "cheaper" issue. They did not though, and the boat was neglected. So, another boat does not mean that it would fall apart because we are neglectful. We live here. We would not let it go, just as we did not let this one go. Our problem exists only because someone wanted to make a buck and leave out the details.
Basically, all this post is saying is "We want a free boat, and all the problems with our current boat are because of the previous owner..." Yeah, right... if they had not let the boat "go", why is the transom leaking and so expensive to fix.... Note, again there are NO DETAILS of any sort.

While Dave's offer back in post #10 was quite generous, AFAICT, TW never replied to it. I'd point out that none of TW's posts contain anything like facts about what kind of boat they live on, or photos of the transom, leading me to believe that the boat does not in fact exist. I've seen way too many people try to take advantage of the goodness of others to not be cynical-I'd be far less cynical if there were more facts and less sob story to TW's posts. But, TW didn't see fit to reply with any substantial facts about her boat, her problem or assist in any way to repair it...aside from asking for a free boat.
 
#5 ·
Check Craigslist often and also have a look at goodoldboat.com sometimes boats come up for next to nothing or even free

Just some practical advice....

If you are really on hard times then on-the-water is the last place you want to be with kids - even if you love the "lifestyle." Lifestyle is something to think about when necessity has bean dealt with.
I'm not being judgmental at all - just offering another point of view - As much as I love my boat, if it were not in good shape I would not risk something happening to my family in it - I'd rather be in a camper where the worst that can happen is that I get wet - as opposed to drown.

Best of luck and I hope that the hard times come to an end soon

Tom
 
#6 ·
I am very sorry to hear that you are undergoing hard times. I understand as I have been there- really. It sucks and with young kids, its even worse. I know this from first hand experience.

That being said, when you truly are in hard times and you want to save your family, the first thing you have to do to move forward is to cut your lifestyle. I know you love it, but I also liked having my little house, cable, internet and food. I had to cut back to no cable, no internet, a one room apartment and working 80+ hours a week as a single mom. I did this for four years and it sucked- big time but my kids were well cared for and it was absolutely necessary. Now we are able to think about what type of lifestyle we would "love".

I'm not trying to beat you up, I'm trying to offer you hope. You are not trying to save your family, you are trying to save your lifestyle- big difference and you shouldn't lose site of this. Your family will remain intact whether you are on a boat or living in an apartment planning to live on a boat in the future. If you can not make your boat livable and safe, sell it. Make a plan to move ashore until things improve. Work hard, live frugally and save. If you do this, you will eventually get to move back on to the water in a boat which is fit for purpose. Yes, it will be hard but the things we work hard and suffer for are the things which have the most value.

Wishing you all the best.
 
#7 ·
very well said Mimsy. :) Pretty wise for a leadmine owner. :) :p :D
I am very sorry to hear that you are undergoing hard times. I understand as I have been there- really. It sucks and with young kids, its even worse. I know this from first hand experience.

That being said, when you truly are in hard times and you want to save your family, the first thing you have to do to move forward is to cut your lifestyle. I know you love it, but I also liked having my little house, cable, internet and food. I had to cut back to no cable, no internet, a one room apartment and working 80+ hours a week as a single mom. I did this for four years and it sucked- big time but my kids were well cared for and it was absolutely necessary. Now we are able to think about what type of lifestyle we would "love".

I'm not trying to beat you up, I'm trying to offer you hope. You are not trying to save your family, you are trying to save your lifestyle- big difference and you shouldn't lose site of this. Your family will remain intact whether you are on a boat or living in an apartment planning to live on a boat in the future. If you can not make your boat livable and safe, sell it. Make a plan to move ashore until things improve. Work hard, live frugally and save. If you do this, you will eventually get to move back on to the water in a boat which is fit for purpose. Yes, it will be hard but the things we work hard and suffer for are the things which have the most value.

Wishing you all the best.
 
#8 ·
Tiara's Reply

Let me first say that I am not trying to save a "lifestyle". My family hit hard financial times. Our cars were repossessed, our home foreclosed, etc. We moved so that my husband could start at another job. We cannot afford rent in this area so the cheapest thing is to live aboard. We survive much cheaper than any apartment would ever allow. Living on land would be four or five times more expensive here, at least. Secondly, we bought this boat with the only bit of money we had, because we couldn't afford an apartment. We knew nothing about boats and were told that the boat was in good shape by the previous owner. We believed him, in part because we were living in a tent and we needed a roof over our heads. That is why this issue with the transom exists. We didn't know the boat was going bad, but we needed somewhere to live.
We certainly aren't living an exotic lifestyle, and cannot live any more frugally than we already do, so that is not an option. We do not eat out or go out or anything. We get groceries each week and that is it. Please do not assume that I am just someone who doesn't want to give up some glamorous lifestyle. We live in a space as big as some people's bathrooms. We have lost everything and are only trying to get by.
 
#9 ·
While I understand your situation and your motivations, I would reinforce the points made above and offer the advise that any boat is going to be more expensive to maintain than any accommodation on shore. Absent the ability to maintain it's insatiable needs, any boat will soon assume the condition of the one you now reside upon. In my opinion, you would be far better served by even a motorhome in even dilapidated condition.
 
#10 ·
I think you are looking for a boat/home and not a bunch of free advice/opinions.

This said I think I can help you out. I know of a boat that is 29.5' has a refer, running diesel engine, sails, radar, etc. It's not clean or tidy at the moment, but until the owner died it was well maintained. Since it's been stored on the hard and even has a fresh coat of bottom paint. It's located in CT and you could probably get it for next to free and with your story likely free. I'll provide you info on how to get in contact with the owner. Send me an email or PM or check out my website for other contact options.
 
#11 ·
People who say that living aboard is more expensive than living on land need to take a look at the numbers.

Seattle Area: Cheapest room in a co-op house: $399 + utilities

Liveaboard Moorage: $350 incl utilities

So... as much as you think that you are giving good advice about the moving onto land part, you may not be!

I really hope you get the new/free boat! I was raised in a trailer, and I turned out okay!
 
#12 ·
People who say that living aboard is more expensive than living on land need to take a look at the numbers.

Seattle Area: Cheapest room in a co-op house: $399 + utilities

Liveaboard Moorage: $350 incl utilities

So... as much as you think that you are giving good advice about the moving onto land part, you may not be!
Tager, If only it was as easy as just paying moorage buddy......

Respectfully, I think your talking crap. The point the 'people' above are making are that boats are maintenance intensive.......this means a continued outlay of money.

You don't just get to 'live' on a boat....
 
#13 ·
I think living on a boat can be inexpensive, but it means doing a lot of work yourself, which very few people actually do - people say they want to do things themselves, even read up on how to do it themselves, even waste money buying tools to do it themselves, but then when the day comes most people will find some lame excuse not to do it and pay the $$$$$$$.

You CAN find a sand bar and wait for the tide to go out, careen your boat over and get your ass out there and work on the bottom without ever handing anybody a single zinc penny to do anything for you, but its a rare and salty sailor who will actually do that. In the end, most will pay the $$$$$$$ and have the boat put on the hard for them, or even pay someone else to do the work for them - you pay for every one of those little conveniences, and in boat world you often pay BIG.
 
#17 ·
$45. to $ 69/ foot in season where I am. If you moor in state waters, there is no fee, and you row or motor a ding.

Regardless, seems that discussion is another thread. Over the years, I know many people who have been gifted boats. However you've reached your decision, I wish you and your family well.
 
#18 ·
I wasn't trying to say you were living an extravagant lifestyle, but the cost of maintaining a boat and the insurance required by marinas is what kills most budgets. If you are sailing anywhere near other people, you need to have liability at the minimum to protect yourself. That's not a luxury in the US, that's a necessity. People here are ridiculoulsy litigious. I would think an RV or trailer could be had for far less maintainence costs.

If you end up getting a gift boat, God bless and take care. I just hope that you don't find yourself in a similar situation due to a lack of maintainence in a couple years time. I want to see you and your family move ahead, not tread water. It can be done, it just sucks big time when you are in the midst of it.
 
#19 ·
We have done plenty of work on this boat ourselves already.We are eager to learn and have had good times fixing things together. We have put some money into the boat and are good about keeping up with what it needs, however, the leaking transom means that in turn, our core is probably wet and would require either the inside or the outside of the boat to be ripped apart for a whole overhaul. Another boat does not mean that it would end up being junk in the long run because we do take care of things. It just so happens that this problem is far too expensive. I realize that people are trying to give good advice as far as moving to land, but these same people don't realize how cheap it is to live on the water. Even with insurance and slip fees, we don't pay much at all/ Rent in this area runs between 1600 and $2000 a month. Slip and insurance and electric costs us only 500 a month. So you can see that an apartment would not be within our reach. Now, before anyone tells me that we should live somewhere cheaper, let me say that there are not a lot of companies in my husband's line of work, so we go where the job is.
 
#20 ·
A lot of the work we do for the boat doesn't cost us anything anyways, because my husband does a lot of things himself, as far as zincs go, and other things under the water. Even with maintenance, it is really cheap, and that was what we needed. Owning a house only gaurantees that someday the roof will need replaced, the water heater will go, etc. We have already been there and done those things. Believe me when i say that this is cheaper, unless of course you have a 60 footer, two deckhands and a boat yard to pay every time you need to pull it.
 
#21 ·
I understand completely staying where the job is. I understand completely that rent is expensive. What I don't understand is how you can in one breath say you know next to nothing about marine maintenance but are "eager to learn" and yet try to state that it is less expensive to live on a boat with the associated costs than it would be to live in an RV. or trailer. It is only less expensive to live on a boat than it is to live on an RV if you do not do regular maintenence.

An RV or trailer would absolutely, 100% be less expensive. Even if you do the work yourself, the parts that are of suitable material for a marine environment are much, much more expensive than those you can use on land.

Look, I'm really not trying to beat you up and I hope that something wonderful comes your way. I'm coming at this from a place of concern. If it happens that you are gifted a boat, I'm happy for you and your family. I'm just afraid that you do not have a realistic view to the hidden costs of boat ownership. My fear is that you will be given a boat and it will eventually be a curse, not a gift.
 
#25 ·
tager,

You sound like MacGyver. I hope you're not saying we could all get our standing rigging replaced for something like $40 and the fact that you did it once, you don't mean to say: you'll be able to duplicate the bargain the next time you need it replaced. Which maybe sooner than normal.

Anyway the OP is pretty vague. Obviously a gift of a boat or free use of a boat would be cheaper than anything, initially. And hey, if you can do it once you might be able to do it again.

However, using the all things being equal approach to logic tells me a low end rental would be cheaper than a sinking boat. It May not be cheaper than a gifted boat, but then that would not be all things equal, would it?

Let's see: if the stove goes out, its the same. If the refer goes out, the same, the toilet same, Paying the utilities, same. Replacing the $40 rig, the $50 diesel, the thruhulls, the nav. lights, the any other boat part or system, Not the same! An apartment doesn't have them. As for the roof, that's the landlord's.

You can take any logical shortcut you want to justify the economics of a live-aboard, but it's just self delusion. Why encourage it?
 
#27 · (Edited)
tager,

You sound like MacGyver. I hope you're not saying we could all get our standing rigging replaced for something like $40 and the fact that you did it once, you don't mean to say: you'll be able to duplicate the bargain the next time you need it replaced. Which maybe sooner than normal.
You not only called Tager delusional, you managed to slip in a bust on his rigging job! :D

Anyway the OP is pretty vague. Obviously a gift of a boat or free use of a boat would be cheaper than anything, initially. And hey, if you can do it once you might be able to do it again.

However, using the all things being equal approach to logic tells me a low end rental would be cheaper than a sinking boat. It May not be cheaper than a gifted boat, but then that would not be all things equal, would it?

Let's see: if the stove goes out, its the same. If the refer goes out, the same, the toilet same, Paying the utilities, same. Replacing the $40 rig, the $50 diesel, the thruhulls, the nav. lights, the any other boat part or system, Not the same! An apartment doesn't have them. As for the roof, that's the landlord's.

You can take any logical shortcut you want to justify the economics of a live-aboard, but it's just self delusion. Why encourage it?
Your all things equal argument is fine, but you are using faulty assumptions as a premise. Ceteris Paribus, with all things equal everyone has the ability to get online and ask for help when they need it, with all things being equal anyone can learn to do rigging themselves and borrow tools from each other to get the job done, all things being equal learning to do things yourself can be an effective survival strategy, we don't always have to pay people to do things for us just because there are people there to pay, etc. If everything in the world were market driven no woman could ever get her mom to watch the kids on a Saturday night ...

Joshua Slocum didn't need no damn help fixing his rigging ...
 
#26 ·
Respectfully, Really?

Ok I know I'm off topic, but where I come from, the word respectfully is usually followed by "I beg to differ" or " I have to disagree"
Saying "respectfully, you're full of crap" is redundant, you're obviously showing no respect.
You may as well say "shut up, you f****ng moron"
Just let it out, if that's what you're thinking.
Respectfully, JD.

P.S. I know I'm kind of cynical, but this thread kind of reminds me of the guy who wanted a free boat to get back to Jersey or somewhere to see his family. Dude needed to stop posting to websites and go home.
 
#32 ·
Ok I know I'm off topic, but where I come from, the word respectfully is usually followed by "I beg to differ" or " I have to disagree"
Saying "respectfully, you're full of crap" is redundant, you're obviously showing no respect.
You may as well say "shut up, you f****ng moron"
Just let it out, if that's what you're thinking.
Respectfully, JD.
I'm not where you come from.....

I do like to talk plainly, if I disagree with someone I would prefer to just come out and say it.........I intentionally added respectfully in an attempt to show Tager, that It wasn't personal, or an attack on him.....but I do strongly disagree with what he was saying. Honestly?? I would say happily say the same thing honestly to my Dad.

Really coming down to it telling someone their talking Crap and saying I beg to differ is stating the same point isn't it???

Now 'shut up. you f**** moron' I think is quite different from what i said, and no it wasn't what I was thinking. What I was thinking was Tager respectfully( as in no offense intended, dont take it personally) I think your talking crap....

Obviously it didn't work cause he, and apparently now you did take it personally. so I do apologize, it wasn't mean't that way.

Tager, if you are truly living aboard as frugally as you state then good luck to you. You state in another thread that your tender is 'a piece of foam', I would love you to elaborate!
 
#28 ·
magic,

You missed my point. Even an extreme example of a $40 re-rig is more than $0 for an apartment that has no rig, etc, etc. Maybe this is also a faulty assumption, but I don't think we're talking about someone like Josh Slocum here. Do you?

Everything else in you post is right on.:laugher
 
#29 ·
magic,

You missed my point. Even an extreme example of a $40 re-rig is more than $0 for an apartment that has no rig, etc, etc. Maybe this is also a faulty assumption, but I don't think we're talking about someone like Josh Slocum here. Do you?

Everything else in you post is right on.:laugher
You know, I did actually miss that part, I didn't see that your argument was the economics of land vs. water, I thought your argument was consumerism vs. minimalism. :)

I won't take the land vs. water argument because it is less expensive to live on land, all things being equal. :D
 
#33 · (Edited)
Elaborating.... my tender is a peice of foam.

Wind magic. Thank you for approaching this so amiably. I have to say that I wholeheartedly agree. To the average man and woman, living on land is better, which is why most people do. I concede my point that living on water is cheaper than living on land, but I will say that for ME it is cheaper. For the OP it may be cheaper as well. I just want people to accept that living on water is not GPS units and Santana DVX Champagne all day every day. It can be cheap.

Challo3. I am not talking crap. I am talking from personal experience. I live on my own boat. The outlay for my boat was less than first, last, and deposit at a small apartment in my area. I also pay less in rent than somebody in an apartment. So I am not talking crap.
 
#61 · (Edited)
living on water is not GPS units and Santana DVX Champagne all day every day.
Tager's right you morons. I missed my bottle of DVX last Thursday because I had to dive for my Garmin. (It fell off my chunk of foam, while I was pouring another round of bubbles for my pals. It's hard to balance eight people on that thing AND pop corks!)

Seriously, you dudes need to back off Tiara. She's asking for a boat. Nothing wrong with that. And she says - FROM HER EXPERIENCE - that it's cheaper than a squat. So if you don't have an extra boat to throw into the kitty and/or if you don't have the multi-family housing price index for her specific zip code to prove your speculative blather - then give the lady some air.

Jeez. Looking for a miracle - and getting an overly pious smackdown instead. Same-ol'.
 
#37 ·
The latter! No, of course my chunk of foam does not plane, especially not in all conditions! Ha! Yes, of course it carries provisions and friends!

I really hope that you enjoy your "daring adventure". While blindly falling for yacht magazine dogma, like boats being expensive, and needing a dinghy that planes in "all wind conditions." A thing which, I assure you, does not exist.
 
#38 · (Edited)
Hey Tager,

Like I said above if your living that frugally and it is working for you then seriously I think that is great.

Now for what it is worth, my boat is a 27ft 1975 aussie design.....I only read one yachting magazine, not coincidentally the only one not full of of big pretty boats.

My dinghy doesn't plane either, I consider it a good day if it floats. It USED to be a 2.4m Zodiac in it's day. It is now a shadow of it's former glory and probably only a small step up from foam :)

I still want to see the world one day, or a large portion of it.........by yacht. For a man of my means to be able to do that then it will have to be a shoestring affair.
 
#39 ·
first off. as an outside source i think chall03 saying tager was talking crap was a little rediculous. I wont get into the what is cheaper living on land or a boat in this particular situation thing. but go over to the liveaboard magazine forums and search around for the what is cheaper threads. There are NUMEROUS accounts of people (with documented numbers and stories) who are proving it is cheaper to live on their boats than on land. Granted its not always the case and maybe its usually cheaper to live on land. But saying that tager is talking crap when there are hundreds of people who have run the numbers and save money by staying on their boats seems rediculous.

just my opinion.
 
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