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Mr. B Buys A Boat- Adventures in Boat Shopping

14K views 85 replies 23 participants last post by  NJBoatDad 
#1 ·
My " Introduce Yourself" posts were morphing into boat shopping discussions, so, I thought this would be a more appropriate place to continue that thread. Biggest thing I've sailed is a Hobie 16. Now, I'm looking to get a proper dry sailing vessel with some of the comforts of home. On advice of a friend who owns a 130" scooner, I am looking at 1980's era Catalina 30's. I've decided that I will stick to older boats whose bulders are still in business (I contacted Catalina about hull numbers and their engineering dept. responded immediately.) so far I have looked at two, a settee model and not sure of the other, I didn't like one because it had an outboard and trim adjusters on the stern. The other just stank of deisel in the cabin. Today, I am looking at a 1980 C30 with a gas Atomic 4 and tomorrow a 1986 C30 with a Universal 21. The 86 is listed for less than the 1980 boat. I'm not sure of what to make of the inverse price relationship. The 1986 owner admits to a small Catalina smile and a need for bottom paint this year. The other guy is just evasive, or worse, just doesn't know, about such things as mast compression and keel separation. He is first up today, so I'll let you all know how that goes. Carry on.
 
#4 ·
Cat 30 is a fine choice for your wants. Don't let the Atomic 4 scare you if all else is equal. Take someone along who knows (not just thinks they know) what to look for. Once you've made a decision get a survey unless you're just willing to risk the money.
 
#8 ·
Turns out that what this guy does is buy junkers floating in the marina and turns them on Craig's list. Explains why he could not answer any questions about the boat. He never sailed it. Only had it for six months. Rigging was shot. In fact, the pictures he posted on CL were not even his. They apparently were from the previous owner's failed attempt to sell this tub. Who knows how old those were?! This guy couldn't figure anything out because he knows nothing about the boat.
 
#9 ·
In this instance, walking away was the best thing to do.
Don't give up. Thousands of Catalina 30's were built. You shouldn't have a problem finding one to suit your needs and wallet. The 4 years we had ours, we certainly enjoyed it and we really are enjoying our 34 now.
 
#11 ·
On advice of a friend who owns a 130" scooner, I am looking at 1980's era Catalina 30's.
A 130 inch schooner sounds very cool. Is it a scale model..?:D

The C-30 is a good boat. In 1988 the wood core in the keel stub was eliminated. If I were to buy one again it would be post 1988. A lot of boat for the money..
 
#12 ·
C30 is a good choice but be aware that there there are quite a few flavors of this boat.
"During the long production run of this basic model there were a great number of variations in rig size, keel configuration , etc.. "
Check here to look up all the various configurations this boat was made with.
CATALINA 30 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
If you want the fastest configuration of C30 you want the full keel with tall mast version. I'd avoid the shoal draft version with the tall mast, in fact I'd avoid the shoal draft and wing keeled versions altogether unless that option appeals to you.
 
#14 ·
I'd avoid the shoal draft version with the tall mast, in fact I'd avoid the shoal draft and wing keeled versions altogether unless that option appeals to you.
Caleb, sorry but I think you're a bit off base on this one. For cruising there is surprisingly little difference between the full keeled and wing keeled versions.

There is an active C30 racing community and the fin will make a difference if you want to race.

Jim
 
#20 ·
I have to agree with Caleb. The average PHRF ratings for the different versions of the Cat 30 vary from 171 to 192. The tall mast helps a lot in low wind areas, and the fin keel will result in better upwind performance. Not the the other versions are bad boats, just that the tall mast fin keel version is the best performer.
 
#22 ·
So, did not get up to Ventura to look at that Cat30 boat. I am realizing that for $12k I'll be looking at 30 foot boats that need some significant fixing, or at least sprucing up. The original reason for looking for a 30 footer is that that is what has been recommended as the more comfortable size to make the San Pedro channel crossing to Catalina with my family aboard. But, realistically, I'll never get my wife to make that 5-6 hour crossing on a sailboat. So, I went on a tangent and found what I thought would be a decent power boat ( am I allowed to utter that phrase here?). Wife seemed more interested in participating with a V8 attached to the hull. Looked at the boat. Seemed solid given its age. Nice marine Power V8 about 6years old (ad said, "New motor!") attached to a Volvo Penta Duoprop drive of unknown vintage. Took it for a spin around the harbor, on plane for just a couple seconds in the harbor mouth. Everything sounded good. Agreed to write up a purchase agreement with deposit and do a full-on mechanical and marine survey. The survey was going along just fine. Just the usual stuff one would expect of an older vessel, but the engine was good. But when we hauled her out it turns out only one prop was driving the boat. The other was just free wheeling on its shaft. An expensive fix. And this would prevent us from doing a sea trial as the boat would never get up to top speed with only one prop driving the boat. I told the seller I'd like to price out repairs and decide if I am willing to purchase the boat without a sea trial. I decided, no. He can fix his boat and then offer it up for sale again, but I'm not gonna buy a boat without a sea trial. Not even if it's free. Now he's trying a counter offer and not giving me back my deposit as required by the offer to purchase agreement. His counter offer involves me pitching in to replace the props so we can do a sea trial. My last message to him stated i was not interested in fixing HIS boat. I'm not too worried about getting my deposit back. I know how to collect money, but jeez, what a douche. Lesson learned. Back to looking for a sailboat.
 
#23 ·
Realizing that a 30 footer is going to blow my budget- I can buy the boat , but not do any significant repairs/restoration- I'm scaling back the size. I looked at a 1970 Ericson 23. I thought, before I saw it, it would be way too small or a complete wreck. However, upon actually looking at it, it is in decent shape and surprisingly roomy for such a compact boat. In fact, the cockpit is much roomier that a Macgregor 26x (oops! The dreaded "M" word! Sorry...) and the below decks is actually quite comfortable, even though you cannot stand up in it. Comes with a Honda 4 stroke, 6 horse, long shaft (ten hours). The owner had just sailed it over from Catalina Harbor, so with a skilled skipper, it can make that crossing. Not that I would attempt it just yet. At $1500, it poses little risk for me and seems a good way to ease into sail baoting. And at that price, I would have more than enough funds to fix her up to my liking. Opinions, please.....( I know those are hard to come by here...)
 
#33 ·
By a coincidence I was at the yard last Friday to pick up our boat (bottom painting) and there was a restored E-23 Mk2 on a trailer there! Owner had brought it in for some thru hull work, they said. As the smallest Bruce King-designed boat from Ericson Yachts, it looks as nice as ever...
There are enthusiastic owners of this model over at EricsonYachts.org: The Starting Point on Ericson Yachts!, and there's at least one other E-23 web site as well.

With the construction and engineering of the larger Ericsons, it's quite a classic pocket cruiser.

As far as hull size... we spent five years cruising and class racing a Ranger 20. Loved every minute of it. Then came a decade in a fast 26 footer performance cruiser. Since '94 we've been cruising our 34 footer.

Unsolicited Advice from up here in the third balcony: Buy a smaller high quality boat and keep it a while and sail the heck out of it. There are a LOT of unhappy owners out there with large cheapie-build boats that are neither any fun to sail not inexpensive to maintain as their poorly-engineered hulls, rigs, and internal parts fail in a premature old age.
Try to buy all the quality you can afford in the smallest boat that will meet your real needs.

Regards,
LB
 
#26 ·
bbremer10:
That's sounds like a very good way to get started.

I started with a 23 foot sailboat in that price range with basic overnight amenities that had no issues other than cosmetics. "Dinkin" around for a couple summers in that boat honed my sailing, boat handling, and maintainance skills and got my wife absolutely hooked not only on sailing, but on a bigger boat that would comfortably overnight more than two adults and be a better refuge for hours or days at the slip when the weather was bad. It's nice when your other half is already on board when you broach the subject of a bigger boat.

The only problems I had were outboard motor-related and the only thing I would have done differently would have been to junk the old motor that came with the boat immediately and buy a new or at least reliable outboard right from the start.

Again, this sounds like a logical, low-risk way to get started. Motor sounds like a good deal as well. I would have found a 30-35 foot boat extremely intimidating if I'd started out with that. After a couple of years on the 23 footer, moving up was easy . . . for both of us.

Mobnets
1973 Paceship Chance 32/28 "Westwind"
 
#27 ·
bbremer10:
That's sounds like a very good way to get started.

I started with a 23 foot sailboat in that price range with basic overnight amenities that had no issues other than cosmetics. "Dinkin" around for a couple summers in that boat honed my sailing, boat handling, and maintainance skills and got my wife absolutely hooked not only on sailing, but on a bigger boat that would comfortably overnight more than two adults and be a better refuge for hours or days at the slip when the weather was bad. It's nice when your other half is already on board when you broach the subject of a bigger boat.

The only problems I had were outboard motor-related and the only thing I would have done differently would have been to junk the old motor that came with the boat immediately and buy a new or at least reliable outboard right from the start.

Again, this sounds like a logical, low-risk way to get started. Motor sounds like a good deal as well. I would have found a 30-35 foot boat extremely intimidating if I'd started out with that. After a couple of years on the 23 footer, moving up was easy . . . for both of us.

Mobnets
1973 Paceship Chance 32/28 "Westwind"
Thanks for that feedback. Plus, in this case, I know the pedigree on the outboard. The dive shop at Two Harbors sells their little outboards every two years just a matter of policy, regardless of hours used. This one was sold off after 10 hours.
 
#28 ·
Friday, supposed to go down to the marina to buy the old 23 foot Ericson. She's in what they call a "temporary" slip. Good for six months. Turns out the city owned and operated marina is being rebuilt and in the future, they do not want any boats smaller than 27 feet. WTF? They currently have over 500 empty berths and they are turning away business. Anyone have a four foot long bow pulpit?
 
#43 ·
Ah, when the economy was better maybe the marinas decided to replace small slips with bigger ones so they could soak the rich yachties.

If the 23 footer doesn't pan out, have you considered looking at Catalina 27s? I think of them as the "littlest big boats".
If they are renting out the whole slip, why do they care what size boat is in it? There's a slip near me, 32ft, with a dinghy in it.
 
#36 ·
I admit to being unaware of the realities of the California boat-buying market, but can you really not find a decent Catalina 27 for $8500?

Jesus, I know you're all sick of hearing about it but I bought an excellent Pearson 30 for $4,000! Are the markets of Annapolis and California really so different?
 
#40 · (Edited)
Can't think of of anything stinkier than a diesel. I looked at a diesel powered CAT30 and could not tolerate the smell below decks. I've looked at CAT30's with dead Atomics in the engine bay and a small outboard on the transom. No thanks. I have done the search on this sight, but not for a week or so. Going there now to see what's popped up recently. Thanks for the reminder. I just remembered. I've seen this boat listed before. There was something not right about it....
 
#49 ·
Are you trying to make a Catalina 27 plane?
Often skippers end up with more engine than they need, based on the bigger is better philosophy or a failure to understand that torque is a better measure of an engine's ability than hp. Personally, I blame the Atomic 4 for this trend- because that lump put out 30 hp, owners though they NEED 30 hp on their next boat, never realizing that the peak hp of an atomic is at 3500 rpm, while usually cruiseat hull speed is at 2000-2400 rpm, where the engine is developing only 16-18 hp... if that, since the hp specs given are factory specs from a fresh engine.

I've got a 4400 lb boat, which often cruises with 1000 lbs of crew, dogs, fuel, and stores powered by a yanmar 1GM which has no problem cruising all day long at hull speed at 2400 rpm.
 
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