SailNet Community banner
  • SailNet is a forum community dedicated to Sailing enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about sailing, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, repairs, reviews, maintenance, and more!

ICW from VA to FL

7K views 38 replies 12 participants last post by  wingNwing 
#1 ·
Which part of ICW is most boring to motor south?

I have only motored most of the FL part of ICW. It was not too bad, plenty to see along both sides. Yes, there are plenty of bridges to go thru and I don't really mind.

I wonder how is like for the other part of ICW that we should consider go outside of ICW. We need 52 ft clearance or 6 ft water; I don't think it will limit our choices.
 
#2 ·
I did the ICW northward from Florida to the Chesapeake this summer. I'm glad I did it just to have seen it. I jumped in and out quite a bit. When I go south next I will probably go outside most or all of the way. Inside was neat to see but tiresome in a sailboat with 50 ft air draft and 5 ft draft. Lots of narrow and shallow water in the Carolinas and Virginia between Norfolk and Cape Fear. Not much scenery, other than swamps, which are pretty but can get old after a few days. Plenty of places to anchor without trouble.

I recommend checking out the Salty Southern Cruiser's Network for up to date info on shoaling and closures.

Keep us posted as you go!
 
#3 ·
Worst part, to me, is Southport, NC through Myrtle Beach, SC, but then you're on the Wacamaw River, which to me is the prettiest.

As a singlehander, I prefer outside, and you can pretty much go from Beaufort Inlet to the Keys in overnight hops (first hop is 2 nights).
 
  • Like
Reactions: Silvio
#4 ·
Thanks gentlemen.

It will be two of us. If the weather is good, I want to go outside as much as possible. Although I don't mind to get some experience going thru ICW and get struck here and there.

From Norfolk to Oriental NC is less than 190 nm sailing outside, so it will be less than 40 hours non stop. The bad part is going into the inlet at night, or we can skip Oriental to head to Beaufort.

We can't afford the time to sail to Fort Pierce Fl in one trip, so we must fly back home and stay for a week or two and then go back to pick up the trip again. So getting to a city where easy to fly in and out is a plus. I beleive our wives will be joining with us when we get to Charleston or Savannah.

:)
 
#15 · (Edited)
From Norfolk to Oriental NC is less than 190 nm sailing outside, so it will be less than 40 hours non stop. The bad part is going into the inlet at night, or we can skip Oriental to head to Beaufort.
Sorry, but that makes no sense... What are you using for route planning, a restaurant placemat, or something? (grin)

IMO, there's no advantage to going around Hatteras shorthanded, unless you're gonna continue on at least to Wrightsville, or Charleston. Stopping in Beaufort will add a considerable amount to the inside distance, I just don't see the point of doing so with an air draft that is ICW capable... Besides, the first 200 miles of the Ditch to Morehead/Beaufort is one of the nicest parts of the trip inside, and offers the greatest likelihood of being able to sail...

In general, I think the stretch between Morehead and Charleston is the most tedious inside. South of Charleston, the discrepancy between inside/outside distances grows considerably, but at least one can often do a bit of sailing. If the breeze is strong NE, it gets pretty sloppy off the Georgia seacoast, with wives aboard, you might be better off staying inside... It's quite beautiful thru there, some interesting stops and wonderful wild, remote anchorages.

If you plan on meeting crew in Charleston or Savannah, you may want to check airfares first. One way fares in to either place can be frightfully expensive... Depending on where they're coming from, Myrtle Beach might be a more affordable option...

Here's my general take on the trip south, written about 10 years ago... Forget about the recommendation of Oregon Inlet, that's off the table now:

An Insider's ICW | Cruising World

Good luck, have a great trip...

 
#6 ·
Unless you just want to go to Oriental, doesn't make much sense to go there if you're outside. For me, it's 2 nights, Beaufort Inlet to north end of Hilton Head, over night to St. Augustine, then one more night to Fort Pierce, on the outside.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rockDAWG
#7 ·
Ocracoke, Oregon?
Neither.

If you really want to go to Oriental, I'd just go down the ICW, then go out Beaufort Inlet.
 
#8 ·
i am sitting on beaufort right now, had to skip oriental due to a fuel leak before that part of the canal came thro the pamlico sound which is 80 miles long and can get pretty rough seas. i dont suggest going thro this sound just bc its so long and the waves stack up close. i plan on leaving the icw in the morning and riding the coast or going off shore wind is suppose to be 15-20 knts so dunno yet.
 
#10 ·
Sigh... My reasoning was I wanted to avoid the ICW, I'm figuring 4 knts average speed so it's about 40 hours from the Chesapeake to Ocracoke. Planed on visiting friends in Oriental. I guess it won't kill me to do the ICW for the first part.

I spent my summers as a kid sailing small boats on Albemarle sound, I'm well aware of how thin the water is and how it can get whipped up in no time.

Thanks for the input
 
#11 ·
I like the ICW - the quirky little towns, the wildlife, the tremendous variations in scenery. We usually go inside southbound when the nights are long and cold, and outside northbound when the weather is milder.
 
#14 ·
If you're just trying to make distance, you get the most bang for your buck by going outside and bypassing Georgia. It has the biggest tides/currents and the most windy rivers. Exit at Charleston or Beaufort, SC and come back in at St Augustine - its only a single overnight and saves you about 200 miles of ICW.
 
#17 ·
I would second going around Georgia. I did it in a powerboat and it was frightfully boring as well as the worst tides and currents, I had to crab the thing across one spot where another waterway crossed the current was so bad. When are you heading out? I am planning to make the trip from Kent Narrows in the first or second week of November, kinda depends on what the next 2 weeks holds and how much I can get done. Not sure yet if I will have crew, but I would like to tag along with a couple other boats if anyone elses time frame matches my own, if only for parts of it, I doubt my 30' will keep up with a lot of the larger boats going down.
 
#20 ·
After studying the NOAA chart last night, yes I agree the inlets in the outer bank look dicey. So the alternative from Norfolk is that we will head further south to Morehead City or Wilmington. My questions are:

1. What kind of weather window we should aim for in Norfolk
2. What are our Plan B or C destination if the weather turns bad?

:)
 
#24 ·
I think you should re-read Jon's post. I would think long and hard about going outside from Norfolk. If you run the ICW it will take you 4 long days to get to Oriental and you can see your friend. There are good anchorages along the way. You will have the option to head outside from Beaufort with plenty of available runs from there (you can go out for long days, overnights or multiple nights). From Beaufort, you will be able to stay coastal and not fight the GS.

OTOH, if you go outside from Norfolk, you don't have any decent falloffs prior to Beaufort. The GS is close to shore and you may wind up fighting it. The weather off of hateras is notorious for changing quickly and (I assume) you know all about the shoals. I just think it is a tough shorthanded run. If you do decide to go outside, when you do your mileage -- don't cheat -- make sure you count all the distance around the shoals and from the sea marks into the harbors. It is a longer trip than it looks at first glance at the charts.

Luck
-Matt
 
#21 ·
Well, the Gulf Stream cuts close to Hatteras and runs north; you're southbound so your choices are to have fair winds and battle wind-against-current waves, or get the wind and current in sync and face a headwind. Neither choice is terribly appealing. You can look for a perfect beam reach, or look for light winds and motor around the cape. Or, stay inside until the Cape Fear River, go out at Morehead City, and stay outside 3 or 4 days to Florida, with the ability to come in at numerous Class A inlets like Charleston or Beaufort, SC; Savannah, GA; should the weather turn.

Surprised that Dave (Auspicious) hasn't chimed in here - he's a big fan of staying to the outside all the way to south Florida.
 
#23 ·
I checked the NOAA chart, we can safely sail down to Morehead City 3 NM off the coast and pay attention to Diamond shoal when get to Hatteras. If we need more sea room when wind is blowing from the east hard, we can head out 8 nm or so, which is still far away from the GS heading north. By doing so, we may be able to catch the counter current heading south.

Without any other local knowledge, here what I am thinking. We will wait in Norfolk for the cold front to pass. When the wind is start to shift from south to sw and to west, we will head out from Norfolk to Morehead City or Wilmington. The problem we will have if weather goes bad, we have no place to duck between Norfolk and Morehead City. However, we only need two days to MC. IF we get a weather window for 4 days, we should be OK. Once we get to MC, we will have more places to hide if the weather is not good.

We still have plenty time to sort out the details before departing in November.
 
#28 · (Edited)
There appears to be an eddy running North to South close to the shore. This seems to be a common feature of the stream - that an eddy runs in the opposite direction outside the path of the Gulf Stream.

Why not ride the eddy south?

Why not sail/motor inside Diamond Shoals during the daytime instead of outside? I understand the danger of being caught on a lee shore, but if you pick the right weather window, it should work.
 
#27 · (Edited)
I concur with Jon big time. The run through Diamond Shoals is much greater than 8 miles offshore. I have come through there a number of times when the regular ocean swells of 4-6 ft were accentuated to 10-12 in the shoals going out 35 miles. If ypu look carefully the Atlantic goes from a couple thousand feet deep to about 100 ft in less than 3 miles. And instead of large intervals the Hatteras area had steep short intervals. There is no real place to duck in for cover as discussed that in any weather Ocracoke is not an option, and Oregon is never and option. The winds in this area not as predictable as you think either. You have many factors to consider. Down sloping winds from the mountains, short coastal plain, influence from tropical air masses meeting fronts from Canada. This can change the weather in the area quite quickly and dramatically.

What most people do not understand about the charts and Jon explained well is that these two areas as well as many of the inlets on the Jersey Shore, the sand shift daily around the channels and the CG is constantly reconfiguring temporary bouys defining them. That should tell you something about the conditions you will find there.

Auspicious has takenthe outside route many times ( I don't want to speak for him) but I don't beleive he runs the coast, certainly not at 3 miles. I thought is route was many outside the stream. He has a world of experience and is very cautious as a delivery captain, and has great experience in this area.

Personally I would not risk my boat, or life on this route and would come out after Hatteras on the way south. There is a reason it is called the graveyard of the Atlantic.

Dave
 
#32 ·
I concur with Jon big time. The run through Diamond Shoals is much greater than 8 miles offshore. I have come through there a number of times when the regular ocean swells of 4-6 ft were accentuated to 10-12 in the shoals going out 35 miles. If ypu look carefully the Atlantic goes from a couple thousand feet deep to about 100 ft in less than 3 miles. And instead of large intervals the Hatteras area had steep short intervals. There is no real place to duck in for cover as discussed that in any weather Ocracoke is not an option, and Oregon is never and option. The winds in this area not as predictable as you think either. You have many factors to consider. Down sloping winds from the mountains, short coastal plain, influence from tropical air masses meeting fronts from Canada. This can change the weather in the area quite quickly and dramatically.

What most people do not understand about the charts and Jon explained well is that these two areas as well as many of the inlets on the Jersey Shore, the sand shift daily around the channels and the CG is constantly reconfiguring temporary bouys defining them. That should tell you something about the conditions you will find there.

Auspicious has takenthe outside route many times ( I don't want to speak for him) but I don't beleive he runs the coast, certainly not at 3 miles. I thought is route was many outside the stream. He has a world of experience and is very cautious as a delivery captain, and has great experience in this area.

Personally I would not risk my boat, or life on this route and would come out after Hatteras on the way south. There is a reason it is called the graveyard of the Atlantic.

Dave
While Hatteras most certainly deserves the utmost respect, I also think some of the cautionary advice here might be a bit overwrought. Frankly, most of my trips out around have been fairly tame, or afforded some very nice sailing... Several have been motor jobs in a flat calm...

My main point is I simply don't see the value of that route from the Chesapeake as opposed to the ICW, unless you're gonna continue on until Charleston, or at least Wrightsville... If you wind up stopping in Beaufort, going down outside, even cutting the corner at Diamond Shoals as closely as possible, still adds roughly 40 miles to the total distance from Hampton Roads over the run inside... Not sure what sort of boat the OP is taking south, but if he does wind up with a calm weather window that mandates a lot of motoring, chances are he's gonna have to put into Beaufort for fuel, anyway...

If time is of the essence, run through the gauntlet of restricted bridges south of Norfolk at night, or early in the AM before they go on restriction... Stop in Coinjock, treat yourself to a great dinner, run through the following night down Pamlico Sound, you'll still be in Beaufort early the next day... I just think the OP is overestimating the time saving by going outside, unless they turn out to be incredibly lucky with the weather, and have conditions favorable for staying outside all the way to Charleston... And when that happens, it generally means a fairly sporty trip out around Frying Pan/Cape Fear, and a very tired crew of two by the time you hit Charleston...

There appears to be an eddy running North to South close to the shore. This seems to be a common feature of the stream - that an eddy runs in the opposite direction outside the path of the Gulf Stream.

Why not ride the eddy south?

Why not sail/motor inside Diamond Shoals during the daytime instead of outside? I understand the danger of being caught on a lee shore, but if you pick the right weather window, it should work.
Perhaps there's something there, but I have never noticed a consistent counter-current running down the beach... there's always something going on about 15 miles north of Oregon Inlet, the water there is generally confused by some sort of eddy, but that's about it, I've never been able to figure out how to play it to any particular advantage...

I'm no expert on this subject but thought I had read somewhere that anyone doing the outside heading south did so on the east side of the GS. Does this make sense?
For the trip the OP has in mind - coming down the Chesapeake, and planning to stop in Beaufort or Charleston - it makes no sense whatsoever, ESPECIALLY for an ICW-capable boat that doesn't have to go around Hatteras to begin with... Such a route would add a ridiculous amount of time and distance to the trip...

Passing east of the Stream can make sense on a voyage coming from New England, perhaps, and continuing straight onto S. Florida or the Bahamas... But coming out of the Chesapeake or coming coastwise from NY, I think simply waiting in Hampton until a weather window presents itself is the only way to go...

I've always run pretty much right down the beach, and rounded Diamond Shoals at the red nun "2", no problem... But, as Dave on AUSPICIOUS mentioned, you definitely have to be "paying attention" in that neighborhood...
 
#34 ·
Capt Bones,

Nov 12 is pretty much what we have in mind but can be plus 2 weeks (delay) and minus 1 week (ahead). Both my friend and I still have a full time job, so the schedules have to work out without too much disruption.

Our final destination is flexible, but we are aiming for West Palm with an intention to jump off to Bahamas. Just be aware, we can't make the whole trip in one shot (trip), we need to fly back and forth a few times before we can reach Florida. Therefore, it is our goal to sail as fast and greater distance as possible without being foolish. But I have known for taking calculated risk.

Let's keep in touch. I am sure we will meet along the ICW. Have dinner with us, we serve gourmet food daily regardless the weather or sea state. :)
 
#37 ·
It's warmer on that east side :cool:
So that makes a lot of sense if you're headed to the Carib. If you're going to FL from Norfolk, then you obviously have to cross the Stream back again in the other direction. If you want a deep ocean experience, this is the way to do it.
 
#33 ·
Some general thoughts.

Being in a rush in a sailboat, eventually, bites you in the butt.

If you want to stop at Oriental, go the ICW.

If you're going to go outside from the Chessie, keep going to at least Charleston.

Obviously, you have to do what you feel comfortable with.
 
  • Like
Reactions: blowinstink
#38 ·
1500 heads out past the Gulfstream, is that what you are doing?
Last couple of years, the strategy of most of the 1500 fleet has been to run down the coast to Hatteras, and cross the Stream there. Not necessarily a bad way to go, but I've always thought it still takes some real cojones on the part of the rally organizers to "endorse" such a route, I certainly wouldn't want to bear the "responsibility" (as little as any such organizer actually has, of course) of watching over a gaggle of 60 or more boats sailing down the beach between the Outer Banks and the Gulf Stream in November...



Last year, that sharp turn of the Stream running due East at almost 38 N was located a good 60-75 NM further south than now, and so was a pretty enticing argument for heading straight for it out of the Bay entrance... Worked out pretty good, although we never saw much favorable current right in the axis of the Stream, is just wasn't running very strong at that time. Always nice to get your easting in early on that trip, however, and it worked out fine for us, and made the decision to make a pit stop in Bermuda an easy one, when Herb began getting concerned about the potential development of another late season tropical system. I was bound for Antigua, anyway, as opposed to the 1500 fleet headed for Tortola, so staying further north of their rhumbline was a given, anyway...

Interesting to note that the participation in the 1500 is considerably down from last year, to about 40 boats, last time I looked... Looks like a lot of folks have decided to go with the Salty Dawgs, instead... More bang for the buck, no doubt about it...

The Salty Dawg Rally
 
#39 · (Edited)
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top