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Old 11-23-2012
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Re: HMS Bounty in trouble...

Quote:
RITA | BTS | Table 2-49: U.S. Coast Guard Search and Rescue Statistics, Fiscal Year
Here are the US statistics you fail to address and accept. Read the informnation. Incidents are down YTY, losses are down YTY. This blows a hole in your whole premise that things have gotten worse since 1985 with the advent of GPS. The data doesnt support you arguments.

Quote:
The question is, with the increasing number of idiots that have to be saved, for how much tine the tax payer will remain without saying: Why the well I am paying for idiots to be saved from their own stupidity?
Do you see where you assumption is wrong. Irs not increasing and you havent proved that the % of recreational boaters is increasing within these numbers either

Quote:
The point is that I consider that help makes many to consider that now it is easy to sail to any place and that can induce a false sense of security that leads unprepared sailors to attempt passage that they would not have tried if they had do not that help.
Unprepared sailors...what does that mean. No experience. A sailor who used to sail by charts...me now has the added advantage of having GPS and Chartplottrer to aid my charts. Some would say that makes me a better prepared sailor. Experience is a whole other matter. As you stated a chartplotter doesnt make you understand how to handle difficult weather.

Quote:
I am not deaf or blind and even if there are here many that have sailed much more than me I have been around for some decades and more than 20 000nm. 10 years ago it was very rare to hear a mayday call. In this season I head 5 or 6 and as you now the VHF range is pretty limited.
I respect your experience as well as many others like Jon. I have some also having sailed for over 40 years, two Atlantic crossings, numerous deliveries, trips, and sails from the Mid-Atlantic to the Carribean with well in excess of 40,000 nm. I also sail in an area which has a large number of sailing boats, and havent noticed an increase at all in CG or rescues. In addition I sail to New England up the coast every year. It is my opinion that the average sailor of today is much safer with the new electronics. Excluding power boaters it has been my observation that many sailors supplement their charts and available information with GPS as well as advanced radar today. This added information helps prevent them from sailing into shoals, sailing into danger sailing into oncomming weather. It is much better to sail when caught in fog with radar and a chartplotter tha without like in olden days. That does mean however because I have radar and a chartplotter I will set out into a dangerous area with a false sence of security. It means when mother nature throws unexpected conditions at me that I am better prepared to handle them and therefore less likely to have an accident.

The GPS position although not perfect gives continual updated information which can only be used as an advantage for the average sailor who wants to be more informed rather than less. Sailors for centureies have set out on voyages with little or not enough experience. Many on SN even laud their "dreams" of some people who have dubious credentials making passages to the Carribean frequently.

This is only one part of the equation when making a crossing or coastal voyage and certainly the technical sailing skill is the most important piece.

Quote:
No, don't confuse things. I Think the the plotter, the GPS and the Epirb are great and make the live easier to everybody, what I am saying is that modern technology, making navigation easy increased the number of non experienced sailors that attempt to make passages or cross oceans, simply because without GPS you could not navigate an ocean without being experienced and now you can. Certainly you will agree with this too?
To state that people with limited skills and experience just take off on coastal and crossings just because they have an EPIRB or a chartplotter is an unfounded and illogoical assumption again not based in fact. Everyone is entitled to their opinion though. There are plenty of idiots in the world. There are plenty of "experienced" captains ( Bounty/ Rule 62) who make wrong decisions which cost life or injury, this despite thier previious experience.

Quote:
But when the inexperienced sailors gets bad weather under way (that would not be a problem from an experienced sailor) they will find suddenly that after all it was not so easy and that they realy don't know how to cope with it.

Well, not a big problem, they have an Epirb and someone will pick them and the insurance will pay for the boat. They just have to say that they were making water and sink the boat when they are picked up. It is all very easy and risk free... very easy
You have got to be kidding. You think they go out offshore and have this attitude. You really thinkj they think because they have an EPIRB and insurance they will risk their lives. I dont hang around ANY sailors like this. Point one out to me who posts here on SN. Do you have sailkors like this where you sail in Portugal? If you doi I would stay far far away from them

To me chartplotters, EPIRGS, Weatherfax, Radar are addtional safety measures the modern sailor who travels offshore has today. It doesnt make you a better sailor,,,,just a better informed one. A better informed Captain has more information to make better risk/ reward decisions. Modern technology doesnt add or replace the technical sailing skill or experience of the Captain. It also doesnt take away from that skill either.

Maybe thats why the RITA FACTS and FIGURES show a decrease in incidents and deaths despite and obvious increase in the number of recreational as well as commercial vessels.

Dave
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Last edited by chef2sail; 11-23-2012 at 12:52 AM.
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