Sold Boat Prices

[BigEasy1]

I am presently researching the prices of Beneteau 343's that are 4 to 6 years of age. After looking at NADA values, Sold Boat values supplied by a broker, and boat depreciation tables, I find that the sold boat values are highly suspect.
First, most of the boats are listed at the approximate original sales price when the boat was purchased new. Second, according to sold boats, most of the boats are selling at an average sales price of $110K at a discount of less than 10% off the listing price. Third, NADA values range from $80K to $90K. And Finally, depreciation tables listed on Beneteau's fractional yachting site indicate there is concensus that boats depreciate 25% in the first 3 years followed by a 3-4% depreciation annually thereafter.
In this current DEPRESSED MARKET, I find that it is highly unlikely that these boats are selling at less than a 10% discount off of inflated listing prices. There are some individuals on this site that have indicated that there is a concerted effort to over report the sales prices on Sold Boats. I can only conclude that the sales prices are bogus. What do you think?? What do you think is a realistic sales price for this boat??

[jameswilson29]

You raise an interesting point and I share with your suspicion.

Virginia Code Section 8.01-419.1 provides that the NADA value is admissible as evidence of fair market value of the value of an automobile in civil and criminal cases, subject to other "credible evidence" by a party showing it is not correct. (Kelley Blue Book does not enjoy the same imprimatur of legitimacy in Va).http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...cod+8.01-419.1

The NADA values are generated by sales reported by the auto dealers, who tend to sell the cream of the crop (and who have an interest in boosting retail value and lowering trade-in). Accuracy is supported by a constantly high volume of sales and the competitive nature of the retail vehicle sales business.

The problems with NADA for sailboats are the much smaller number of units sold, compared to automobiles, and its reliance on the honesty and thoroughness of the reporting entities - the yacht brokers.

In addition, since the internet has allowed more sellers to bypass traditional brokers in the selling process, there are even fewer sales from which data can be drawn. While depreciation tables supply some abstract, seemingly accurate basis for supporting a given value, in fact, they cannot possibly account for the vagaries of economic conditions, which would seem to have a much greater effect on values.

Although some on this listserv disagree, I believe the best indication of value in the recession would be some discounted value of the list prices of comparable boats offered for sale, with or without a broker, because these boats represent a buyer's other choices and there is currently strong downward presssure on prices due to competition from an excess of supply.

[kd3pc]

As with all things human, that involve $$ there is a fudge factor involved with soldboats..

that being said, I would put no credibility in NADA or BUC for anything larger than a 20', their system is set up for cars, not boats and looks at auction, bank and repo sales...

Depreciation tables are just that...some boat buyers are trying to justify the purchase of a boat as some economical event, and it is not. Same thing for the fractional/charter market.

Boats 4 - 6 years old are in between most purchasers range, they are new enough to command high prices, yet not enough sold to really have a track. Many buyers are hoping to get a "deal" but sellers do not want to write a check at all, to sell.

It is quite possible these boats are selling at near asking or less than 10%. As a data point I just sold my 42' in August for less than 10% off asking price and it was a 1991.

As to listing at approximate sales price...that is likely true, as most list prices for new boats are barely "sail away" or "bare boat"....a purchaser of a new boat can have multiple thousands in added gear - dinghy w/engine, electronics, etc....above the the list price.

The realistic sales price is one that you are willing to pay for the boat, plain and simple. And that very well may be near asking price for this boat. Make an offer and see what the market will bear.
It does sound as if you are trying to rationalize this purchase for someone, and that may not be possible. Boat purchase is far more emotional than any other purchase you will ever make.

[JimsCAL]

When I was in the market to sell my boat and buy a "new" one, I used data from BUCValue, NADA and Soldboats.com. I found BUC and NADA to be almost useless, either significantly overestimating (usually older boats) or sometimes underestimating (usually newer boats) values. They seem to use a depreciation table which may or may not bear any relationship to the real market. At least Soldboat.com gives you real sales. Yes a broker can report a higher price than the actual sale, but there doesn't seem to be big incentive to do that. And if there are enough sales of a particular boat reported, I'm sure you can get a good read on the market.

[BigEasy1]

KD3pc
You are exactly correct. I am trying to rationalize this purchase for someone---me!!!
I have fallen in love with boats PREVIOUSLY and actually not done too badly on the purchase end. I am currently looking at Beneteau's in the 331-343-361 class that are in the 4 to 8 year range. With these being production boats, there is not much variation in features that would command excessive price variation---we are not talking about unique blue water type boats. There are probably 40 boats in this catergory listed on yacht world not including boats FSBO. This time around I am NOT in love!! Just trying to find a decent boat for a good / fair price. If I can't get a boat for a reasonable price, I will just continue chartering. It is just difficult knowing what to offer and what is a reasonable sales price especially in this economic climate.
I have read on this site that many guys are advocating offering 30 to 50 % off of the list price, considering the state of the economy, the number of boats available, and the lack of sales. I don't think that is reasonable; however, I would expect that asking prices would be somewhat lower than present and that sold boat prices would be discounted 15-20% off list price, not <10%. Maybe I am missing something; however, I just don't trust the valuation guides.
Of course, I realize that ANYTHING is only worth what a fool will pay for it!