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  #31  
Old 07-17-2013
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

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Originally Posted by sailpower View Post
Sellers, brokers and buyers come in all flavors. Itís just the way it is.
Exactly. Yes, there are lying, moronic, douchebags out there. But there are also plenty of honest, realistic people trying to sell their boats. You just have to sift the chaff from the wheat. It may take a bit of time to figure out how to do this, but it really is not that hard.

No offense intended to the OP, honestly, but if you find that you really are ALWAYS running into LMDs, perhaps you need to take a look at what it is that you are doing that leads you to them.

Good luck.
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  #32  
Old 07-17-2013
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

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Originally Posted by chef2sail View Post
This boats a dog with lipstick. That's why it's been on the market 2 years
Hence - "Cosmetically it looks quite good."

Maybe I should have added a: .

Yeah, the interior was funky, seem to remember that it might have been re-varnished.

The interior layout of the P42 is weird with the "workbench" stbd of companionway.

Enigne access - strange.


BTW - should it be "pig with lipstick" ;-)
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  #33  
Old 07-17-2013
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

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Originally Posted by Delirious View Post
And from the seller's point of view:

Don't come back with a counter offer 25% lower than asking because it needs x, y and z. I know this, that's why I set the price where it was when put up for sale. Start with the price of a new boat and deduct the value if you think fixing x, y and z should be on my tab or you want them corrected as a condition of sale to make a 25 year old boat like new.

But yes - these flaws should all be mentioned if known. Inventory and age of sales, structural integrity, maintenance history, rotted cores, etc.
And this is where I have a problem. Owners getting bent out of shape by what they perceive as a low ball offer.

This is a negotiation. In negotiation the seller starts high and the buyer starts low. it's the opening bid. That's the way the world works! Nothing to get the short and curlies twisted in a knot over. Buyers can't go down price once they've put an offer out there. The offer can go only one way - up.

As you, the seller, has judged what the boat is worth, I the buyer will make that same judgement. And since it's my money making the deal go to closing, my judgement will prevail. That is - we need to agree. And either we will or we won't.

Regardless, the worst thing a seller can do in a negotiation is get PO'd at a buyer over the opening offer. Geez, got an offer? Any offer? let the game begin!!!!
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  #34  
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

One problem i've experienced in the boat selling world that would seem backwards is the make an offer before knowing if the boat is a viable candidate.

A visual inspection can yield some obvious problems not factored into the asking price. The broker advises to make an offer and let a surveyor figure it out. Here is the issue: You already know the boat has some issues. These issues could be deal killers if you don't like the outcome of the survey. Yet, here is a seller/broker asking you to make an offer in the blind and then put out for a survey all for a boat you may not want. This seems ass backwards to me.
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  #35  
Old 07-17-2013
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

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Originally Posted by TJC45 View Post
One problem i've experienced in the boat selling world that would seem backwards is the make an offer before knowing if the boat is a viable candidate.

A visual inspection can yield some obvious problems not factored into the asking price. The broker advises to make an offer and let a surveyor figure it out. Here is the issue: You already know the boat has some issues. These issues could be deal killers if you don't like the outcome of the survey. Yet, here is a seller/broker asking you to make an offer in the blind and then put out for a survey all for a boat you may not want. This seems ass backwards to me.
You don't have a home inspection till after you have agreed on a price. Pretty much the same thing?
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  #36  
Old 07-17-2013
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

TJC, in my case I did it "backward." I had a certain amount of "cash" and wasn't willing to finance. Most of the boats I was interested in were listed at 50-100% more than my budget. I was honest and up-front, told the seller what my limit was, but also reminded them that I had cash and there weren't any financing deals to fall through, conditions based on the sale of a current boat, etc. I always made the offer contingent on my review and a survey, and made it clear that I assumed there wouldn't be any unexpected surprises. Not everyone appreciated my approach (I was called names several times), but some appreciated the candor, and I actually visited several boats before settling on the one I bought.

Of course, that doesn't help the OP, but that's a separate issue...
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  #37  
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

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Originally Posted by sailpower View Post
You don't have a home inspection till after you have agreed on a price.
Generally speaking not. Probably for a reason.

I was recently in a situation where I, due to certain circumstances, had the opportunity to have a home inspection done prior to making an offer and negotiating price on a property.

This can be a good situation for a buyer to be in.

You know (hopefully) all the issues prior to negotiation and come to the table armed with facts.
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  #38  
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

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Originally Posted by jimgo View Post
TJC, in my case I did it "backward." I had a certain amount of "cash" and wasn't willing to finance. Most of the boats I was interested in were listed at 50-100% more than my budget. I was honest and up-front, told the seller what my limit was, but also reminded them that I had cash and there weren't any financing deals to fall through, conditions based on the sale of a current boat, etc. I always made the offer contingent on my review and a survey, and made it clear that I assumed there wouldn't be any unexpected surprises. Not everyone appreciated my approach (I was called names several times), but some appreciated the candor, and I actually visited several boats before settling on the one I bought.

Of course, that doesn't help the OP, but that's a separate issue...
Jimgo, excellent advice!!! The way to buy a boat. or, anything else for that matter! Be upfront about the money. Establish that you aren't a lowballer just out to squeeze the seller. And, remind the seller of any benefits you bring to the table. For instance- cash in hand!!!!
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  #39  
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

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Originally Posted by sailpower View Post
You don't have a home inspection till after you have agreed on a price. Pretty much the same thing?
That's a good point. My take, generally speaking, is that a home sale is a done deal for more reasons than the house itself. The neighborhood, location, the grounds, school systems etc. Buyers are unlikely to make an offer on a house where they believe a major walk away issue exists. Yet in boatdom, this is the way it's done. Making an offer on a boat, I don't want to be out a $1000 or more just to find out the boat is a pass.

I once was interested in a Pearson 35. Problem was the coach roof was warped by the roof stepped mast bearing down on it. That was an expensive problem to fix. Yet not reflected in the price. "Make an offer and let the surveyor figure it out." OK i do that and he tells me I got good news and i got bad news. The good is that the oak block under the compression post is toast. And that can be fixed. The bad - the cabin roof is permanently torqued so the boat is junk, do i get my $1000 survey fee back?

Not likely!

Last edited by TJC45; 07-17-2013 at 02:31 PM.
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  #40  
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Re: Are ALL Sellers LYING MORONIC DOUCHBAGS??

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Originally Posted by TJC45 View Post
Jimgo, excellent advice!!! The way to buy a boat. or, anything else for that matter! Be upfront about the money. Establish that you aren't a lowballer just out to squeeze the seller. And, remind the seller of any benefits you bring to the table. For instance- cash in hand!!!!
I think it depends a lot on which end of the market you are talking about.

Boats for $15K, $150K or >$500K...

The guy with an older 30 footer which market value is $15K might be willing to let it go for $10K , "just to get rid of it" considering slip fees, insurance and maintenance may amount to equal or more than $5K/yr. Also $5K may not feel like such a "hard hit" to the seller.

The guy with a $150K (market value) boat will probably be less likely to sell it for $100K (unless very dire circumstances) since his slip fees, insurance and maintenance will not amount to $50K/yr. Also, for most people, $50K is a significant financial loss.

The guy with the >$500K boat is not going to lose 30-50% on a boat deal. He is smart. and rich. he can just wait.

Broad generalizations, I know ...
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