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  #141  
Old 07-27-2013
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JulieMor View Post
As far as the "over analyzing" thing? I'm retired. I'm just occupying time until we leave for the coast.
I don't know if it is true but I heard many years ago that in Japan the men worked such long hours that they left buying a new house up to their wife.
She would find the house arrange the move and text him at work the new address so he would come home to the correct house.

You are retired so don't wait. Go boat shopping.

With today's cameras you can stream your SO some video and put in an offer.
If you are really worried about it just put pending survey, pending financing and pending SO approval in the offer.

Just a thought.
We all know you are going to get the boat you want anyway.
Easy Peasy, it is a lot cheaper and faster to travel alone anyway.
If you picked up one of these http://www.gowinnebago.com/
could you image how many boats you could look at if you just went driving for a couple months.
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Last edited by davidpm; 07-28-2013 at 10:33 PM.
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  #142  
Old 07-28-2013
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Escrow accounts are mandatory IMO. For a relatively small fee, they insure all funds and documents are accumulated before disbursing. They will also do title searches and properly file for whatever State or Federal title you're looking for. However, ones I've used required me to do my own registration, which you typically have several months to do.
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  #143  
Old 07-28-2013
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
Escrow accounts are mandatory IMO. For a relatively small fee, they insure all funds and documents are accumulated before disbursing. They will also do title searches and properly file for whatever State or Federal title you're looking for. However, ones I've used required me to do my own registration, which you typically have several months to do.

Marine Title in Seattle provides this service. They act as an intermediary between you, the broker and banks or finance companies. They will do the title search before funds change hands and receive funds from the bank to disburse to the owner, other banks and financial institutions who may hold a fiduciary interest in the vessel. Important to understand WHO really owns the property and if there are any outstanding liens as well. These may include Mechanics, Marinas, State tax authorities and sometimes the estates and property interests of spouse or family members. If you finance a vessel and pay off the note, you will also be issued with a "Satisfaction of Mortgage" note. This should kept with your original bill of sale documents. USCG documentation is only part of the ownership documentation process.
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  #144  
Old 07-28-2013
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Ideally, the earnest money should be deposited into an escrow account upon full ratification of the contract (fully signed and initialed after all counters accepted). It stands as security for performance of the contract and may be designated as liquidated damages by the seller and buyer in the event of a default.

In the event of a dispute as to a breach of contract, the money should be deposited with the clerk of court in a proceeding known as an interpleader action, where the third party escrow agent tenders payment to the court to release its liability and all parties with a claim to it, seller, buyer and broker, assert their rights to it.

Some brokers may not have the balls or the desire to act as a true escrow agent, which exposes them to liability and becomes messy and expensive if a dispute arises, and therefore never deposit the check, because they do not want to have to file an interpleader action. Instead, they may encourage everyone to sign a release (which, of course, includes a release of all liability of the broker by all!). After all, their interest is in putting the boat back on the market, not being involved in litigation.

If you are the seller and the buyer breaches the contract, you may have a right to the deposit, and you may have a cause of action against your escrow agent for failing to deposit the earnest money. On the other side, a buyer may sue for damages, or, in some instances, specific performance, if the subject matter of the contract is unique, or damages would be inadequate. In some jurisdictions, the remedy of specific performance may be available only with respect to real property.

There is a reason why we have contracts - real written contracts - and deposits; this is where the rubber meets the road and there is money at stake for performance of the agreement according to its terms. Pretending you have deal and holding a check, while the buyer spends umpteen dollars on a haul out or launch, marine survey, rigging survey, engine survey, sea trial, and any other evaluations is a sucker play for buyers who are willing to be led around by the nose by the process.

Last edited by jameswilson29; 07-29-2013 at 07:32 AM.
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  #145  
Old 07-28-2013
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jameswilson29 View Post
Ideally, the earnest money should be deposited into an escrow account upon full ratification of the contract (fully signed and initialed after all counters accepted).
I agree with James on this, you don't write a check to go look at a boat, you put money into escrow once the deal has been worked out. The back and forth of offer and counter-offer is just a conversation, it can happen on paper, or over a drink at a restaurant, none of it matters until someone signs it. I also don't understand buyers who sign offers, why would you do that ? Sure, send them the offer, but there's no reason for anyone to sign anything until both the buyer and seller reach an agreement on what the deal is. Brokers are the ones who force all of this because they just want the buyer and seller to get on with it so they can get their money, so they'll do anything to hurry it along.
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  #146  
Old 07-28-2013
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Buyers and sellers can deal with each other any way that they choose.

Brokers can’t. They are agents and bound by agency law. It really is that simple. There is opinion being passed around here as knowledge that is just inaccurate. Deposits become cleared funds generally after ratification but prior to satisfaction of contingencies. Those cleared funds are held in the brokers escrow account (By law) until disbursed as per the ratified contract. Yes, there are exceptions to every rule but brokers are required to have and use escrow accounts in every state that I am aware of.

Now, all of you who believe that brokers are just crooks can stop reading here.

Reputable brokers belong to various professional groups depending on where they are located. The largest are the California Yacht Brokers Association, The Florida Yacht Brokers Association and the Yacht Brokers Association of America.

These associations all have rules of conduct and ethical standards which the members are bound by. In addition Florida and I believe, California, require brokers to be bonded and licensed.

Unfortunately there are always cowboys and undesirables in every industry. That means that buyers and sellers need to do their due diligence when entering into business relationships. It’s not that hard to do. A rudimentary approach would be to deal only with brokers who belong to a professional association. It’s not foolproof but a good start.

Open up a Yachting Magazine or Power & Motoryacht and look at what is being advertised for sale. Do you really think that these companies are owned and staffed by crooks? How would it be possible for fraud of the magnitude suggested here and on other forums of this type, for them to still be in business?

OTOH, the value of the boats being discussed here are generally at the lower end of the market. That means that in some cases you would not be dealing with the cream of the crop. Often brokers at this level are newer, part time or just marking time. I said often but I don’t mean all. There are also some very good people who simply like to deal in this product. Sometimes it takes some looking. If you find someone that you trust, use them, otherwise you are at the mercy of the listing agents that you call directly. Your choice.

IMO, Julie has come a long way. She started out posting her assumptions as fact but has since discovered that the process is a lot more complex than she realized.

At the end of the day you are buying a commodity not some mystical thing with special rules.

During this process people that you deal with are going to make money as the result of your purchase. If you believe that is bad then do something else with your money. Again, your choice.
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Last edited by sailpower; 07-28-2013 at 12:11 PM.
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  #147  
Old 07-28-2013
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailpower View Post
Now, all of you who believe that brokers are just crooks can stop reading here.
Are you or have you ever been a broker ?

It seems like that information would be important to anyone who was reading your spirited defense.
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  #148  
Old 07-28-2013
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Yes and it is not a "defense". It is an accurate explanation of how the process works and how the parties interact.
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  #149  
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailpower View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by wind_magic View Post
Are you or have you ever been a broker ?

It seems like that information would be important to anyone who was reading your spirited defense.
Yes and it is not a "defense". It is an accurate explanation of how the process works and how the parties interact.
You are entitled to your opinion, of course.

I'm sure you won't mind if I continue to hold my own opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wind_magic View Post
The people who scold you about trying to save money, etc, are brokers, or they were brokers, ignore them.
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  #150  
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Re: What Is A Boat Really Worth?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wind_magic View Post
You are entitled to your opinion, of course.

I'm sure you won't mind if I continue to hold my own opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wind_magic
The people who scold you about trying to save money, etc, are brokers, or they were brokers, ignore them
Of course not. It’s the internet. Your opinion doesn’t even have to be relevant to my comments which, based on your quoted text, it is not.

For example, I haven’t scolded Julie for trying to save money.

In the interest of full disclosure shouldn’t you also post your own bona fides relating to your own expertise on this topic? It seems like that information would be important to anyone who was reading your spirited defense.

Last edited by sailpower; 07-28-2013 at 12:44 PM.
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