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  #1  
Old 08-18-2013
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How much should I offer for this boat

Some friends of mine have a 1975 Pearson 26. They have had the boat for probably four seasons. They used the boat very little last year and as far as I know not at all this year. They haven't said anything about selling yet but I would not be surprised if the thought has occurred to them. They have had two bad years. So my question is how to do I treat friends if they ask me if I want to buy their boat.

The problem is that they have put a lot of money into the boat.
The following is what I know about:
3,600 for the boat.
3,000 into depth, speed instruments, cushions, main-sheet blocks running rigging etc.
300 Jib
2,000 Roller fuller jib end of last year probably never used
2,000 New elect system
3,000 New outboard with remote control with I would guess 10 hours on it.

They did most of the work themselves and are very talented and did either a pretty good job or excellent over kill job.

So not including dockage and normal maintenance like paint etc they have a total of at least 14,000 into the boat.

The problem is it is a '75. And no matter what you do to a '75 it is still a very old boat.
If it was just some guy off the street I would figure the boat is worth 3,000 the 7,000 in upgrades is worth 1,000 and the outboard is worth 2,000.

That would bring the total to 6,000 which is pretty near the high end for this boat.

I really don't need a boat but they are my first students ever and I have a soft spot for the boat and all the work they put into it.
I might be able to get a couple years out of it and then I would have to sell. So the real question is even with all the upgrades if I paid 6,000 I'll bet I'll take a loss.
My friend has a sailnet account and may see this post so maybe you can set me straight on the pricing. Hopefully they will stick it out another year and not consider selling which is perfect for me. No decision necessary.
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Old 08-18-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

So hard for me, sorry to say that, i can not help you.
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Old 08-18-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

The value of a boat for the seller is what yu can get for it. The value of the boat to a buyer is what you are willing to pay for it. If you can meet somewhere in the middle and both be happy then so much the better. However what is hard to value is what you the buyer will get out of the boat in the form on pleasure and pride of ownership. What im saying is that although you can monetise a boat in terms of value its not always about money. Its about what you get out of using it and doing things that bring you joy and appreciation. If this particular boat is one that you want and you can get it at a price that is acceptable to both parties then go for it. Negotiation is the key.

Good luck,

Mike
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Old 08-18-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

There are at least 3 factors you need to take into consideration.

One is the emotional factor. If you want to buy the boat for $6K, because you like them and want to help them out, then don't think too much about the boat; it is a philanthropic gesture, very considerate, and the degree to which you want to help them out is the main factor.

Second consideration - how much does a bot like that sell for in your area. You can get an idea from the 'web; assume that the sale price is 20-30% below the asking price. Depending on where you are, boats may sell high or low, fast or slow.

The most painful part of the discussion is the upgrades. I hate saying this, but the amount they paid for the upgrades - and the blood, sweat and tears they put into upgrading, are all irrelevant. It's painful but true. Regardless of the work they put into it, they still have a 1975 P26. AS you know - say it is worth $5-$6K tops. They put $20K into it? Still a 1975 P26 worth $5-$6k. Like many others, I pour money into the boat, upgrading, repairing - if I am very lucky this maintains the value, but it'll never add to the value. Money lost - boats are not a good financial investment! If you buy it at the top end - like any boat - after a couple of years you'll be lucky to recoup your investment; I bet you'll take a loss.

I think you already know this...but hope it helps....
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Old 08-19-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

I read this and being curious, I looked at the prices of those boats on the internet sales sites. I did not see a single one of them that was over $7,500.00 and most were right around $5,000.00 to $6,500.00 and had trailers with them.

You can google as well as I can, so it is not hard to find a whole lot of these boats in that price range. I know that you are kind of emotionally attached to the boat and the sellers, but in the end it is a boat. You know that a boat is only worth what someone will pay for it, and friendships are worth more than gold every day, so it may be better just to walk away from the boat if the price is going to cause hard feelings.
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Old 08-19-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

$6k.
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Old 08-19-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

Some nice big pictures would help.
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Old 08-19-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

I like the Pearson 26's. I sailed them for many years when I was teaching, and on a friends 26. If it's in good condition and with the upgrades that you've outlined there's no reason why it wouldn't sell on the open market, possibly for the price that you have estimated.

So, I'm not sure why you would purchase a boat that you don't need.
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Old 08-19-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidpm View Post
Some friends of mine have a 1975 Pearson 26. They have had the boat for probably four seasons. They used the boat very little last year and as far as I know not at all this year. They haven't said anything about selling yet but I would not be surprised if the thought has occurred to them. They have had two bad years. So my question is how to do I treat friends if they ask me if I want to buy their boat.

The problem is that they have put a lot of money into the boat.
The following is what I know about:
3,600 for the boat.
3,000 into depth, speed instruments, cushions, main-sheet blocks running rigging etc.
300 Jib
2,000 Roller fuller jib end of last year probably never used
2,000 New elect system
3,000 New outboard with remote control with I would guess 10 hours on it.

They did most of the work themselves and are very talented and did either a pretty good job or excellent over kill job.

So not including dockage and normal maintenance like paint etc they have a total of at least 14,000 into the boat.

The problem is it is a '75. And no matter what you do to a '75 it is still a very old boat.
If it was just some guy off the street I would figure the boat is worth 3,000 the 7,000 in upgrades is worth 1,000 and the outboard is worth 2,000.

That would bring the total to 6,000 which is pretty near the high end for this boat.

I really don't need a boat but they are my first students ever and I have a soft spot for the boat and all the work they put into it.
I might be able to get a couple years out of it and then I would have to sell. So the real question is even with all the upgrades if I paid 6,000 I'll bet I'll take a loss.
My friend has a sailnet account and may see this post so maybe you can set me straight on the pricing. Hopefully they will stick it out another year and not consider selling which is perfect for me. No decision necessary.
The sad reality is that it is still about a $3600.00 to $4.5k boat despite all the upgrades. The motor can be valued with or without the boat but with the boat it is generally worth less at FMV.. In that size boat the return on investment into it is next to nil. 6k for a P-26 is pretty high even for a pristine one in showroom condition.... Sub 30 footers have been hit really, really hard.

You need to take the friend thing out of it and figure what it is worth on the open market, unless you feel charitable. IMHO, based on what I see selling out there, it is still a $3600.00 to 4.5k boat....

Keep in mind these boats have plywood laminated into the keel stubs and steel keel bolts. This project alone can easily exceed the value. It would be pretty rare to see a 1975 without the plywood damp to wet...
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Last edited by Maine Sail; 08-19-2013 at 09:25 AM.
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Old 08-19-2013
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Re: How much should I offer for this boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidpm View Post
Some friends of mine have a 1975 Pearson 26. They have had the boat for probably four seasons. They used the boat very little last year and as far as I know not at all this year. They haven't said anything about selling yet but I would not be surprised if the thought has occurred to them. They have had two bad years. So my question is how to do I treat friends if they ask me if I want to buy their boat.

The problem is that they have put a lot of money into the boat.
The following is what I know about:
3,600 for the boat.
3,000 into depth, speed instruments, cushions, main-sheet blocks running rigging etc.
300 Jib
2,000 Roller fuller jib end of last year probably never used
2,000 New elect system
3,000 New outboard with remote control with I would guess 10 hours on it.

They did most of the work themselves and are very talented and did either a pretty good job or excellent over kill job.

So not including dockage and normal maintenance like paint etc they have a total of at least 14,000 into the boat.

The problem is it is a '75. And no matter what you do to a '75 it is still a very old boat.
If it was just some guy off the street I would figure the boat is worth 3,000 the 7,000 in upgrades is worth 1,000 and the outboard is worth 2,000.

That would bring the total to 6,000 which is pretty near the high end for this boat.

I really don't need a boat but they are my first students ever and I have a soft spot for the boat and all the work they put into it.
I might be able to get a couple years out of it and then I would have to sell. So the real question is even with all the upgrades if I paid 6,000 I'll bet I'll take a loss.
My friend has a sailnet account and may see this post so maybe you can set me straight on the pricing. Hopefully they will stick it out another year and not consider selling which is perfect for me. No decision necessary.
Because he's in a pickle over his spending on the boat, and because you are friends, doesn't mean you should get into a similar pickle (although you seem to be on your way already).

Unfortunately, a good deal of what's been invested in the yacht are costs that don't significantly enhance value but merely maintain it. That said, and considering your friendship and wish to not appear as if you are willing to take advantage of a friend, if I were in your position and my friend asked me if I had an interest in buying the boat, I'd explain that I understood how much he had invested in the boat and yet that I also had a fair idea of what it was really worth (without discussing a number). I'd also say that I didn't want to chance offending him and so wouldn't make an offer but, that if he were willing to take it to market for awhile, I would be willing to beat any legitimate offer he received by 10% (or whatever percentage you feel comfortable with). If he gets an offer for $4500; you'd pay him $4950. In that manner you'd be helping him out (to some degree) but not unduly burdening yourself.

FWIW...
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