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  #11  
Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?



This is a J24 plug I drilled when mine was new to put in a knot meter

ALL Jboats right up to the J160 the outer skin is only about 4 mm at most


I dug that piece of skin out of the jack stands a J160 fell on in Hungtion




The warranty was always kind of a joke in that gelcoat was not covered



Plenty of J24s and J30s (the oldest boats )have gone to boat heaven due extensive core issues
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1981 J24 Tangent 2930
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Last edited by tommays; 09-28-2013 at 04:33 PM.
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  #12  
Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatpoker View Post
Dave what am I missing here, the brochures found on line for these boats say "balsa cored hull" and the ones I have looked had balsa to within 13" of the keel.

PS. I find the word topside confusing as most use it improperly. The "topside" is the area between the water line and the toe rail, is this what you meant ?
Good thing most don't use it improperly like you. Dont be such an authority. Give me a break.
Topside - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

You have had this same issue in the past of your postings concerning C&C coring and you still have your blinders on I see

Which C&C sailboats have balsa cored hull?

While its great to use brochures to educate yourself I find first hand information to be more reliable. There are many C&C built with hulls which were cored. There also were many which were not. Trust me as I have put thru hulls in mine as well as understand its makeup. Mine is not cored completely. In certain areas but not throughout. the areas it is cored there is well over 3/4 inch of laminate on each side of the balsa end grain. well overbuilt id say. And only in some areas like the deck, coach roof etc. is it thinner, maybe 1/2 inch on either side. Many of the areas like the chain plate and where attachment points for winches were solid fiberglass well over an inch thick.

The issue is not whether they used fiberberglass or coring but how was it laid and if it has been penetrated by attachments/ bolts etc, was the area " handled" correctly. Since the topsides have many more penetratns thats where you find any problems, as the hulls have very few penetrations, and as i stated many of them are aolid glass areas.

You'd be hard pressed to find boats of today use the amount of fiberglass that the older C&Cs used. Their build quality at the time was unquestionably top notch.

It's great you have talked to Cuthbertson and know him. I too have. Especially about this issue.

One month ago I drilled out a three quarter inch hole just below the deck/ hull flange attachment for a second vent for our holding tank as the original was only 3/8 inch and didn't aerate it enough. Solid fiberglass plug in the hole saw over 1 inch thick.

What is most I important to me is the hull integrity and how it was maintained. A well maintained boat is what you should look for. I have seen many other cored hulls in great condition I wouldn't have any problem recommending. I also have seen many solid hulls I would run away from due to lack of maintainence.
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  #13  
Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chef2sail View Post
Good thing most don't use it improperly like you. Dont be such an authority. Give me a break.
Topside - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

You have had this same issue in the past of your postings concerning C&C coring and you still have your blinders on I see

Which C&C sailboats have balsa cored hull?

While its great to use brochures to educate yourself I find first hand information to be more reliable. There are many C&C built with hulls which were cored. There also were many which were not. Trust me as I have put thru hulls in mine as well as understand its makeup. Mine is not cored completely. In certain areas but not throughout. the areas it is cored there is well over 3/4 inch of laminate on each side of the balsa end grain. well overbuilt id say. And only in some areas like the deck, coach roof etc. is it thinner, maybe 1/2 inch on either side. Many of the areas like the chain plate and where attachment points for winches were solid fiberglass well over an inch thick.

The issue is not whether they used fiberberglass or coring but how was it laid and if it has been penetrated by attachments/ bolts etc, was the area " handled" correctly. Since the topsides have many more penetratns thats where you find any problems, as the hulls have very few penetrations, and as i stated many of them are aolid glass areas.

You'd be hard pressed to find boats of today use the amount of fiberglass that the older C&Cs used. Their build quality at the time was unquestionably top notch.

It's great you have talked to Cuthbertson and know him. I too have. Especially about this issue.

One month ago I drilled out a three quarter inch hole just below the deck/ hull flange attachment for a second vent for our holding tank as the original was only 3/8 inch and didn't aerate it enough. Solid fiberglass plug in the hole saw over 1 inch thick.

What is most I important to me is the hull integrity and how it was maintained. A well maintained boat is what you should look for. I have seen many other cored hulls in great condition I wouldn't have any problem recommending. I also have seen many solid hulls I would run away from due to lack of maintainence.
No need to be so touchy Dave but I suggest you consult a maritime dictionary for a definition of "topside" as it applies to boats. If I may duggest one, how about Admiral W.H.Smyth's "The Sailors Word Book".

As to you mkIII having a balsa cored hull, well I guess George Cuthbertson must be wrong if you say so.
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  #14  
Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatpoker View Post
No need to be so touchy Dave but I suggest you consult a maritime dictionary for a definition of "topside" as it applies to boats. If I may duggest one, how about Admiral W.H.Smyth's "The Sailors Word Book".

As to you mkIII having a balsa cored hull, well I guess George Cuthbertson must be wrong if you say so.
No ones being touchy my friend. It was your presumptuous post of grammatical superiority about the word topsides. I guess you haven't progressed to using Websters Dictionary yet.
Quote:
PS. I find the word topside confusing as most use it improperly. The "topside" is the area between the water line and the toe rail, is this what you meant ? Boatpoker
As far as Cuthbertsons statement you perhaps have taken it out of context. I have met and spoken with him a few times over the course of my C&C ownership at rondevous and such and he explained the use of the balsa in stiffening the hull, and also indicated that if properly maintained should present no serious problems or issues. He never once found or stated that is was an inherent weakness of the boat or.hull, and in fact stated that the way C&C did the process improved the boat. He also stated how they purposely overbuilt it, and did not use less fiberglass thickness than the previous MKI which was a SOLID laminate hull.

I pretty much explained about the hull on our C&C 35 MKIii as did others in the previous Sailnet thread where other actiual C&C owners identified misstatements of yours. If you read it carefully, many models previously to the newer ones
were solid hulls. That's a fact that others who own the boats posted. Our 35 MKIII models hull is not entirely cored and where it is it has 3/4 inch laminate on either side of the core. As previously stayed, way overbuilt compared to the Js 4 mm. Since there are very few penetrations into the core on the hull, mainly thru hulls, if properly maintained there should be no issues. In my MKIII where the factory thru hulls were placed, there was a large area surrounding them where the core was hollowed out replaced by fiberglass.

As stated by other. C&C owners in the previous quoted thread which you obviously skipped over or discounted as it didn't fit into your opinion, most issues concerning the balsa core have appeared TOPSIDES on the deck or coach house. As stated by these same owners very few if any have seen issues with the C&C hull coring which was done to lighten the boats as well as stiffen them for competitiveness in performance.

Hopefully this clears this up for others who are looking to buy older C&C boats. I find while true owners love the boats thy bought, the also are willing and know enough about their boats to discuss heir inherent weaknesses and are willing to do so. Almost all of us have discounted your statements about the cored hull weakness of C&C myth.

So who do you listen to...a powerboatsers reading brochures.......or C&C owners who have posted in this or the other imbedded threads.

Just saying
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  #15  
Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chef2sail View Post
Good thing most don't use it improperly like you. Dont be such an authority. Give me a break.
Topside - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
....
It is pretty humorous but not surprising that a source like M-W might get a marine definition wrong, or at least incomplete, but I think it utterly silly that a SN KIA would get something so simple, well, so wrong. And then go on, and on, and on...
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  #16  
Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chef2sail View Post

So who do you listen to...a powerboatsers reading brochures.......or C&C owners who have posted in this or the other imbedded threads.

Just saying
That's funny Let me pose another question ....
So who do you listen, to a MkIII owner or C&C ?
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Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chef2sail View Post
No ones being touchy my friend. It was your presumptuous post of grammatical superiority about the word topsides. I guess you haven't progressed to using Websters Dictionary yet.
Boatpoker had it right.

2 (often topsides) the upper part of a ship’s side, above the waterline: newly painted topsides.

Of course I have progressed to using the OED - Websters is only a whistle stop on the way to correct English.
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Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Jon with due respect

Look up again what I said I used the word
Quote:
topside
.....I didnt say topsides.

THe two have very different meanings which ever dumb ass dictionary you want to use.

I said topside as to go topside the topside of the boat, which is usually the deck of some sort

You and you buddy boatpoker are sing the term TOPSIDES. See the s there .the s changes the meaning. Topsides IS the side of the hull above the waterline. BUT I didn't use that word did I now. I used the word TOPSIDE

Now for the other hater, sailingfool, if being right makes me a SN KIA what does being wrong make you....a SN DA.?

Just so you don't think I only use Webster...a good start by the way. Look at the definition in this nautical marine sailing dictionary. It clearly defines topside from topsides. Maybe this will help Boatpoker with his confusion when he gets the difference between using the s and not. His term topside is NOT the side of the boat.

Nautical Dictionary, Glossary and Terms directory: Search Results
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  #19  
Old 09-28-2013
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Lemme reiterate... Capri 25... NO balsa core. Ok, the keel.. but that is it.
http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/ma...chDrawings.pdf
Page 6...

Capri 25, holds up better than gulp, a J/24
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Re: Would you buy an early 80's cored hull boat?

Chef - do you know what the correct response would be on SA?
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