Ok, how about a McVay Bluenose Sloop? Jeff_H, anyone?

[Jeff_H]

Ah now you have hit upon a couple of my real favorite topics. I must admit at the ''gitgo'' that I have a tremendous prejudice towards the work of Starling Burgess, who, of course was the designer of Atlantic. I consider Burgess to be one of the great designers of all time. In so many ways he was a real renaissance man creating new ideas in so many fields of endeavor. He is perhaps only rivaled for pure creative genius by someone like Nat Herreshoff. The Atlantic really is an extremely clever design. The knuckle bow really allowed a very flat entry angle and the fairly flat counter allowed a very flat run. These like the Herreschoff S boats would have been rule beaters in the extreme offering much better performance than the rules of their day would have predicted. Proportionately, Atlantics actually had fairly short overhangs compared to some of their contemporaries such as the Resolutes or Luders 16''s.

That said, in an absolute sense, the Atlantic is a pretty long boat (a tick over 30 feet if I remember correctly) for a rating of 171. While I could not find a PHRF rating for the Atlantic, if it does have a PHRF rating of 171 that would not be all that fast a rating for a 30 compared to a J-24 for example which is 6 feet shorter, sailing on a substantially shorter waterline and is only rated 3-6 seconds a mile slower.

Respectfully,
Jeff

[wrevans]

I thought I would add a few thoughts to this thread now that I have launched and sailed (almost obsessively) my Bluenose Sloop.

My first impression is that this boat is a blast to sail. I have no where near the experience Jeff_H has so this is completely subjective. But I have been sailing alone and with a friend without an engine and have enjoyed this little boat. I don’t have any instrumentation but I am guessing (actually I check the ferry reports for my sailing area) that my winds have been 10-20 knots with a boat speed of between 5 & 7 knots.

The downside of fractional rigs:

I searched far and wide for a boat with fractional rigging for many of the reasons Jeff states but mostly to keep sail control aft of the mast. This boat does exactly that (or it will when I rig the reefing gear). The downside however is that you can’t easily add additional sail area. My Bluenose has a great SA/D ratio but since I sail without an engine light air performance for me is 1 to 4 knots. With the fractional rig with jumper stay it is painful to add a large drifter or asym (although I am going to try).

Modern verse traditional (ok old) designs:

I sometimes wondered when I read these boards about the merits of old versus new designs if this argument is like those in other industries. Anyone could argue that the computer I am typing this on is not worth turning on anymore. I think in the end we buy the type of boat that draws us to it. In my case this little “Universal Rule” Bluenose sloop gets me out on the water and brings me back smiling.

Bill
Lopez Island, WA

[dman]

Quote" My first impression is that this boat is a blast to sail. I have no where near the experience Jeff_H has so this is completely subjective. But I have been sailing alone and with a friend without an engine and have enjoyed this little boat." end quote This is where you are wrong my friend you have more experience with this boat because you are one of the few who has had the pleasure of sailing these boats.There is theory and then there is reality,sometimes they are the same ,other times they are not.The seat of the pants test is the best indicator of what works for you.Having a solid modest boat that fits your needs is great.There are too many people out there that depend on the bank loans to get out on the water.Going in debt for a pleasure craft can be the worst experience in boating.Good luck to you and remmeber you are now the "expert" when it comes to these boats.

[rmohr]

Bill,
I just purchased a McVay Bluenose Sloop that I finally found in Vancouver, BC. I first saw "B1" at the Halifax Maritime Museum 5 years ago and it was love at first sight. My boat is currently being restored over the winter and I will be taking it home to Kelowna, BC next season, where it will live in the fresh water of Lake Okanagan.

I read your message on the sailnet board and would greatly appreciate any feedback or advice you may have. I do not know much about the boat''s history other than it has been in the Vancouver area for 10 years and sails under the name "Ragtime". I do not know the sail# - My sail only has a "B" on it. Can you tell me how your sail # relates to the Hull# on the plaque? I am excited about sailing this particular boat and was very happy to hear about your experience. I look forward to any assitance you might provide. Thanks again.

Bob

[gstraub]

I don''t know anything about these boats except that a dock neighbor had one and I always admired it. Congratulations on the new boat.

Gerhard

[rlegate]

I have read with interest the theoretical perspectives of the Bluenose. I have owned and race converted a mcvay for racing for 10 years. Roue was not a designer who went on the latest trends. Proven concepts had to go into his designs. My personal experience is they are fast. They are very forgiving when you screw up, taking on a gallon of water and turning into the wind, water scupperred in 15 seconds. The rudder off the keel makes them impossible to broach vs the wide beam modern designs which like to get knocked over lift the rudder out of the water and violently spin. With race rigging you can spill two thirds of the main and drive them in 25 knots. They are very good at everything and not bad at anything. I race against sharks one of which is a canadian champion and when I race well I do well. They spin on a dime and drive through chop if you foot them 5 degrees off close hauled. I have had people offer to buy the boat unsolicited and I am constantly being complimented on her looks. The boat weights 2000 lbs. with 900 lbs of keel and 210 square feet of sail she's solid and will drive in almost no air.

fyi R Legate Blue Heat 281

[Sailormann]

+1 ...what rlegate said. I owned one of the wooden Bluenoses. They are very nimble exciting boats and there are not many boats of its size that can keep up. Enjoy your boats folks and take care of them. They are not building nice ones like that anymore.

[mikehoyt]

There is currently a very large fleet - well over 20 boats - sailing one design at Chester Yacht Club in Nova Scotia. The skippers are extremely competitive and are putting lots of money into their boats.

The bluenose was a great design and sails very well.

Mike

[rlegate]

To add to that, Dr. Greg Flynn, John Campbell, and myself have created a N. A. Inland Racing Association. Greg has been a long time Chester Nova Scotia Racer who now resides in Ontario. We have created the McVay Cup Regatta which we first heald at Bay of Quinte Yacht Club Belleville, Ontario Lake Ontario bqyc.org this june. We are currently moving the regatta to September 12 weekend to encourage more racers ( nova scotians) to come. We are moving our rules towards the Nova Scotia BN Association rules but for now just want any bluenose with any sails or rigs to participate. There are many bn in ontario up state new york ect. Please encourage all to come to our venue, and promote the fleet.

R Legate

[spiritspr]

I sailed by a bluenose on the Potomac River in Washington DC and chased her down just to find out more about it. Didn't catch her name, but what a beauty! I look forward to learning more about them, so thanks for the guidance.