Need recommendations for a 30ft

[aPeacefulWarrior]

My girlfriend and I have been sailing for a couple of years now on small boats (15 foot) and eventually want to to cruise around the world. Recently we bought a very capable 27ft offshore cruiser to live on while developing our sailing skills. We are starting to think that this was a big mistake. We are still beginers and feel that the boat is too difficult for us to sail. It seems to be designed for more experienced sailors. Also, we don't really plan on sailing offshore for many many years untill we have become more confidant. In the mean time, we now have a boat that we feel is way more then we need in terms of strength but not nearly enough in terms of space, storage, and livability(although shouldn't these things be important in an offshore cruiser??). It's really been bugging me that the boat is only 8.5 feet wide to make it tailorable even though we don't plan on ever trailoring it. Also, it has a 4 foot bowspirt that we don't need but have to pay for at the marina. Thats 4 feet that could be added to the interior space of the boat. We also spent way too much money.

Ok, enough about my life story. Here is what I wanted to ask about:

I need recommendations on boats that are about 30 feet, have a functional interior, are good for beginners, and are reliable. The main place we will be sailing is in the San Francisco bay, but being able to do some coastal cruising would be a plus. Money is limited too. $20,000 would be able the highest we could(or would want to) go.

Catalina 30's seem to cover at least some of these requirrements, but I don't know much about them. It's interior will give a good idea of what we are looking for. I believe that they are also built in California, so maybe they are designed with the righ conditions in mind? It also seems that I could get a good deal on one of these. I am having trouble figuring out which other boats I should be looking at.

Thanks for any help!

[PBzeer]

While I'm sure you'll get recommendations from here, you might just want to walk the docks and see what other people in your area are sailing. Plus you would have the advantage of probably being able to go aboard some of them. Most all of the sailing folk I have met are more than happy to help out in such ways. For myself, I've learned quite a bit, just sitting around sharing a beer at the marina.

Good luck,
John

[Jim H]

Warrior, thanks for the interesting post.

We looked at 30 footers up here in the Pacific Northwest, and the Catalinas aren't bad and I believe it's a plus that you can still buy parts for them from Catalina. Buying one that is as "young" as possible isn't a bad idea.

A Cal 29 or 30 is also an option, but not all are going to be in great shape. You can also check out the Islander 30s in your area. Our preference ran to the C&C boats, and looking at both a 29 and a 30 may be worth your time (they are significantly different). We liked the build quality of the C&Cs, and they are pretty simple yet fun to sail.

Here's one of my favorite sites about sailing So. Cal in a 30 foot Islander:

http://inetd.com/Boat/SanDiego05/

Given the notes about your recent boat, it sounds like you would like something easier to sail and more responsive, but maybe not super performance-orientated (J-30) or with an overly complicated rig. There are lots of thirty footers of this type.

Just out of curiosity, did you have a Nor Sea 27? We just looked at one for fun, and I was wondering how difficult it was to sail (weight, rigging, etc.). It's not uncommon for some people to start with "overly built" boats for their needs-- Don Casey writes about this at the beginning of his "This Old Boat" book.

Good luck!

Jim H

[aPeacefulWarrior]

Yes, what you said is what we are looking for. Something easier to sail and more responsive. Something not too complicated. It's good to hear that there are alot of choices in this range.

And yes, you are correct. She is a NorSea! She is a very beautiful boat. Very well made and strong. Shes just not for us, at least not yet. She was not very responsive and the rigging was not too complicated, although there are somethings like the reefing system that we never could figure out or get the hang of. The licenced sea captain who we did the sea trial with also didn't know how it worked and was not used to how the boat in general sailed. I don't know if this is how it is for all Nor'seas or just ours. Anyway, I am sure that they are great for more experienced offshore sailors!

Thanks for the tips! We will look at the boats that you mentioned and post back here with our findings.

-aPeacefulWarrior

[Jim H]

One other small suggestion-- it was very beneficial for us to learn about and join the local sailing community. That could mean going to free seminars offered by different clubs, visiting a cruising or racing club meeting and hearing about membership, volunteering as crew for different events (even if just on a race committee boat).

For someone new to it all, it may seem like the members of the local sailing community have a lot of insight and inside information about the best boats and best deals around. This assumption is basically correct. You might spend hours researching the Internet and finding a slip for X dollars a foot, whereas a member of community might know of a private slip at a boat house available for half as much. You might look at all the YachtWorld listings, but a local sailor might know of three boats that aren't even listed but in great shape, maintained by serious and conscientious owners, and possibly perfect for your area.

I like learning from other's inside knowledge, and seeing and sailing on other's boats can be much more valuable than studying specs. Try to experience as many boats as possilbe, by crewing or even renting, and you'll only be happier with your decision in the end.

Good luck!

Jim H

[aPeacefulWarrior]

Hey thanks for the tips. I have asked some local sailors and have seen some boats and based on what they have said and what I like, I have came up with a list. What I intially liked was about the interiors and price... I do not know enough to determine how a boat might sail or how easy it is to sail or how strong it is, but I do really care about these things.

almand 30
cal 2-30
catalina 30
ericson 30
lancer 30
irwin 30
islander 30
islander 32
newport 30
pearson 31
pearson 32

How do they sail? How strong are they and hows the quality? What problems are common? Which ones would most likely fit our needs(that we posted earlier)? Are any of them way off? Thanks! Sorry if I am asking too much!

[LyleRussell]

I have spent several weeks aboard a Newport 30 and found them to be fairly cheaply built.

SF Bay has a reputation as a heavy air place. I would get a boat with a good reefing system that you know how to work. NOTHING grows ones confidence like a reef in time.

I like J-30's for what that is worth to you. Put a roller furler on her. Two survived the 79 Fastnet race without significant damage.

In heavy air you station the most chicken person at the mainsheet and tell her/him to ease it when the heel angle gets uncomfortable. Then gradually pull it in as the speed builds.

[sailingdog]

It might be wise to sail on a few different boats of the size you're looking at, before you buy again. SF Bay does have strong winds, so a good reefing system is a necessity. Walking the docks, and looking at boats is also a good idea.

[Faster]

Keeping in mind your limited budget and your intended (heavy weather) sailing area, realize that old bagged out sails will quickly overpower any boat in a good breeze. "Bargain" boats are not likely to have great sails, so maybe try to keep some budget free to address that issue sooner rather than later! The difference in control and heeling/weather helm etc is quite amazing when you go from old rags to a decent flatter-shaped sail that is right for the conditions.
Cat 30s are reportedly quite stiff compared to most other similar sized boats, for whatever that's worth.
Good Luck - it's always fun to shop around.