Need advice on boat size/displacement, please - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Boat Review and Purchase Forum
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 03-02-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 288
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
FrankLanger is on a distinguished road
Need advice on boat size/displacement, please

I will be buying a boat for coastal sailing (not blue water) in British Columbia--sailing Strait of Georgia, Gulf Islands, etc. year round. I will be doing alot of single handing. While I am mainly considering a 32 foot Ericson or Aloha, I have been encouraged by brokers to also consider slightly smaller boats, like 28 - 29 foot. They suggest that smaller boats would be less expensive, cheaper moorage and easier to maneuver into slips while single handing.

While I can see those advantages, I do not want to skimp on space (for those times when my wife or a friend will accompany me for a weekend or so--therefore also need a quarter berth and head), but am more concerned that a smaller, lighter boat wouldn't be able to handle winds/weather as well or "punch" through the waves/chop as a heavier boat. My checking so far shows that most of the 28 - 30 foot boats that I would consider are about 6800 lbs. displacement, and the 32 - 33 foot boats are around 10,000 lbs. As performance/speed is also important to me, I am only considering cruiser/racers, not heavier boats like Pacific Seacraft, Alberg, etc. which I think are too slow in lighter winds.

So my question, what would you consider the minimum reasonable displacement for a coastal cruising sailboat in a broad range of sailing conditions--winds can be very light in the protected Gulf islands, but stronger in the Strait of Georgia, though I likely would not be sailing in more than about 30 knots of wind, or waves above about 6 ft. I know there are always exceptions, but I am looking for your thoughts on whether I am being overly restrictive by focusing on 32 - 33 foot, 10,000 lb. boats, and maybe overlooking the possibility of a good 28 - 30 foot, 6800 lb. boat.

Although I have sailed for about 12 years, most of this has been on interior lakes, and my coastal sailing has been limited to 34 foot boat charters for a week at a time. As I am far from the coast, I don't have the opportunity to test this out myself, and when I do charter on the coast, my wife is along, and I don't want to take her out in more challenging conditions just yet.

Thanks for any thoughts/advice on this.

Frank.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 03-02-2006
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 19
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Allan C&C Less is on a distinguished road
Thumbs up Ahoy!!

I wish to say I have never sailed the Pacific coast...at least not yet!!!
I have sailed the Great Lakes as well as 2 stints in the Caribbean(2mths & 19mths).
Here's my 2 cents worth.... first set down and carefully figure what type of sailing you plan and doing ???? Racing,coastal cruising for a day or 2 or offshore sailing for extended periods of time. Once you have decided on the type of sailing you will be doing...then you should select a boat that fits your sailing needs. I mean you wouldn't want to race in a Pacific Seacraft or Cape Dory. But would you go on a offshore extended bluewater cruise in J35???? You could get a racer and modify it to a cruiser...guys have done it...but its costly.....
as far as the 2 boats you mention...I would highly recommend the Aloha. I know them well!!! Very well built and seaworthy and good performers too. I bit tender tho. Something your wife will probably hate which means more likely you will sail less!!!! A factor you should also consider. When I was younger and got my first boat (C&C) I never took that into account and it was a big mistake. I eventually sold her. The Ericson I wouldn't consider. Even more tender and although they look attractive they don't handle well in a blow!!!! I would not go smaller unless it was a slug like a Bristol Channel Cutter and they are cheap! You should also figure out a budget and count on spending 10k on upgrades/refitting.

Here's some to consider: Tartan 33 &34, Sabre 32&34, Aloha 32&34, CS(Canadian Sailcraft) 30&33, Cape Dory 33, Bristol 29.9,Contessa32 (great bluewater performance boat but a little small down below)
Ontario 32, C&C 30 MK1 very stiff boat& good performance! The rest of the C&C's are very tender.
Let me know once you have thought things thru what type of sailing you plan and doing. Plan for 5 years+++Then I can make specific suggestions.

Fair winds, Allan
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 03-02-2006
paulk's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: CT/ Long Island Sound
Posts: 2,533
Thanks: 4
Thanked 20 Times in 19 Posts
Rep Power: 15
paulk is on a distinguished road
From what I've heard, winds can be pretty spotty and light there in the Summertime, so reasonable performance should be a defiinite goal. I would not be as concerned with the tenderness of the C&C line because of the generally light wind and the ease of reducing sail (even if singlehanding) by rolling up the jib and jiffy-reefing or striking the main (especially with lazyjacks or a Dutchman system.) A C&C 33 or 34 would provide creature comforts for nice weekends away without being a slug. J/Boats are also nice performers in light air. The J/28 has quite a comfortable cruising setup, but they can be pricey. My brother sails his J/30 on the left coast, mosty between Juneau and Sitka, having made the trip (inside) up from Seattle. Though it's not as comfy as the J/28, it was a lot less expensive. He also has fun racing. There are a lot of boats out there. Have fun looking!
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 03-02-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 288
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
FrankLanger is on a distinguished road
Alan, thanks for your detailed reply. I think I am clear on the type of sailing I want to do: coastal cruising on the BC coast between Vancouver Island and the mainland of BC--ie. Strait of Georgia, Gulf Islands, San Juan Islands, Sunshine Coast area (on the mainland side, north of Vancouver). I will not be racing, nor heading off shore into blue water, but while winds are often light in the areas I have mentioned during the summer, it can blow pretty hard across the Strait of Georgia, so I need a boat that can be sailed reasonably well in up to 30 knots and about 6 foot waves (more than that and I hope to be either at the dock or anchored safely in a protected bay). I anticipate that about 60% of my sailing will be single handed, with the remainder being accompanied by my wife (willing but not too capable sailor) or a friend (a good crew). I plan to sail most months of the year (will be retiring, so can pick my days).

The boats on my short list are: Aloha 32/34, Ericson 32/35, C&C 33, Crown 34, Newport 31/33 and Catalina 30. With the exception of the Newport and Catalina, which are my last and unlikely choices, the others all have a fairly good reputation for the type of sailing I want to do, and are in my price range (I am looking at boats from about 1978 - 1988, usually priced at about 30K to 50K Canadian $, in good condition).

However, I have come across an Aloha 30 which looks quite nice, and a C&C 29 in excellent condition, both of which have a good reputation but are only about 6800 lbs. displacement compared to the approximately 10,000 lb. displacement of the boats I listed above--hence my question: Can a 6800 lb. boat handle 30 knot winds and six foot waves well enough to justify me considering the Aloha 30 and C&C 29, given the advantage of easier maneuverability/docking when single handing, or will these boats get tossed around in the waves alot more than the larger boats or get blown around when I approach the dock--ie, I should stick to my earlier plan of buying a 32 to 34 foot boat for the conditions and sailing I plan to do?

Thanks for your post, and I welcome any opinions/advice.

Thanks,
Frank.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 03-03-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,120
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 13
WHOOSH is on a distinguished road
Frank, my reaction to your posts is that you have clearly (and accurately) defined the kind of sailing you'll be doing and have an equally clear view of your (boat) preferences.

WRT your broker's cautions about a 32-34' boat being harder to handle, I don't agree. The difference between handling a 3.5 and 5 ton boat is going to quickly become negligible for you once you have a bit of experience with her. OTOH the difference in motion, inertia, storage and the ability to accommodate guests will always be greater in the larger hull; I think your initial inclination to look in the 5 ton range is sensible.

OTOH there will be cost consequences beyond the purchase price and, in that regard, your broker is making a valid point. Having said that, I think your task as a buyer is to decide what you want that you can afford, not what you can afford that may be less than what you want. If you have a clear view of the cost differences for the larger boat and feel comfortable with them (I would think they are more minor than major), then this too is not a major factor in your choice.

I'd like to see you entertain a broader range of choices. The CS and Ontario boats mentioned above would seem worth considering. If considering an Ericson, why not a later model Cal 34? I realize that the range of choices up there in the 'NW Corner' of N America can be somewhat limited, but I'd like to see you stretch a bit in finding some add'l choices before moving to your final 'shopping list'. Good luck to you!

Jack
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 03-03-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 288
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
FrankLanger is on a distinguished road
Jack, thanks for your thoughtful reply, and your suggestion that I broaden my choice of boats. I have been looking regularly on Yachtworld, and will continue to do so. I have been checking photos and specs on all sailboats in the BC/Northwest Pacific region, and reading boat reviews on this Sailnet site and on various boat-specific websites. I am a bit limited in wanting a boat with a quarterberth and a handheld shower, fin keel (not full or shoal), preferably with rebuilt motor, new standing rigging, newer sails and a "pampered" boat. I have only found one Ontario, and it wasn't in great condition, and the CS that I reviewed didn't have a quarterberth/shower. But I will be very thorough in my search, and will keep your suggestions in mind--I have learned that even boats of the same year, by the same boat builder, often have different options and amenities.
Thanks again.
Frank.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 03-03-2006
PBzeer's Avatar
Wandering Aimlessly
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Cruising
Posts: 19,933
Thanks: 0
Thanked 81 Times in 78 Posts
Rep Power: 14
PBzeer has a spectacular aura about PBzeer has a spectacular aura about PBzeer has a spectacular aura about
Here's a site I found helpful in my searching, that might be of some use to you.

http://sailquest.com/market/index.htm

John
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 03-03-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 288
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
FrankLanger is on a distinguished road
Thanks, John. That provides good comparison information on various models.
Frank.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #9  
Old 03-04-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 253
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 11
mgiguere is on a distinguished road
An Obscure Alternative

The requirements you have are similar to he ones I've been living with for the last 20 years. I single (or shorthand) mostly and I believe the layout of the boat makes the big difference. My boat easily single hands because the wheel is forward (in the cockpit) and the primaries are directly on either side of me and the main sheet behind. Although the boat is 40 years old (Chris Craft Apache 37), it's relatively narrow (10 ft), has a fin keel with a bulb, so it drives like a soling...easy to moor or drive into slip by yourself. It was designed by Sparkman & Stephens after the S&S Americas Cup winner "Intrepid". At 14,000 pounds it is not intimidated by 6 foot seas and is solid such that it sails through the water rather than bounce around a lot like you would experience in a lighter, smaller boat. With its design, (and new sails) it rather easily achieves its hull speed of 7 1/2 knots. As an older fiberglass boat, it's unusually strongly built.

I know everyone thinks their boat is great, but this one has served me well. I posted a picture up on this site if you want to take a look.

Good luck in your search.

Moe
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #10  
Old 03-04-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,120
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 13
WHOOSH is on a distinguished road
Frank, given the add'l info on your preferences and the limits you face geographically re: your search, my hunch is that you have to give up on some to get the others. A shower can be retrofitted, of course. And redoing the wire rigging doesn't break the bank and can be done by you, as well. Sounds like 'pampered' and 'fresh or rebuilt engine', all by themselves, are establishing an awfully fine filter, in which case my preference would be 'pampered' first and all the other 'system' preferences second (and perhaps 'nice to haves'). Good luck!

Jack
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New name (I know, I know) owlmtn Boat Review and Purchase Forum 13 12-13-2009 07:46 PM
Cape Fear 38 goduke Boat Review and Purchase Forum 24 06-21-2008 11:30 AM
the perfect 20'' cruising boat? jbarros Boat Review and Purchase Forum 14 04-18-2004 06:45 PM
Best way to sell???? Sailmale General Discussion (sailing related) 2 05-13-2003 06:22 PM
To Jeff H Bodo Boat Review and Purchase Forum 7 08-08-2001 09:06 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:52 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.