Skipping CA tax ? - Page 3 - SailNet Community
 12Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #21 of 35 Old 05-27-2014
"Nubile Southern Sailor"
 
christian.hess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Columbus, Ga
Posts: 4,540
Thanks: 185
Thanked 184 Times in 180 Posts
Rep Power: 2
 
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

I should add that this only works for small $$$ amount boat sales and the like


if your buying a 100k boat and saying its costing only 5k your soon to be in trouble...well sort of jajaja

salvage vessels and abandoned vessels usually dont apply and sold as is, per bill of sale will clear confusion

but I agree dont go boldly lying

in the ops case Im not really understanding the big problem really, its really easy to buy a boat in ca, go to dmv and pay your small fee...pink slip a few weeks later and your good to travel...

if you sail over to hawaii check what hawaii dmv does with out of state boats and what it costs to transfer title over

my 2 cents

Islander 36 now FOR SALE!
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
christian.hess is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #22 of 35 Old 05-27-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Narragansett Bay
Posts: 11,106
Thanks: 46
Thanked 229 Times in 214 Posts
Rep Power: 7
   
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

Again, I don't know CA, but here you are required to provide an affidavit from the seller that you truly purchased below market. Therefore, the seller is also subject to fraud and highly unlikely to agree to pretend they weren't paid more.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Jeanneau 54DS

In the harsh marine environment, something is always in need of repair. Margaritas fix everything.
Minnewaska is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #23 of 35 Old 05-27-2014
"Nubile Southern Sailor"
 
christian.hess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Columbus, Ga
Posts: 4,540
Thanks: 185
Thanked 184 Times in 180 Posts
Rep Power: 2
 
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

well I can see where it would be fraud if you as a seller are overstating the price...

guess it works both ways

I guess I was also implying that the dmv doesnt no jack squat when it comes to boat values...

so there is no real way to enforce what the "value" is on sailboats in this case...its really not feasible I think

but 7 boats or so I have had now all in califiornia well except my current one every time I go register it its common knowleadge you undervalue it...

in fact at the dmv they would tell me something along the lines of you dont have to say what it really costs etc...

just sayin

same thing out or "dmv" down here....the tellers are usually put whatever price you want on there and get out of my face! jajaja

Islander 36 now FOR SALE!
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
christian.hess is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #24 of 35 Old 05-27-2014
Old enough to know better
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Beacon, NY
Posts: 3,094
Thanks: 19
Thanked 128 Times in 124 Posts
Rep Power: 9
 
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

I think more important than taxes do you have someplace to put it when you get to HI? I have heard nothing but headaches of people trying to find a slip. I have family on Maui, and would LOVE to move there and liveabord. But it sounds like a very unfriendly boating environment.
miatapaul is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #25 of 35 Old 05-27-2014
Senior Member
 
overbored's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dana Point, Ca
Posts: 1,192
Thanks: 1
Thanked 62 Times in 62 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

In California you will pay use tax on boat unless it is sold by a dealer that has a sellers permit and then he collects sales tax. The DMV will charge you the use tax and it does not matter where you use the boat. the dmv does not have a sellers permit so they can not charge you sales tax, they collect the use tax for the BOE. buy the boat and document it with the HI address. stay away from the DMV. if CA wants there tax they will send you the bill and the first bill will not have any penalties if you pay it on time
FAQ - Use Tax on Purchases of Vehicles, Vessels, Aircraft - Board of Equalization
christian.hess likes this.

"FULL TILT II" 2011 BENETEAU FIRST 30
"FULL TILT" SOVEREL 33
"GOLD RUSH" PRINDLE 16

Last edited by overbored; 05-27-2014 at 11:31 PM.
overbored is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #26 of 35 Old 05-28-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Narragansett Bay
Posts: 11,106
Thanks: 46
Thanked 229 Times in 214 Posts
Rep Power: 7
   
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

Overboard..... Great link. It clearly says that Use Tax is also due on documented vessels.

Quote:
.........purchasers of aircraft or documented vessels from any person other than a person required to hold a seller's permit by reason of the number, scope, and character of the person's sales of documented vessels or of aircraft, as the case may be and not otherwise specifically exempt shall report and pay tax to the board.

http://www.boe.ca.gov/lawguides/busi...sutr/1610.html
However, you are exempt under this circumstance......

Quote:
However, a purchaser is not required to pay California use tax if the only use of the vehicle purchased from a private party in California is to remove it from the state and it will be used solely thereafter outside this state.

Ref: http://www.boe.ca.gov/pdf/pub52.pdf
The nuance is what they define as use. I would assume taking her for a sail is use. I still wonder if keeping her on the hard until removed from the state is considered use.
christian.hess likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Jeanneau 54DS

In the harsh marine environment, something is always in need of repair. Margaritas fix everything.

Last edited by Minnewaska; 05-28-2014 at 03:31 AM.
Minnewaska is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #27 of 35 Old 05-28-2014
"Nubile Southern Sailor"
 
christian.hess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Columbus, Ga
Posts: 4,540
Thanks: 185
Thanked 184 Times in 180 Posts
Rep Power: 2
 
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

very good link...

Islander 36 now FOR SALE!
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
christian.hess is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #28 of 35 Old 05-28-2014
ASA and PSIA Instructor
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,566
Thanks: 7
Thanked 24 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 16
 
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

The CA personnel responsible for collecting use taxes are a lot more expert at tax evasion than any SN posters. So to the OP, if you buy the boat in CA pay the 8% use tax immediately and enjoy your new purchase, or buy the boat in HI.

Even if you fudge a bill of sale, attempts to hide the value can run aground on the USCG Bill of Sale, your insurance policy's declared value, plus if any financing is involved. For example, I believe the USCG B/S is a public document and you will need to provide a copy of your insurance binder to any CA yard or marina you enter.

Failure to pay promptly (based on the purchase date) will result in assessment of penalties and interest, which start accumulating on the use tax due date, not when CA discovers your debt.

A personal experience - back in the mid-90s while a MN resident I paid off a four year old MA demand for a use tax for a boat I hadn't owned for six years, one purchased in ME while I was a MA resident. MA discovered my name in a audit of the builder. MA had no evidence I ever brought the boat to MA, their attitude was I had to prove that I had not... Eventually I used my out-of-state remoteness to get the state to waive the penalty and interest in return for the tax. Otherwise it was getting dicey even to return to MA for vacation...

Certified...in several regards...

Last edited by sailingfool; 05-28-2014 at 03:06 PM.
sailingfool is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #29 of 35 Old 05-28-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: San Francisco Bay area
Posts: 2,616
Thanks: 5
Thanked 62 Times in 62 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

I would most definitely not suggest evading a tax that is due. However, I believe the original poster's question was about buying a boat in CA, as a resident of HI, and not having CA sales/use tax become due. There may be some circumstances in which this is the case, but I'd strongly suggest getting the info from the horses's mouth so to speak, ie the tax franchises of HI and CA.

Bristol 31.1, San Francisco Bay
MarkSF is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #30 of 35 Old 05-28-2014
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: San Francisco Bay area
Posts: 2,616
Thanks: 5
Thanked 62 Times in 62 Posts
Rep Power: 5
 
Re: Skipping CA tax ?

This is an interesting paragraph from Minnewaska's link :

"For a purchaser to qualify for the exemption from use tax, title (ownership) and possession of the vehicle or vessel must transfer to the purchaser outside of California. When a purchaser exercises control over the vehicle or vessel in California prior to the planned out-of-state delivery, ownership transfers to the purchaser in California. Therefore, if any person other than the seller, or an agent acting on behalf of the seller, delivers the vehicle or vessel from California to the purchaser at an out-of-state location, ownership transfers to the purchaser in California, and California use tax applies. For example, if a purchaser asks a friend or hires a common carrier to deliver the pr operty from California to him or herself at an out-of-state location, use tax applies."

It seems you can't even hire a delivery crew.

Bristol 31.1, San Francisco Bay
MarkSF is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tax Question... palomar General Discussion (sailing related) 15 02-03-2012 01:16 PM
Sales tax - is this right?? labatt Boat Review and Purchase Forum 46 01-02-2007 06:23 PM
tax SimonV General Discussion (sailing related) 20 07-31-2006 12:04 PM
tax christinero General Discussion (sailing related) 1 07-28-2006 02:57 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome