Hinckley Pilot 35

[Kerwood]

Any thoughts on mid 1960's Hinckley pilot 35 and what pricing should be?

[Jeff_H]

I guess that I would have to ask, how do you plan to use the boat and where you sail. Hinckley Pilots have always had a warm spot in my heart. These were the first boats that I ever crewed on in a race. They were well constructed and beautifully detailed. There is a different aesthetic to sailing these old boats that can be very appealing. Boats like the Pilot make good daysailors and weekenders in a sailing venue that has predominantly moderate winds and rarely experiences short chop.

By any objective standard, these are very expensive boats for what they offer. For the money there are a lot of newer boats are easier to handle, offer more comfortable accommodations, and better performance. Comparatively speaking, these boats are miserably wet and tender in heavy going and require a lot of skill to sail in gustier conditions.

I have seen examples of these boats all across the price range. A few years back I looked at an unrestored 1960's model with its original Grey Marine gas engine with an asking price in the mid-$30K range. I have seen a restored version with a carbon fiber mast with asking prices in the $150K range.

I actually exchanged e-mail with a fellow who had a restored Pilot with a carbon fiber mast, an altered sailplan, and modern sails. He indicated that the carbon fiber mast and new sail plan really transformed the sailing characteristics of the boat. In his case the carbon fiber mast was taller than the original aluminum spar allowing him to carry smaller overlapping headsails, which made the boat easier to sail. He reported that the dramatic weight savings aloft allowed him to carry sail longer, and reduced the feeling of the boat being overly tender. He also replaced all of the deck hardware with more modern gear which he reported as really making a huge difference in ease of handling as well.

Jeff

[Kerwood]

Jeff your quick response and insight is very helpful. This would be our first serious sailboat. My wife has sailed a sunfish for years, her parents had a Pearson 30. Last year we purchased a compac sun-cat, that was too small, difficult rigging, hard to handle, water is in the cockpit continuously, weather helm etc. We are looking for an upgrade to a daysailor primarily for weekends. We are not looking to race or go on extended cruises. We have a lovely 2nd home on Mt. Hope Bay and see us inviting friends for trips to Newport and Block Island. We are looking for a boat that is aestically pleasing, relaltively easy to handle, with a large cockpit. Obviously we are looking for good value and have an appreciation of classic design. We appreciate any suggestions you can offer. Thank you Kevin

[Jeff_H]

I think that the Pilot is a reasonable choice for what you are doing. If you are looking for less expensive boats of a similar character and quality, I would suggest that you look around for either a LeCompte or Seafarer Swiftshore from the mid-1960's. I am drawing a blank on the actual model name for the 35 foot Lecompte built during this period. Both LeCompte and Seafarer were building their boats in Holland during this period and the workmanship on these boats were really beautiful. The LeCompte was a Tripp design and the Swiftshore a Rhodes design. Because they lack the cache of a Hinckley, they tend to be far less expensive, but on the other hand are less likely to be restored to as high a level as a Hinckley Pilot.

Just as a point of contrast, you might look at more modern design such as a five year old C&C 110 or Dehler 36, which should sell in roughly the same price range as a restored Hinckley Pilot. While not 'classic' designs, these boats offer much better sailing ability and comfort.

Jeff

[captlar]

In their day, the late 60's and early 70's, the Pilot was THE 35 footer to own. They sailed faster and higher than many other 35s in the yacht club fleets at that time. They were more expensive than other 35s and were the envy of many sailors. I guess Jeff is right that they were a handful, tender and wet, but my memories from that time is all the 35s were that way to some degree. Today the Pilot is, IMO, the fiberglass version of the old wooden Concordia. They are a classic yacht with lots of wood, beautiful lines and very little room below. I see them in the winter in heated sheds beside the big girls. They have now seen major (read this as unlimited funds spent) upgrades and top shelf care. To purchase and maintain this type of yacht requires commitment and appreciation for her bloodline. You will pay from 90K to 150K. That's a lot of cheddar for a 40 year old boat. You will pay cash, no financing on glass this old, and perhaps have issue with insurance - some self-insure or don't worry about it (nice).
If you have found one that has not been restored, you will need money and time because she will need a lot of both.
If you do not find yourself being described, I suggest you look at something newer. Bristols are sometimes referred to as the Poor Man's Hinckley. I have owned 2, including my current 35.5. There are plenty of other good old boats from the 70's and 80's that will meet your sailing needs for much less up front and maintenance money. The fun is in the hunt ! Let us know how it goes.
Larry

[Kerwood]

Thanks, again Jeff I'll check into your other recommendations, Kevin

[Kerwood]

Captlar thanks for your response. Interestingly enough just today I was looking at Bristol 35.5's. Are all of these centerboards? What has your experience with them been like? They seem like abit more of a cruiser. Thanks, Kevin

[captlar]

Some are fixed fin keel and some centerboard. the CB's are a bit tender. We ordered new sails and scaled the jib down to a 120. The boat is easily driven, so even a 110 would do. The fixed keel is less tender. Both sail high and fast. Bristol continued to build the "old" style and started this "new design' at the same time. You can figure out which design won out. They are, IMO and having sailed both, a better design. We were specifically looking for a centerboard to allow us to get into the skinny water. Prior to this we had the 31.1 with fixed fin keel. That is a sweet boat as well, and adequate room for a couple. You can find one in very good shape for aroung 60K. We moved up to the 35.5 to gain waterline and additional storage. After that you go to the 38.8, but I would look at the Wasquiez if you are wiling to go to or beyond the 100K mark.
Larry

[Ric in Richmond]

First let me say that I think the SS pilot 35 is near the top of my dream boat lists, topped only by a B40 or similar.

I bought a boat that is very close interms of the numbers and performance. But you'd be hard pressed to spend $40000 for one (and it better be near perfect at that price!)

It doesn't have the incredible wood finish...mostly formica and glass....but it is very comparable if you are looking for a boat of the hinckley pilot 35 capability and style.

It is built like a tank.

And for the $100000+ that you won't be spending ....you could have a great interior.

How about an alberg 35?

If you look at http://www.image-ination.com/sailcalc.html and run the numbers you will see they are close. By the way sail calc can be configured to list boats that meet your requirements....allied princess/ luders 33's/ etc etc


Performance Comparison

LOA
Alberg 35 Sloop 34.75
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 35.4

LWL
Alberg 35 Sloop 24
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 25

Beam
Alberg 35 Sloop 9.67
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 9.53

Displacement
Alberg 35 Sloop 13300
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 13510

Sail Area
Alberg 35 Sloop 522
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 554

Capsize Ratio
Alberg 35 Sloop 1.63
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 1.6

Hull Speed
Alberg 35 Sloop 6.56
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 6.7

Sail Area to Displacement
Alberg 35 Sloop 14.88
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 15.63

Displacement to LWL
Alberg 35 Sloop 430
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 386

LWL to Beam
Alberg 35 Sloop 2.48
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 2.62

Motion Comfort
Alberg 35 Sloop 36.48
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 36.58

Pounds/Inch
Alberg 35 Sloop 829
Hinckley Pilot 35 Sloop 851



I have to think maybe Carl was doing a little cloning for the everyman???

Nice article in one of RIchard Hendersons book on classic yacht designs on the pilot 35 too!

Ric

[hamiam]

The Pilot is a beautiful boat; just be prepared for ALOT of time and/or money to maintain her. Luckily there are many marinas will skilled labor in your area. I would suggest Jamestown Boat-Yard as they are skilled at maintaining fine yachts. (They are one of the few authoritized Swan service facilities) / My suggestion is simple: sail her. You will know within an hour or so if you like the way she handles. Good luck.