Draft minus keel depth on Cape Dory 28? - Page 2 - SailNet Community
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post #11 of 17 Old 08-01-2009
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I agree a 100, well 98%

Originally Posted by JohnRPollard View Post

If you spend more time here you'll learn that, while not everyone agrees with every position that Jeff espouses, he is widely respected for the contribution he makes to the Sailnet community. That contribution spans many years and thousands of thoughtful, respectful posts.

By comparison you are new here with a history consisting mostly of personally criticizing a well-respected member. When you come in and precede statements such as "we are just going to have to agree to disagree" with "your posts are hard to miss - I have to wonder when you find time to work or to sail....", that is textbook passive aggressive and you are not doing yourself any favors in so far as building credibility.

If you want to join the debate here and develop credibility, my best suggestion is to focus on the subject matter and avoid personalizing it.

I don't agree with your statement about it being passive aggressive behaviour but...

I also don't see that the point of my being here is to get as many posts as possible and get as high a "Rep power" either.

From my perspective I joined a forum and read a couple of posts that I disagreed with and read a couple more that I disagreed with even more and no passive aggressive or being mean intended but Jeff_H's post are hard to miss. Almost no one writes as many posts or go's on in such detail. So yes they are hard to miss.

As I was writing my first post (A response to Jeff_H's post) I thought this is not very nice for a first post - but I really disagreed with him and saw it as him spreading his opinion like it were "set in concrete" facts. I went to great lengths to be nice about it, to explain my background a bit, to explain why I disagreed. And yes it has occured to me now that some things like the names of keels etc. can also be a regional thing. But I was, I thought, as nice as I could be and get my points across.

So from my perspective I joined a forum and had the nerve to disagree with someone that - well - has a lot of support here. And was ridiculed for it. Someone even said outright something like "a person with only 5 posts disagreeing with someone of Jeff_H's stature...". Because apparently you have to have a lot of posts and "Rep power" before you dare disagree. That's just silly. As I said on another thread - well to paraphrase it - I will not get into a war about personalities or argue the same point over and over. That sort of thing is the worst of what forums of any kind are about.

I will however expand on what I said in my previous post "And just because something is in writing/taught/on the INTERNET does not automatically make it correct." to include forums - just because you have over 4000 posts and a "Rep" does not mean you are correct.

When I was a kid I started reading my fathers boating magazines - it was quite a shock as I got older and had learned more about boats to realize that just because an article was in a magazine did not mean it was correct. Cruising World and to a lesser extent Wooden Boat would put anything in their magazines to fill up the space. On the other hand I find now that Good Old Boat is a lot more responsible - they will publish something they don't agree with or goes against normal practice but they will state that in the body of the text.

As I have said before - don't believe everything you read.

So this is the last post on this thread that is not about the topic!




I also realize that if you happen upon one of my posts after the first two they could easily be taken out of context and seem worse. I mean, I submitted two posts and then was dragged over coals. It was respond or just ignore the whole mess....

Westwind 24 "Ria"

Last edited by Ericb; 08-01-2009 at 09:14 AM. Reason: Added Addendum
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post #12 of 17 Old 08-01-2009
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# of posts has NOTHING to do with your rep. Rep is given by other members.
You will note that Jeff has about 1/3 of my posts and the same rep. He knows about 10 times more than me about specific boats and sail trim and a host of other things. My comment on YOUR lack of posts and rep and lack of a sailboat and sailing experience was designed to point out that you know squat compared to Jeff about design, construction and sailing qualities of sailboats and your OPINIONS on his OPINIONS are worth about the same as my opinions on string theory.

No longer posting. Reach me by PM!
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post #13 of 17 Old 03-16-2012
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Re: Draft minus keel depth on Cape Dory 28?

Wow. Sad that Ericb, someone with obvious knowledge and experience was run off like this.
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post #14 of 17 Old 03-20-2012
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Re: Draft minus keel depth on Cape Dory 28?

Wow still quibling about a 2006 post. Me I would say the Dory has a long keel with cut away forefoot and is under engined, otherwise looks fairly common for the day.From the same era for coastal and Bahamas etc. I would prefer the Lapwoth design Cal 29. Comments welcome.
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post #15 of 17 Old 03-21-2012
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Re: Draft minus keel depth on Cape Dory 28?

I wonder why ericb's post is allowed when Oregonian's has been removed? It doesn't sound like he thinks much of Jeffh's position either.

Hard to believe there could be a debate like this about full verses fin keel...
I suppose if you prefer to nit pic... go right ahead. I'm done wasting my time here.
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post #16 of 17 Old 03-21-2012
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Re: Draft minus keel depth on Cape Dory 28?

I also wonder about that Tinman. On one level I understand why moderators would want to protect their "status", but at a certain point it becomes a joke.
Oregonians post challenged Jeff_H's position and someone didn't like it.
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post #17 of 17 Old 03-21-2012
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Re: Draft minus keel depth on Cape Dory 28?

Anything anyone posts here is going to generally be an opinion... strongly held perhaps, debatable, perhaps too. but still in most cases it's still an opinion. You can attribute factual status to it if you please, but I submit that's not often the intention of the poster. Perhaps there should be a general disclaimer on every post 'the following is IMO'...

In any event, it is not the intent nor the desire of Sailnet and the forum to enable or facilitate personal attacks or vendettas against any of our members no matter who they are. Posts with the seemingly sole purpose of instigating such spats will not be allowed to stand.

Dredging up a long-dead six year old thread certainly seems to fall into that category... and, sorry,tinman but if you're 'done wasting your time' here after 1 post then neither of us is out much..

Since there's no other discernible point to this dead thread it will be locked.

Ron (Faster)


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".. there is much you could do at sea with common sense.. and very little you could do without it.."
Capt G E Ericson (from "The Cruel Sea" by Nicholas Monsarrat)
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