Three bluewater boats at the upper size limit of what I'd be comfortable single-handing offshore. Budget under $85,000. Range - Pacific ocean. Am interested in your thoughts comparing/contrasting these three boats. Thank you.
Argyle:
You certainly know the boat better than my indirect knowledge.. (I have very limited time aboard)
Would you please comment about the engine access/room,
The engine room is quite large but it's not as convenient as more modern deisgns. There is plenty of room to get in there and move around, but it does require a bit of contortion. I have a Perkins 4-108, which is larger than the stock engines (Ferryman's, 24 or 36 hp) so that takes up quite a bit of room but there's still plenty left over for a bigger than average guy like me (~5'11", 220#) to move around. My joints stay plenty flexible, I'll tell you that. Modern engine rooms with removable bulkhead sections around the engine are a very nice improvement. If I had to replace my starter motor, I might have to pull the engine, for instance. My oil filter is remote is remotely located on the inside wall of the companionway as well.
and what you thought of the small cockpit well.. I know my dad used deck chairs in the cockpit, and was pretty happy with that.
I find we seldom use the cockpit well for our legs. I have a few of those West Marine fold away seats, the blue ones. Those, in addition to cockpit coushins make it so you can arrange a seat any way or any where you want in the large flat aft section. If you're not actively steering, we typically are kicked back somewhere that it is comfortable. On long passages, I find that this is actually more comfortable than most of the cockpit combing backrests. One downside to the larger flat cockpit, is if you take a wave over the bow, the water often will come all the way aft and soak whatever is on the low side. I've seen a few boats where someone built a combing between the cabin trunk and the caprail or a re-built winch base, to prevent this from happening.
My Dad had Leisure furl roller furling, and really liked it. I am pretty sure he also got rid of the staysail "club"
I still have the staysail club. I actually like it. Gives some additional options for trimming that sail. For instance, if you run a line from the aft end of the club forward to the tip of the bowsprit, you can use it like a pole for going downwind. I do this sometimes if I don't want to rig up the whisker pole or haul out the asym. I call it 'chicken winging.'
I know he reinforced the big windows after one broke during a blow, which was pretty scary for him. Curious if you have done something about it.
A lot of people do that. I haven't but my cruising grounds are still Long Island Sound, so it's pretty tame around here. I think I would just build a set of stormboards to put in front of those windows, unless I felt inspired to take on another major project. I've already replaced all of the small opening ports with New Found Metals ports, which are great btw. Those windows are an odd bit of cheapness, compared to how the rest of the boat is built. I mean, why put coastal plexiglass windows on a boat that was heavily built for offshore (albeit milk-run) cruising? Those stock windows are definitely one of the things that holds them back when compared to Westsails. I said they were similar in build, but I would probably put the Westsails a notch ahead, for this category of boat, because of those windows, among a few other things. They are normally quite a bit less expensive than a Westsail of similar quality and size.
I know that he pounded ashore in Bonaire for several hours during a blow. Took him a while to get it fixed, but he completed most of his circumnavigation after it.
He never could figure out how to back it up without warping..
Me neither. If there is no wind and you are careful, then you can back up well enough, but anything more than 5 knots and that bow just goes downwind until you get the boat moving 2+ knots in reverse. That 's a lot of momentum before you get enough boat speed to have any control. So, yeah, the warping lines are your friends. You do learn a lot about big boat handling, because you have to. Like I said before, I have fun with the warping. I won't even get a bow thruster. Stubborn I guess.
I always tell people, the key to these kinds of boats, along with Westsails, Vagabonds, Island Packtes, etc. is that you have to use them to their strengths. If you buy one of these and want to use it like your friend uses his 2001 Beneteau, then you will find yourself frustrated quite a bit of the time. He will go in to any marina and have a pretty easy time getting in and out of that inside slip down the fairway. On a boat like this, you're better off anchoring out. The strength is that more of the anchorage is going to be open to use because of the mass of the boat and the hull design.
I know he replaced the tanks, which I think were black iron..
My main fuel tank is aluminum, and two 45 gallon water tanks are stainless. The main fuel tank is very deep. I installed access ports in it to clean and inspect when I bought the boat.
Sorry.. don't mean to hijack the thread.. Your response was well thought out and written.. Just curious of your impressions.
Argyle38;2624185 On the other hand said:Funny thing about that.. I have taken my dad for a week's cruise in the San Juan Islands every summer for the past 10 years aboard my 36' fin keel cruiser/racer. When he has the helm, he still overcontrols... Back and forth, back and forth.. I figure the 12 years with his DownEaster "broke" his ability to drive a more responsive boat....
Last summer we went for a sail aboard the Adventuress, a 100 year old schooner, and my Dad took the helm. Big smile on his face as he realized he still knew how to drive a boat well.. as long as it had a big old keel underneath him with a rudder hanging off the end. Need to dig up the picture..
Ah man! Someone let that Portuguese Water dog north of Marysville loose on the computer to brag about his daddy! :laugher:laugher:laugherMore Valiant 40's have circumnavigated than the total number of Fast Passages built. Draw your own conclusions.