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  #1  
Old 08-27-2006
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New boat - more speed more space - need votes !!

Hello All:

Our family consisting of a wife, 4 year old and new born have a Sabre 36 centerboard here in New England. While we love the Sabre, we find that in order to get her moving, she needs to be @ at least 20 degrees (of heel) to maintain speed and pointing abilities.

This however does create some minor "complaints" from the crew as the captain is having a great time. The question is (besides getting a new crew), what are your various suggestions regarding a possible next boat.

We figure the budget for to max out about 140K ....here are the criteria

1. Aft cabin for the little guys
2. PHRF ratings (New England) of less than 125
3. stiffer than the centerboard Sabre i.e. less heeling when underway

That's it should be easy right ?? - appreciate any of your assistance and expertise !!!
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Old 08-27-2006
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You do realize that getting more space is generally not going to give you more speed, unless you spend lots of money.... You can get two of the three at the expense of the third: speed, comfort or price.

Of course, if your admiral and crew really object to heeling, and you really want more space... you could go with a catamaran... They have very little heeling, and lots of space. However, the sailing performance may suffer a bit, as most cats don't tack very well.
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Old 08-27-2006
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20 degrees of heel sounds excessive, even for a sluggish Sabre. Perhaps old, baggy sails are making you heel too much, and/or your lack of crew keeps you from reefing when you should. New sails would be a lot less than $140k. If your ARE looking for a new-to-you boat with multiple cabins, you might try a Jeanneau 37. The fit & finish might be comparable to Sabre's. If I recall correctly, I believe it rates PHRF 96 in New England.
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Paulk—Are you talking about the Sun Oddyssey 37?

Lebishp—Paulk brings up a good point... how old are the sails on your boat, and what kind of shape are they in??

Have you tried de-powering the sails—increasing backstay tension, flattening the main with the cunningham and outhaul, moving the jib fairleads, increasing halyard tension, reefing, etc. If not, then you might want to try these techniques, before spending $140,000 on a different boat.

One other thing to consider, if you get a different boat, the deeper draft boats will often be stiffer, but will have more problems with going aground, shallow areas, etc. Some of the places you can currently go in your boat, may not be as accessible in a deeper draft boat.

The Jeanneau 37 that I think Paulk is talking about has a draft of 6' 4", which is a bit over two feet deeper than your Sabre's draft of 4' 2".
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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Old 08-28-2006
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As a Sabre owner, I'd say you are accustomed to living well, and should find getting into a deep keel model of a Tartan or Sabre a good solution to the excessive heeling problem. My current boat draws 6.5" and that is rarely a problem in NE. With that budget you shouldn't have a problem meeting your objectives. Here is one example right in the neighborhood:
http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listi...ick&searchtype

Good luck.
PS - be sure the new boat is set up to permit single-line reefing of the main from the cockpit. If you reef frequently and early, you should be able to keep the crew happier.
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BTW, it doesn't matter if it is single line or double line reefing, as long as it is run back to the cockpit, it makes a big difference. Single line reefing is often less efficient than double line reefing, due to the line stretch and friction in the system. Double line reefing can be faster for that reason.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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Old 08-28-2006
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Thanks for all of the great info. The sail control adjustments have been made and do make some diff, however new sails may solve both the speed and stability issues, we'll have to see. Also, draft is a consideration as anything over 6 ft will go aground.

Had some folks suggest the Tartan 3700 (a little pricey) and the C&C 110 - do any of you have opinions on either of these (although they are somewhat different in their approach...)

Thanks again for all of the opinions !!!
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