Fast, pretty and comfortable... Alerion vs. ??? - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Boat Review and Purchase Forum
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 10-15-2006
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North Fork, Long Island
Posts: 9
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
venturi is on a distinguished road
Fast, pretty and comfortable... Alerion vs. ???

Hello,

Here's my boat-buying dilemma, and would appeciate some opinions...
I am experienced sailor on the cusp of making my first substantial boat purchase. I'm looking for a boat in the 28-32 ft range that is:

1. Fast and fun to sail.
2. Has beautiful lines.
3. Can be overnighted/weekended in reasonable comfort.

I don't necessarily care about racing per se, but I am performance-oriented sailor that likes to "sail to get there" and will throw up a spinnaker in a solid breeze just for the pure fun of it. I want something quick and responsive, with a sprightly feel.

I'm considering an Alerion 28 - despite the ghastly price - because of its looks, quick performance, reasonable draft and suitability for the local sailing I will do most often. But it is very spartan for overnighting and is a little scary in the "not-much-boat-for-the-money" category.

Before I take this plunge, can anyone recommend a boat in this size range that has the looks AND the performance, with a little more in the way of creature comforts than the Alerion? I'm in the used market with a budget ceiling of ~$70k including whatever refit is needed to make the boat near-new.

Thanks in advance for your input!

Stephan
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #2  
Old 10-15-2006
Chuteman's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
Posts: 221
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
Chuteman is on a distinguished road
Nice Taste

Alerion is a beautiful boat....but you are right about price.
You may want to so some searches on Yachtworld.com or similar sites to see what else a $70k budget will buy.
You maybe trying to get the best of all categories which experts say is impossible.......one of the gang will correct this but think you can only get 2 out of 3 = Price, Speed, Comfort/Capacity. Will depend on how you plan to use.
I did a quick search & there are a few nice boats ie; Tartan, Mumm, etc beyond the typical big producers. Good Luck
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #3  
Old 10-15-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 253
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 11
mgiguere is on a distinguished road
A 28 alternatives

Go for one of the J boats on the used market. You could get a pretty good one for that money....J30 or thereabouts. Light, sprightly, and probably better for overnight. Also, the J is the only boat I know that you could sail (tack) with the main alone. Has a smaller foretriangle and could handle similarly to the A28 (which has a self tacking smaller jib--same concept).

Although the A28 is probably better constructed, the J is probably not that far behind.

Another alternative would be any of the C&C boats. They are fast, wll built and would be good for overnight accomodations.

I also know of a Cal 35 that would be available in that price range...very quick and could be had in the 40's.

Moe

Moe
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #4  
Old 10-15-2006
Faster's Avatar
Just another Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: New Westminster, BC
Posts: 14,699
Thanks: 68
Thanked 197 Times in 189 Posts
Rep Power: 10
Faster has a spectacular aura about Faster has a spectacular aura about Faster has a spectacular aura about
In the 28' range I don't believe you'll find anything along the lines of the Aileron.. a few lately from the high end manufacturers in the 36 - 42 foot range but they obviously won't fit your budget. With 70K to spend you can easily find a boat that is suitable for your purposes, but the Aileron's characteristic appearance is rare indeed. I'd recommend a fractional rig for ease of handling and versatility of sail power. Though the J30 is nowhere in the Ailerons class, it may suit your needs and leave you a lot of money for upgrades. There are other similar sized (and similarly rigged) boats from the European makers that may fit that bill as well.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #5  
Old 10-15-2006
ASA and PSIA Instructor
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,448
Thanks: 6
Thanked 17 Times in 17 Posts
Rep Power: 15
sailingfool will become famous soon enough
Thats a pretty good budget for this range - I'd go for as big as you can afford. 32 feet will shrink real quickly once you get it wet.
As to the Alerion, it certainly is hansome, but I would not think too good on your "fast" objective - i.e rating some where around 168, and no spinnaker rigging. You'd think they at least have a sprit on it for a asynch...

My advice is look at the quality builders, Tartan, Cal, Ericson and C&C, in the 32-33 range. Be sure to get one with spinnaker gear installed. Here's two of my favorite models as examples, both rating around 132:

http://yachtworld.com/core/listing/b...ick&searchtype=

http://yachtworld.com/core/listing/b...880&searchtype=
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #6  
Old 10-15-2006
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,394
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 11
cardiacpaul is a jewel in the rough cardiacpaul is a jewel in the rough cardiacpaul is a jewel in the rough
It certainly is a pretty boat, although I just have a personal problem with a
70k boat with 20.00 walmart cooler as the "icebox" .

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listi...oat_id=1567351
__________________
We are not primarily on earth to see through one another, but to see one another through

Some people are like slinkies: not really good for anything... but you can't help laughing when you push them down the stairs
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #7  
Old 10-16-2006
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North Fork, Long Island
Posts: 9
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
venturi is on a distinguished road
Thanks for the quick and thoughtful feedback from all of you, I will poke around and consider the good suggestions. One thing seems clear... there is a gaping hole in the current boatbuilding market. Someone needs to revisit the glorious pocket cruisers of the past and apply - with equal parts engineering savvy and modesty - some modern engineering priciples to make them perform to more current standands. A Bristol 32/Alberg 30/Pearson Triton for 2006. If Beneteau and Catalina can manage to stick a three bedroom house into an ugly 30-footer, you would think that someone could manage to build a passable studio apartment into a pretty one that maintains a credible showing on the knotmeter. I agree that that a J30 meets the functional requirements... just wish I get get more excited about it. Maybe sailing is believing...
Stephan
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #8  
Old 10-16-2006
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 4
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Yesac13 is on a distinguished road
venturi -

Correct me if I am not too clear on your requirements...

It seems to me that you are looking for a performance sailboat... a sailboat with a fin keel and fairly lightweight to boot. But one that looks like a classic. Goes pretty fast and responsive.

If that is exactly what you are looking for... There are only one boat I know that fits your requirements.

Its the Alerion Express 28. Its pretty sad, I know but that is the only one in the 28 - 32 feet range, under 70K.

There are no others, as far I know. If you are willing to consider old heavy full keel sailboats with character then you have many, many good choices out there and many good people who can refurbish it to a condition superior to even a new Alerion Express 28. I know of a Triton that was converted to a daysailer with a huge 12 foot cockpit. It was completed last year and it looked better in person than an Alerion Express 28. More beautiful, even. But it would never be able to truly compete in speed because... its a full keel sailboat weighting about a ton more (dimensions of the Triton is very similar to the Alerion Express 28, other than the keel and weight).

If you want another alternative to the Alerion Express 28, you'll have to increase your size and budget range. There are a couple of nice Joel White Designed Center Harbor 31s (cold molded wood) for 200 - 250K and the Morris 36 for even more $$.

I would suggest you to buy an Alerion Express 28 in good condition and set aside some money for a nice dinghy and money for B & Bs or hotels. Some people up here in Maine (I live in Maine) likes large daysailers best... looks beautiful, goes fast. As for accomndations for the night, they stay at the local B & Bs or motels or hotels. Doing things this way would actually save you money in the long run if you do not do that many overnights. Those hot/cold water systems, AC, heaters, etc do cost money and maintenace.

Links for your perusal (fun) ...

http://yachtworld.com/core/listing/b..._id=71531&url=

http://yachtworld.com/core/listing/b..._id=71531&url=

http://yachtworld.com/core/listing/b..._id=12744&url=

http://yachtworld.com/core/listing/b...35&searchtype=

http://yachtworld.com/core/listing/b...27&searchtype=

http://yachtworld.com/core/listing/b...27&searchtype=


I think thats enough for today...

Fair Breezes - Casey
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #9  
Old 10-16-2006
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North Fork, Long Island
Posts: 9
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
venturi is on a distinguished road
You got the idea, Casey... I had never seen the Joel Whites, all I can say is "wow"... thanks for the introduction, maybe I'll get there in 30 years! I agree about the restored Tritons, they are beautiful. There's a delipidated one down the street on a cradle, literally 50 yards from my house (I live next to Peconic Bay, in New York)... even in its sorry state you can see how pretty she could be. It's too bad there aren't more "modern classics" but it seems the Alerions are selling like hot cakes so maybe others will catch on. We've become such a value-oriented culture, it's become counter-intuitive to pay more for less... but I agree that keeping it simple, with fewer systems to break and fix, is not a bad way to roll. I still very much admire the Bristol 32 and the Cape Dory 31, I just think I would get frustrated with the sluggish performance... we are out there to sail first and foremost after all.
Stephan
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #10  
Old 10-17-2006
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 4
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Yesac13 is on a distinguished road
You might be surprised at this but that old Triton may not be a terrible boat for your needs. Sure, on PHRF ratings, its slow like hell. But as full keel sailboats goes, the Triton is better than average. PHRF ratings do not necessarily prove exactly how fast a sailboat is.

I read somewhere online (forget where) that the performance of full keel sailboats tend to drop alot as compared to a similar length fin keel sailboats once you go past 30 feet. More difficult to overcome the increased wetted surface, it seems to have something to do with that. I don't know if any of this is true but I do note that owners of full keel sailboats over 30 feet tend to grumble much more often on the slowness of their boats as compared to those who own a full keeler under 30 feet.

I sail Fizz, a Sea Sprite 23. She is designed by Carl Alberg and was his first fiberglass sailboat (1954 but first built in 1957). Google the Sea Sprite 23 and you can see how beautiful it is.

I did not buy Fizz for her speed. I bought her for the looks. But once I sailed her for the first time, she was surprisingly fast... in 5 - 10 knot winds - the predominant winds in the summers for me. I have a 130% genoa, a largish genoa is important for light airs. In the area I sail, few boats can touch me in winds under 10 knots. I sail circles around a local Bristol 32, a sailboat you said you admire. Its a beautiful sailboat but trust me, don't buy it if you want light air performance. It goes good in winds over 15 knots but below that, even with a 150% genoa, I still can beat it with a little jib aloft on Fizz.

If you like the feel of a lightweight fin keel with spade sailboat, then the Alerion Express is the one, period. If you feel you might not mind a heavy full keel sailboat that will (with at least 130% or above genoa) go well in light winds but has slooow accleration, you might like the Triton. Go and bum a ride on a Triton or her smaller sister, the Ariel and see how you like them. They're certainly dirt cheap as compared to an Alerion Express.

Fair Breezes - Casey
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
First time sail boat buyer martinojon Boat Review and Purchase Forum 20 05-26-2014 09:16 PM
buying first boat jerrycooper14 Boat Review and Purchase Forum 21 04-23-2002 02:15 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:58 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.