'74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers - SailNet Community
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post #1 of 16 Old 04-14-2016 Thread Starter
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'74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers

Hello again,
I am learning with every boat I review getting closer to finding the one for me, just wanted to touch base on here to see if there are any warning signs that im missing. This is a 1974 Ranger 23, not sure if its a tall rig or short (how do i tell?). Off the bat I found a couple items that seemed slightly off but could be okay. Bulkheads seemed to have been replaced and painted, job looks okay, a little wiggly cuts, slight depressions where bolts are but no rot and no squishy. (Don't know if this is a sign that a novice did repairs and there could be other issues associated with original problem) Looks like accross topside various areas for stanchions and shrouds have been fixed with a stainless plate top side and marine plywood underside. port shroud looks like glass was cut out and replaced with plywood and reglassed looks a little rough on the underside but seems strong and tight.

Lots of little areas that look like they have been fixed 5200 underside and stainless plating topside, big unknowns for me that could be dealbreakers in my eyes are the mast step; on the base (see pic) there is slight gel coat cracking but nothing too severe in my eyes, but mast seems pivotted slight to port, i was able to grab the mast and twist it slightly but not back to center. Is this common or really bad? On underside i see no major damage just a very thin 4 inch long hairline crack about 3 feed starboard of center in the ceiling.

Despite water in the cabin, keel bolts looked good. Owner had boat out of water last summer with a note on receipt from marina that says no abnormalities or blistering was found. Looking in aft lockers, i noticed blackening on sidewalls of fiberglass.. potentially previous inboard or fire, one picture in base under cockpit looks like a wooden door, to sail drive? No damage that I can see, though I have pictures on dropbox as well as some attached. Sails look to be junk, outboard seems to be in good shape.

Pictures are located in dropbox: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/6nrb87c7t...rby4FQh5a?dl=0
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post #2 of 16 Old 04-14-2016
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Re: '74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers

That's a great little boat, but I'd not be happy about the amount of water in the bilge, nor the apparently unsealed, wet plywood in the vicinity.

Looks like ordinary plywood was used for the bulkheads and the chainplate bolts overtightened without adequate backing. I'd say there was some movement prior to the bulkhead replacement that caused the gel coat cracking on the overhead liner/transition.

Some ham-handed nylon blocks on the boom that looks like a bleeding scalp ready to happen, and I look at that as a good indication of the workmanship and care (or rather lack of) whoever did it.

The blackening below is most likely mold as a result of the dampness and moisture with all the water in there.

This one needs to be dried out and more carefully inspected before moving further, IMO...

Ron

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post #3 of 16 Old 04-14-2016 Thread Starter
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Re: '74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers

Thanks, here are some of the pictures attached. Yeah I thought the novice work could be a bad sign. But still for a good price, an entry to keel boat sailing and phrf racing, I wonder. After reading recent post of meritt and r23 someone mentioned keel sump issues, any way to determin if this is happening. I poked my finger around the keel and didn't notice any give or soft areas, didn't check torque. Im planning on checking with the local marina who did the work last summer and see if they have any notes on file. ANy thoughts on the mast twist(is this from the little bit of give of previous bulkhead issue), or wooden spot in aft under cockpit. I may have that problem of admitting a lost cause right away but with your help on here I have walked away from several and might have to walk away from this as well. Damn my budget!

Cheers,
Attached Thumbnails
20160414_105753.jpg   20160414_110649.jpg   20160414_110445.jpg   20160414_111307.jpg   20160414_112145.jpg  


Last edited by Shellfisher; 04-14-2016 at 08:27 PM. Reason: more intel
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post #4 of 16 Old 04-14-2016
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Re: '74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers

You can do better , keep looking . . . lots of good boats out there, be patient and a little picky . . . . I can't see feeling it with that one . . .
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post #5 of 16 Old 04-15-2016
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Re: '74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers

to much to fix and junk sails. something does not kook right on the keel bolt washers, did they use too large a split washer under the nuts with no flat washers. walk away from that boat

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Thanks for advice, I am curious what immediate work would need to be done and the difficulty it would be and how tell the big stuff from small stuff, could dive on her and check keel hull connection, or even a 400 survay?.

Still most likely walk away but to be clear I am looking for a feasible project as well as a sailable boat to help me learn more about boat construction, keel boats and to save money on purchase 1k or under, more importantly get me on the water. This would be my first poor man boat and wold upgrade as soon as paycheck allows. Im okay with potentially buying new used sails, buying materials and putting some good labour like redueing bulkheads properly, replacing plywood, glassing, sealing, and so on learning experience .

My worry would be big deal breakers like keel falling off, mast breakage, although with these known issues and known issues with this boat it seems that likly hood of keel sump issues could indeed be more than I want to get into too. Let me know if I am crazy to still be considering this "project".

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Re: '74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers

There's so much grime there that it's very difficult (esp with just pics and long distance) to draw any relevant conclusions about this boat. Are there cracks in the deck around the mast base? Looks like it but is it just dirt?

The stanchion treatment, for example.. Robust looking deck plate, but followed by a 'crushable' plywood backing below - plus moving the lifelines so far inboard as to make passage fore and aft on deck rather tight.

Similar crushing on the bulkhead/chainplate connections

Too much water everywhere to be able to actually see what's going on there - and more risk of saturated plywood here and there.

It's pretty unlikely that the keel will 'fall off', but you need to get the boat out of the water to look at what's going on there. Mast breakage is usually related to rigging failure, and realistically unless you can find out for sure it's been done, that's another $700-800 to replace it all for peace of mind.

So, survey, haulout, you're out six or seven hundred even before you make a decision and before you've addressed any of the issues.

Ron

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post #8 of 16 Old 04-15-2016 Thread Starter
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Thanks, there are a few small hairline cracks topside forward of mastwith no give which fr ok m above posts makes me think it was from flexing prior to bulkhead replacement.I guess survay is looking like more of a necessity which might put this boat over budget for me.
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Re: '74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers

I am assuming someone is offering the boat to you for free. If so it might be worth it for the keel and some hardware, but bear in mind you will have to pay someone to pull the boat out of the water, and pay the yard for a week or 2 while you cut the hull up, and it will fill a dumpster with the cut portions. But if they are expecting you to pay anything for this I say run very fast. Keep in mind with all the stuff fixed, and a set of good used (or even new) sails, new interior, paint inside and out you will be lucky to get $2,000 to 3,000 for the boat. Is it worth your time and money to throw away as you will never see it again, and unlikely to get much sailing in the time you are working on it. If you don't finish the boat completely you will be unlikely to be able to ever sell it as well, so left with cutting it up. So yes I think you would be crazy to take on this project. Perhaps throw a few hundred bucks into a savings account every pay check till you have enough for a better boat. You will be needing several hundred immediately on this boat anyway if that is going to be a struggle it is unlikely it will ever get completed.

Getting out on the water does not have to cost anything, just put your name and number on marina bulletin boards and offer yourself for race and day-sail crew. If you show up and listen and do as told (especially on race boats) you will get asked back.

I think it would make more sense to see if there is a sailing club in the area that you could to join. You would actually be able to go out and sail the boats. They often have training programs that let you start off with small boats and as you gain experience you can head out on bigger and bigger boats. Some will let you take a keel boat out for a few days at a time as well. They can be really good if you have a flexible schedule and can go out on week days when most of the boats will be idle. You won't get any cash out of it, but at least you won't loose more than the cost of membership. They might give you a break on the rates too if you show you are wiling to do some maintenance work.

Not that the Ranger 23 is a horrible boat, but with all the money and effort it would take to get this into shape, you still would only have a Ranger 23. I would look at a little bit bigger boats, ones that you could comfortably spend weekends on and do some extended cruising. Go a bit bigger still and you could live on it and get rid of rent/mortgage and really jump into the lifestyle!
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Re: '74 Ranger 23 Pics -Help on Dealbreakers

You'll find another. Sounds like too many problems. Get this boat for $100. Or free & practice on it if you need to.
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