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  #1  
Old 06-24-2007
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SEMIJim will become famous soon enough SEMIJim will become famous soon enough
We May Have Found Our Boat

Went and looked at a 1976 Pearson P30 today. Both my wife and I liked this boat right off. Second owner. Very clean and well-maintained, it appeared. Updated (Raymarine) depth and knot meters. Working VHF radio with a transom-mounted high-performance fiberglass antenna. New compass. Two complete sets of sails, in great condition (original, older set, and a new set), plus #1 and #2 genoas and a spin. (And a storm jib, IIRC.) Engine (30 HP gas - A4) started right up and sounded good to my ears. No (known) leaks! (In fact he advised us the deck hardware would require occasional re-bedding.) The bilge was as dry as toast and showed no evidence of having been presistently wet. Engine compartment was nearly clean as a whistle. Galley nearly spotless (the alcohol stove almost looks as if it'd never been used), as was the head. Decks were clean and free of chalking. Hull (above the water line) looked well-maintained.

He's been having fun, over the years, "re-engineering bits." Moved the mainsheet traveller (also upgraded to a Harken "quick-release?") to just behind the cabin, and some other stuff. So it's got some not-too-unsightly filled-in holes here and there. No big deal to us.

All the running rigging is run back to the cockpit, so she can be easily single-handed. Speaking of the rigging: I'm far from any expert, but it all appeared to be in good condition. Some of the running rigging is older, but appears still perfectly serviceable. He's upgraded the two jib winches to Harken #40 two-speed winches. The two smaller winches on top the cabin are also two-speed winches. I believe the forestay is new. He's added a back-stay tensioner.

It comes with a bunch of extras (lines, PFDs, USCG safety package, etc.), the details with with I'll forgo boring you.

Warts. (Of course there are warts. It's a 30 year old boat.) There's a crack, about 1/8" wide at its widest, in the sole of the cabin liner, right next to the mast compression post, as (crudely) illustrated here:

(The vertical line I drew indicates where the crack is and its length.) He says it's been there since he's owned the boat. Has had a friend who's a boat builder look at it, and he said it was no big deal. Probably due to a fault in the glass layup. Also, his son badly mis-estimated on docking last fall, and about tore the bow pulpit off the boat. There are cracks around its stanchions, but they appear to be no more than gel coat stress cracks. I guess the surveyor will know on both of these items. The door that closes off the head from the main cabin does not latch. Exhibits the same mis-alignment that I observed on a Sabre 28 I'd looked it. Upon discovering this (they never used the head, so this was the first time anybody tried closing, much less latching, that door) he told us to hold off on giving him a deposit until he could discuss the problem with his boat builder friend, and perhaps another friend he has who is a surveyor. A previous prospective buyer had had the boat surveyed in the water, and claimed his surveyor said the boat had been "twisted" at some point. But there's no other evidence of damage, either in the bilge area or on the hull. But he wants to make sure we don't unnecessarily spend money on a haul-out and survey, just to find out there really is a problem. Damn nice of him, we thought! (Btw: He's been sailing his entire life, on a variety of boats, and is pretty sure he'd have noticed anything amiss with the handling of the boat, if it was twisted out of shape.)

The head didn't pump water. Probably just needs a re-build kit?

So we'll see. Wish us luck.

Jim
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Old 06-24-2007
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sailorjim99 is an unknown quantity at this point
Thumbs up Good On Ya

Good on ya mate.
Hope the survey goes well and the crack is really nothing.
If it was sold for a fair price and everyone is happy, then you are on your way to some good times.

Tell us all how things go.

Jim
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Old 06-24-2007
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I am toasting some Cap'n Morgan Rum to you right now...Good Luck and don't sweat the small cracks...if the wife is happy, half the battle is won..!!!
Sail On...
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Old 06-24-2007
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SEMIJim will become famous soon enough SEMIJim will become famous soon enough
sailorjim99,

Our fingers are crossed! The current owner is confident a survey will go well. As to the price: It's about "mid-priced" for this model and age. With all the upgrades, and as well-maintained as she's apparently been, I think it's quite a good price, actually. Personally, the broker that has it listed, the owner, and we are rather mystified why it hadn't sold before we got to it. Perhaps it's kismet. Perhaps fate had decided we should have this boat .

USCGRET1990,

Thanks! Nope, not gonna sweat the small stuff. (And if I did, I'm sure CD would be along shortly to set me straight .) Yeah, the wife's happy. In fact, as we were all three sitting in the cockpit talking about the boat, other boats, sailing adventures and mis-adventures, I turned to my wife and asked "You want this boat?" "I love this boat," she replied. "So do I," I said. And, turning to the owner, "We'll take it!"

Now we're pumped and can't wait for the formalities to be out of the way!

Jim
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Old 06-24-2007
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Congrats, that's the way boat buying should be.
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Old 06-24-2007
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...damn those little cracks...full speed ahead cap'n...full speed ahead...aye aye..cap'n... full speed ahead it is....yahoooooo....!
Good Luck all.....!
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Old 06-24-2007
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sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Good luck with the survey and sea trial.
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Old 06-25-2007
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camaraderie is a jewel in the rough camaraderie is a jewel in the rough camaraderie is a jewel in the rough
Dittos Semi! Good boat...keep us posted!!
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Old 06-25-2007
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Thumbs up

Congrats on choosing a boat worthy of survey Jim...

On the issues you posted about; just wanted to mention that there is a possibility that the the non latching of the door may be more than cosmetic. On many boats the hull will begin to distort under heavy backstay tension and an article I read (cant' remember which) noted that on a friend's boat the "maximum allowed tension" was when the door to the head would become slightly jammed while going upwind. Since the door on your boat won't latch shut; it's possible that the hull flex and subsequent distortion of the cabin bulkheads while under sail has pushed the walls away from one another. This may or may not be a structural issue; a good surveyor should be able to tell you if there is something wrong with the hull.

Check the tension on the backstay; tighten it some and see if the gap at the door decreases. If not, check it again while under sail and see if it becomes less or more.

On the crack at the cabin sole; hard to tell without close-ups; but it is in the area of the mast step and -may- also indicate excessive backstay tension or hull flex. Not sure; that's a question for a good surveyor who is confident in making structural assessments. Choose a surveyor with as many years experience as possible and specializes in older sailboats. Trust your instincts and in what the kind seller is telling you; but verify and be willing to walk if you get into a situation where the asking price won't adjust enough or if needed repairs are exceeding the overall valuation. Be sure and work out a sales contract that will allow you to decline purchase for any reason and allow you to be refunded your deposit in full. If you don't have a broker check the BoatUS website; I think they might have a rough draft purchase contract that you can edit and escrow service available.

Good Luck!

Last edited by KeelHaulin; 06-25-2007 at 12:50 PM.
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Old 06-25-2007
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SEMIJim will become famous soon enough SEMIJim will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin
Congrats on choosing a boat worthy of survey Jim...
Thanks, but, well, whether it's worthy of a survey remains to be seen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin
On the issues you posted about; just wanted to mention that there is a possibility that the the non latching of the door may be more than cosmetic. ... This may or may not be a structural issue; a good surveyor should be able to tell you if there is something wrong with the hull.
That is the concern, of course. It turns out there are also cracks in the sole, radiating from what would be the upper-right corner of that bilge access in the picture I posted, with one traveling down the corner of that access (in the direction of the bilge). My wife assumed I'd seen them (I cannot imagine how I missed them), and just told me about them this evening.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin
On the crack at the cabin sole; hard to tell without close-ups; but it is in the area of the mast step and -may- also indicate excessive backstay tension or hull flex.
I have to wonder what kind of force, short of a collision, could result in so much force so as to crack that fiberglass like that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin
Not sure; that's a question for a good surveyor who is confident in making structural assessments. Choose a surveyor with as many years experience as possible and specializes in older sailboats.
We have a friend that's been into boats all his life. He's told us he'll be able to recommend one-or-more competent surveyors.

Plus the broker says they have references for several experienced surveyors they've recommended to buyers over the years. When I mentioned that the common wisdom is not to use a surveyor recommended by a broker or seller, she said these surveyors know who they're working for, and more than once have killed one of their (the brokerage's) sales.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin
Trust your instincts and in what the kind seller is telling you; but verify
Definitely!

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin
and be willing to walk if you get into a situation where the asking price won't adjust enough or if needed repairs are exceeding the overall valuation.
The cosmetic issues, while undesireable, aren't show-stoppers for us. The boat is otherwise in great shape. But structural issues would be a deal killer.

If the boat actually has suffered so much force so as to crack that fiberglass like that, and result in either the port or starboard head bulkheads being shifted by that amount, what else could have been structurally compromised? I'm sure there are areas of the boat's structure that even an experienced, competent surveyor can only guess at.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin
Be sure and work out a sales contract that will allow you to decline purchase for any reason and allow you to be refunded your deposit in full. If you don't have a broker check the BoatUS website; I think they might have a rough draft purchase contract that you can edit and escrow service available.
I didn't find the draft document to which you refer, but the boat is being sold via a broker, so we're good there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin
Good Luck!
Thanks! It's looking a bit dim at the moment, but we'll see. If it falls through... well, I guess that means we just keep looking for that one-percenter .

Thanks for your comments, KeelHaulin!

Jim

Last edited by SEMIJim; 06-25-2007 at 07:49 PM.
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