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  #1  
Old 12-04-2007
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New Boat Discount

I am considering buying my first cruiser in the 34-35 ft. range and am looking at new and used boats. I would very much appreciate any advice on what discount from suggested retail advice can be expected.

Thanks.
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Old 12-04-2007
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Quote:
I am considering buying my first cruiser in the 34-35 ft. range and am looking at new and used boats. I would very much appreciate any advice on what discount from suggested retail advice can be expected.
If this is your first boat, and you are considering a 34-3 ft cruiser then my advice would be "Don't".

Start with something smaller. If you REALLY want to learn how to sail, spend a year on a 15 to 18 foot dinghy, then spend a couple of years with a 22 foot weekender, THEN get a larger, longer range cruiser.

You need to be able to sail and you need to know how to maintain your boat. Very expensive to make your mistakes on a 35 foot boat.


Good Luck !!
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  #3  
Old 12-04-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustyf View Post
I am considering buying my first cruiser in the 34-35 ft. range and am looking at new and used boats. I would very much appreciate any advice on what discount from suggested retail advice can be expected.

Thanks.
In general I would agree with Sailormann's thoughts.. but it does seem that a lot of people are jumping in at the mid 30s range these days. I suppose it's partly due to higher disposable incomes and a desire to skip a step. And if you are 100% positive that this is for you, then maybe it makes sense to do so.

As to your specific question, that's difficult to quantify. I doubt you'll bet much of a break buying new, except for perhaps a brokers "package" deal on electronics, canvas and sails etc, and you'll have to expect to take the "showroom hit" once you sail it away.

Used boat will be quite different as the dynamics of the deal come out. A desperate seller can work for you, but you really need to be careful and have the vessel thoroughly checked out.

The maxim "you get what you pay for" will generally hold true. Paying what you may consider a "premium" for a well found, well maintained boat may well be money well spent as opposed to buying the fixer upper at a bargain only to find your overall expenditure to make it right costs you more in the long run.
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Old 12-05-2007
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Thanks Guys. Although this will be my first sailboat I plan to take several courses and sail with someone who is experienced for a while.
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Old 12-05-2007
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Rusty
You did'nt state if you had sailing experience, either get the boat you want, have lessons on a similar vessel, or if you have the money take private lessons on your own boat.

Edit: This does not answer you question, its just like buying a car hagle and hagle somemore.
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Old 12-05-2007
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Unless there is a very good reason for wanting a new boat, you'll probably be much better off getting an older, used boat. It will give you a lot more boat for the buck and come with a lot more equipment than a new boat generally will, especially if you're looking to do more than just daysailing.
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Old 12-05-2007
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Agree and Disagree with others

I agree that you should generally stay away from a new boat in this size range, unless you have wads of free cash, and look for used. There are PLENTY of exceptional boats, that have been well maintained, in your size range for a fraction of the money for new. With all the extra money you save from not buying new, you can upgrade a quality used boat wit the latest and greatest stuff.

I don't necessarily agree with starting with something smaller and moving up. My first sailboat was/is a 33 ft boat. Sure, I learned to sail on Lasers and Sunfish, helped crew on my Dad's 22 ft Catalina when he had it and crewed on a 34 ft O'Day and 40 foot Sabre occasionally, but my first boat is the one I currently have. I also think that for a start multi-sail sailboat, a 28 to 34' ish boat is a good starter boat for a coastal or weekend cruiser. If you start smaller, you may be limited into the number of folks that you can take out on a day or overnight sail and soon may want a bigger boat.

The other thing is that if you buy smaller, then upsize, you need to go through the process of selling your smaller boat and then buying a larger boat each time you upgrade. This can be a hassle. Some folks here do it all the time, but I only want to do it once, maybe twice in my lifetime. Paying for a survey, taxes, etc. for each transaction is not my idea of efficient use of my money.

One thing I highly recommend is to take basic keel boat lessons first before you plunk down the money on your cruiser. Sailing a sunfish or laser (one sail) sailboat is a different than a multi-sail sailboat with a keel. Also, learn on a tiller boat to understand the fundamentals and the feel of the boat. Even though I learned on tiller boat (laser/sunfish), I relearned on a Soloing for my basic keel boat lessons before I bought my boat. There are some finer points that I never worried about on a Laser/Sunfish that are important when sailing a multi-sail boat.

Good luck in the search.

DrB
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as you see, opinions vary widely. - new boats require less maintenance and easier to take care of, especially for a novice. As far as size, my take is to get the biggest boat you can afford for two reasons - first, to preclude the loss when you trade or sell for a larger boat presuming you enjoy sailing or conversely, a larger boat is easier to sell if you should decide sailing isn't your passion.
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Old 12-05-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faster View Post
it does seem that a lot of people are jumping in at the mid 30s range these days. I suppose it's partly due to higher disposable incomes and a desire to skip a step.
Why is that?
I remember when entry level boats were in the 22'-25' range.
Ask a dealer today what an entry level boat is and the likely answer is 30'.
The smallest boat Beneteau makes for the US market is a 323, almost 33'
Is it perhaps so that the builders can make more money by selling the larger boats? Or maybe it is what the market demands? People like you say want to skip that step in the learning process.

I agree with Faster, learn to sail before jumping in with both feet.
You learn a lot more about sailing when sailing a small unforgiving boat.
On a 30' boat, you can make all the mistakes in the world and the boat will overcome many (But not all) of your mistakes.
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Old 12-05-2007
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Get the boat in the size you want.
1.Bigger boats are easier to learn to sail on
2. You won't lose a lot of money buying and selling boats till you get the size you want.
3. You will learn all the systems and not have to re-learn them.
4. The investments you make in equipment will not be wasted.
5. The training you get will enable you to handle THE boat you own rather than someone else's boat.

As to new or used...the benefits of each are pretty obvious as well as the downsides. Do what feels right to you given your circumstances. If you go the used route...don't skimp on the survey or engine analysis. If you go the new route...get a survey before you part with the last of your $$ and take posession...and make sure the builder is not in financial trouble before you lay your deposit down. (see Pacific Seacraft threads).

Get a good teacher and you will be fine no matter what size boat you buy.
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