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  #1  
Old 07-06-2008
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Roberts 44 in australia

I am looking at buying an unfinished Roberts 44 Ketch, it needs rigging and a blast and paint job (steel), can someone in oz give me some idea as to the costs of rigging a ketch and to blast and paint it, am considering getting it painted in Melbourne and motoring it up to the Whitsundays instead of paying road transport up, just a rough idea so i can work out if it is worth it.
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Old 07-06-2008
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Let em see if I can find the exact, succinct way to put this...

Oh yeah..

DO NOT DO THIS.

My advice would be in 98% of cases Do Not Do This with a worthwhile hull, of a good performing, well designed boat that had a decent fan base as that pushes up the resale value.

In the case of a steel Roberts hull...which has likely taken 7-15years to put together in someone's backyard/paddock being snot-welded together with steel sourced from Simms. For this my anvarnished advise is HELL NO.

It is not viable in so many ways, and you will only ever really definitively learn this when it sucks you fry and breaks your heart, and comes to a huge financial and emotional loss. Unless you just trust those of us that have gone before.

Are there good steel hulled boats out there, Yes. Though they are getting rarer as Aluminium becomes more available for similar specific applications. Are the Roberts designs in any way on the list of these good boats. NO. Not even a little bit. If you are going to sit at the dock and use it as a sort of floating caravan, then you just have the rust to worry about. If you actually plan to sail it around...You can do much better for much less money and actally have a boat and not a shoebox.

Sasha

P.S This boat isn't from the Hastings area is it???
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Old 07-06-2008
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Jeeez that was a bit harsh. There was an awful lot of supposition in that answer.
What if it is made of good steel and by a qualified welder ?????
Also no costs have been mentioned. If the price was good of course it could be worth doing. Not everyone wants to go fast. Some like the protection steel offers over other materials. I know if I were out in the deep blue yonder I would rather be in a steel boat than an aluminium one, and definately a GRP one.
As for cost, I don't know about the blasting and rigging but my friend is having his 42ft Steel Robert Perry Passport painted at the moment and that is costing $38,000AUD which is about the same as US$ at the current rate.
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Old 07-06-2008
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Harsh it may be...but given the info provided...Sasha provides the correct advice. Steel boats are fine and have advantages and disadvantages just like any other material. Unfinished steel project boats are another matter entirely. They are sinkholes for time and $$ and generally not put together professionally in the first place and then left to deteriorate till another dreamer comes along.
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Ouch !

Quote:
Originally Posted by camaraderie View Post
Harsh it may be...but given the info provided...Sasha provides the correct advice.
So says you Mr Moderator !
I disagree. It would have been more helpfull to ask for more info before going in feet first and putting him off what may be a good buy. Anyway he didn't actaully ask wether or not the boat was a good buy, he asked what the cost of rigging and a paint job may run to. READ THE POST.
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Old 07-06-2008
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What does he mean by rigging? Does it have masts? Does it need running rigging? Does it need standing rigging???

How long has the boat been sitting—rust never sleeps.

Most homebuilt boats, especially ones that have been abandoned, aren't worth rescuing. There are some exceptions, but those are relatively rare. Many home-builders go for cutting costs on the materials and using cheap materials is generally a bad cost-cutting measure, since the materials are such a small part of the total costs that make up a home-built boat.

For the most part, I'd have to agree with Cam and Sasha about walking away from this one. Few people have the skill set and knowledge to make a decent home-built steel boat. I've been lucky enough to see one that is going to be a masterpiece IMHO, but I've also seen far too many home-built disasters.
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Old 07-06-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bettyswollocks View Post
So says you Mr Moderator !
I disagree. It would have been more helpfull to ask for more info before going in feet first and putting him off what may be a good buy. Anyway he didn't actaully ask wether or not the boat was a good buy, he asked what the cost of rigging and a paint job may run to. READ THE POST.
My opinions here are my own and not that of "Mr. Moderator". But since you are a newbie with your first boat and 1 year of sailing experience I encourage you to step up into that backyard Bruce Roberts design. It will be an experience you never will forget. I READ the post. The last bit especially where he said.."so i can work out if it is worth it." It ain't worth it. Get it?
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Old 07-07-2008
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Why do have this sneaking suspicion that someone is building a steel boat ?

Look, Cam and Sasha might be wrong. I might also be Bill Gates love child.

Problem is that people who build themselves a hull and then fail to complete are almost always the poor sad dreamers who think that the hull is the hard/expensive bit cos its big. It's sad but true. Sadder still that they have this somewhat quaint and vaguely amusing idea that they can somehow get their money back on a partially completed hull. By the time they realise that a partially completed hull is damn near worthless the deterioration of same makes it a giveaway proposition unless they can find some equally deluded soul to take the thing off their hands.

In my 'umble opinion MJack would be far better off to go out and buy a decent second hand boat. Almost certainly it will cost less than the cost of finishing the bare hull.

One thing I'll not do is knock steel boats as such given that I have one. Yep they are a tad slower than their plastic, aluminium or cold moulded cousins but not by much and that strength thing is a very solid plus. But would I buy a partially complete steel boat and finish it off myself ? I'd rather spend the night with Chopper Reid. Oh all right, maybe not but it's a close run thing.

Our Raven is a 34' Van de Stadt. You could not half way build her for what she cost us to buy.

Finally I'd really like to know if MJAck has any experience whatsoever with steel boats or is this his first ?

No, not finally. After a bit of a think I seek some carification. What does partially finished really mean ? Is the boat undercover ? Does the shot blast and paint include the interior ? Is all the interior joinery complete ? Engine installed ? Electricals ? All that needs to be done is standing and running rigging plus sails ?

At the right price that might be a different proposition.
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Last edited by tdw; 07-07-2008 at 01:54 AM.
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Old 07-07-2008
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Betty...

You are going to get into trouble for that.

I would much rather buy a complete boat, and sail it, than spend two years building a boat, not sailing it.

I don't sail enough as it is.
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Old 07-07-2008
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Roberts 44 in australia

Some of us are getting testy ......I think it is the realization that the holiday is over, great sailing this weekend, and we have to go and fill the cruising kitty today!
Good post, there are hundreds of success stories regarding people buying wrecks and restoring them. But for each sucess, there are many unpublished failures. It is cheaper to purchased a good old boat but if one likes to work with their hands, remodel etc.. then this is good, albeit expensive, therapy. No different then buying a home fixerupper, but one must insure that the the foundation is not cracked, and there is integrity in the building.
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