... another question about NJ Registration and USCG Documentation

[vilyin]

Hi guys,

I am trying to figure out what is the right/proper way to comply with all the Federal and States (NY & NJ) requirements. I read multiple previous posts/discussions and I am still not sure I have all the correct answers.

This is my situation:
1) I live in NJ
2) I bought a boat (38 ft) last year in October - new from a dealer in NY
3) I am currently keeping the boat at this dealer's marina at the slip - permanent, not transient for this year.

As of now this is what I did:
1) USCG
a) I documented the boat with USCG and will have the "NO...." attached to the hull inside the boat
b) I have a hailing port as "New York, NY"
2) a) I registered the boat with NJ
b) I paid my NJ sales tax as a NJ resident
c) I am going to put the NJ decals at the bow
d) I will NOT put/write the NJ numbers on the bow

But then I started thinking :
1) I have a "hailing port" as "New York, NY", which I am thinking should be fine - shouldn't anyhow interfere with the fact that it's registered in NJ - as it was said multiple times here in the forums that Federal and State information are separate.
2) But what about the fact that I am keeping it in NY while it's registered in NJ ?
a) Should I (re)-register it in NY ??? - I am thinking this is something that I may need to do... But than if the next year I take it back to NJ - I would have to re-register it in NJ again ??? What if I take it to CT marina - would I have to re-register it with CT than?
I still live in NJ !!!
b) Will I have to pay NY taxes now (of whatever the difference between NY an NJ sales tax is). Probably not - as again, I am still a resident of NJ.

Can anybody please help me figure it out.

Thanks a lot!

[sailingdog]

You basically screwed things up by USCG documenting the boat and then registering it in the state of NJ. You shouldn't be registering the boat with the state of NJ if the boat is in the state of NY. It probably needs to be registered in NY, since it is physically in the state.

As for sales taxes, since you bought the boat and kept it in NY... chances are good that you don't owe NJ for taxes... but YOU DEFINITELY OWE NY for taxes. However, if you paid the NJ taxes, you can probably get a waiver on paying the NY taxes.

[bubb2]

Dog, I am sorry but you are giving bad advice.

To the OP. you are good. You are a Jersey resident, that is where the boat needs to be registered. You know what happens to jersey residents found driving cars with Florida plates. The coast guard doc. has no being as there is no federal tax (yet). It's a state thing. Half the boats in my marina are jersey boats and I on the New York side of the river.

I know of jersey residents who have used address's of "enterprise zones" in jersey. there by getting a big break on the sales tax. By the way the sales tax here in Westchester and the city is 8 1/4%, you don't really want to pay that.

[pschoonveld]

If you register the boat in another state, you do not need to pay the seller's state's sales tax. I just bought a dinghy in NY and was not charged the sales tax as it will be registered in Michigan. This, by the way, is true of most vehicles. I bought a car in Kentucky and paid the sales tax / registration in Michigan, for example, despite being given a KY temp plate by the dealer.

Your location adds a conundrum. It is common for states to require you to register the boat in their state if that is where it is kept. Having said that, I see many boats permanently located that are registered in another state or even country. In a marina in Jersey City, NJ that I frequent, there are boats with NY, CT, NJ, RI and other states, permanently docked.

As for the hailing port on the back, no one cares. Put on whatever you want.

Were I you, I'd be inclined to just do the USCG registration and leave it at that. In my limited experience in the northeast, not that many people bother with displaying state numbers. I was in Newport the other weekend racing and only one boat out of 15 in the class sported numbers. The boats were from RI, NY, CT and TX, amongst others.

[sailingfool]

I agree it appears that the OP should have registered the boat in NY and paid the NY sales tax, which actually the broker should have collected at the time of sale. (You might want to discuss the whys/why nots on this omission with the broker).

I urge the OP to figure out with 100% certainty what his obligation to NY will be, before he makes his boat's presence known to NY...and don't wait too long. Buying legal advice may be good money spent. While one state (NY) will usually credit you for sales/use tax DUE and paid to another state (NJ), they may not do that if they determine the tax was in fact due to them...they'll want it paid immediately, with interest and penalties as may be applied...and it'll be up to you to try to get the first tax payment back...

Good luck.

[pschoonveld]

bubb2,

What's the damage with a NJ resident driving on FL plates? If the vehicle is primarily located out of state or registered to an out of state person or corporation, what would be the issue?

The only thing I can think of is insurance.

[vilyin]

Sailing dog,

Thank you for your reply !

Well, I am pretty sure that I did the right thing with paying NJ sales tax - I am a resident of NJ and that is why I need to pay NJ sales taxes and not a NY ones. As I said before I can (and most likely will) be moving the boat around different States marinas - NY, CT, NJ every year or so. I don't think that I would need to deal with sales taxes over and over again.

But the question still remains - would I need to register it with every state each time I move the boat ???

Thanks !

[vilyin]

Wow, this forum is smo-o-o-king ! While I was writing my reply to the dog, I got several more answers/replies.

bubb2,
The NJ sales tax is just a bit smaller - 7% NJ vs 8 1/4 NY - as you said.
Still it helps! Absolutely ! And I only wish I bought a boat through the "enterprise zone" - actually it was one of my considerations (although a very tiny one) when I was looking at boats - one Benetau dealer has an "office" in liberty marina.

pschoonveld,
The reason that I registered the boat with the State (NJ) in addition to documenting it with the USCG is that friend of mine (also NJ resident) got fined couple years ago in LI, NY for not having his State registration.

[sailingdog]

I disagree... the boat is homeported currently in NY. The boat was bought in NY and kept in NY... it should have been registered in NY.

Originally Posted by bubb2

Dog, I am sorry but you are giving bad advice.

To the OP. you are good. You are a Jersey resident, that is where the boat needs to be registered. You know what happens to jersey residents found driving cars with Florida plates. The coast guard doc. has no being as there is no federal tax (yet). It's a state thing. Half the boats in my marina are jersey boats and I on the New York side of the river.

I know of jersey residents who have used address's of "enterprise zones" in jersey. there by getting a big break on the sales tax. By the way the sales tax here in Westchester and the city is 8 1/4%, you don't really want to pay that.

[pschoonveld]

SD is right if it is permanent in NY and NY law requires registration for USCG documented vessels (not all states do). But, if it isn't permanently docked in NY (which it sounds like it will be moving around), I don't see any reason to reg it in NY. There may be a number of days requirement that makes it less ambiguous.


vilyin:
It sounds to me like they could have contested that fine, depending on the situation. USCG reg should be sufficient for any transient boat. If it is docked permanently in NY, there may be reg requirements. Personally, I would have fought the fine and brought the boat out of state.

There are a lot of circumstances of boats doing things like this on the int'l scale. To avoid import tax, there are "90-day" marinas in Mexico and Canada where those with foreign-flagged vessels keep them for 90 days or more.