=== Pearson 30 Coaster = Vs. = Vanguard / Alberg - SailNet Community

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Old 01-20-2010
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=== Pearson 30 Coaster = Vs. = Vanguard / Alberg

Any info on Pearson 30 Coaster 1966-1968 (same as wanderer, but fixed keel) ..?

looking at one for off shore and coastal cruising, like to get some info. since there is virtualy nothing in the net



here is some very usefull info i have dug out so far;

these boats (all including vanguard have a capsize value of around 1.7 (one of lowest in industry) and excellent DL ratio which is pretty amazing!)

Alberg 35 being one of the best in the chart!

http://www.seidelmann-owners.com/SailSpecs.htm

Apparently the Coaster is very similar to Alberg 30 and vanguard / wanderer.

Here is a link i found about the Alberg 30 on sailing magazine ;

Sailing Magazine | Alberg 30

Quote:
.........It is safe to say that the Alberg 30 traces its roots to the Scandinavian Folkboat, as most of Alberg’s designs do, and the hull shape represents the transition that was taking place as builders switched from wood to fiberglass construction. The Alberg 30 may not be the quickest boat afloat, especially in light air, but don’t be misled by the specs. With slack bilges and just 8 feet, 9 inches of beam, the boat is initially tender. The short waterline increases as the boat heels and the Alberg 30 finds its stride when other boats are being overpowered. The boat has a seakindly motion, although it can hobbyhorse in a seaway. The Alberg 30 is a proven blue water cruiser; indeed, Yves Gelinas circumnavigated in one by way of Cape Horn in his Alberg 30 Jean de Sud.
Thanx much ..


Last edited by conquistatadore; 02-23-2010 at 06:27 PM.
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Old 01-21-2010
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gee, no info ?!?
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Old 01-22-2010
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All right, If I have to...

I know the Wanderer, Coaster, Vanguard and Alberg 30 quite well. My family owned a Vanguard back in the 1960's and have sailed and worked on them at various points since. When we considered buying the Vanguard, we visited the Pearson plant and looked at how Coasters and Wanderers were being built, did a sail trail, and I have sailed on and been aboard these boats quite a few times since including racing a Coaster back in the 70's. I also know the Alberg 30 quite well, have sailed on them quite a bit and helped maintain one in exchange for being able to use the boat.

Of the bunch, I like the Coaster best in terms of sailing ability and motion comfort. The Coaster was designed to the MORC Rating rule of the day, which produced reasonably wholesome boats in terms of moderately longer water lines than was the trend for that era and more efficient underbodies and higher ballast ratios than was typical for the more popular CCA rating rule derived designs such as the Alberg 30 or Pearson Vanguard.

In the case of the Coaster the hull shape was also an improvement over either the Vanguard and Alberg, offering a slightly finer entry, more powerful sections and a cleaner run. This was noticable in a short chop, light air, or in windy reaching conditions.

In terms of build quality, all three were built fairly similarly. All three were pretty crudely built. The glass work on all three, while moderately thick, was laid up with resins, glass and laminating techniques that were inferior to the current techniques. These techniques have resulted in hulls which began life not as strong as they may appear and have lost strength over time. Adding to this these boats were built with minimal internal framing and the lack of internal framing further reduces thier robustness.

Beyond the hull, there are other construction issues that relate to the period during which these boats were built. Some of these items are easily recitified, and may have been addressed by previous owners. For example, in that era, tinned wiring was pretty rare, and connections were often soldered. Even when these boats were new, the electrical systems were often a pain in the butt to maintain. Obviously with time, these early wiring systems would need replacement if they are to remain reliable.

There are other issues as well. Depending on the year and option, all three boats were built with formica faced plywood bulkheads (I should note that I have sailed on both Alberg 30's and a Coaster which had naturally finished mahogany plywood builkheads that I can only surmise must have been an option, I don't know what was the relative proportion of A-30's and Coasters with formica vs natural ply). Formica faced plywood was a nice option in terms of being easy to keep clean and low initial maintenance, but a poor choice over time, the bulkheads can rot out behind the formica, nearly undetected until there is a structural failure. I looked at a Vanguard that had much of its bulkheads floating free of the hull where the plywood had held moisture against the rotting plywood behind. The nice thing about varnished mahogany plywood is that it can be observed for deterioration and issues addressed before they become more serious.

The Coaster was a later design than the other two and so employed more molded liner and interior components than the other two. This is good in many ways but it does make access a bit harder.

In terms of your proposed use, none of these three boats are especially good offshore cruisers. They were all intended as inshore racer cruisers. While I know that all of these boats have been taken offshore, in my mind they would all be a poor choice. I would say that of the three the Coaster would probably be my choice as an all around better design.

Respectfully,
Jeff
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Old 01-22-2010
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30

thanks, that was very helpfull Mr: H

Wow! I am impressed, you seem to know alot about these.
What is your background? Are you a designer or just been sailing alot?
Just wondering.

Its funny how every one talks about how great the older Pearson ie; "Vanguard and Alberg, triton, etc"... are in off shore and capable of circumnavigation and doing circles around the globe!

But you are saying they arent really!

What would you consider a good Coastal / off shore cruiser in budget (under $15k) ?
Not looking to sail around the world, but just cruising around N. & South. Ca. Coast/ mexico and may be a trip to Hawaii perhaps at some point.

Currently i have a well setup catalina 27 and looking to upgrade.

Thanx again.
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Old 01-22-2010
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I have been sailing since 1961 and at one time I studied yacht design and at various times in my life I worked as a yacht designer. I am actually an architect (buildings).

I grew up sailing boats like the Vanguard, Alberg 30, and Triton. These were the race boats of that era. I have continued to sail on them since. Then as now, I aways considered these designs as being compromised by the racing rule of the day in ways that hurt their abilities as cruisers.

If you contrast these boats with better cruising boats of that era, say something like a Folkboat, Seawind, or even a Tartan 27 of that same era, you can see some of the compromises in terms of hull form and rig. Of course, there have been huge improvements in boat building and yacht design in the years since these boats were built,

Now then, when you talk about a less than $15,000 cruising boat for a offshore work, I would say there is no boat that is ideal for a offshore cruising in that price range. Which is not to say, that you cannot buy a boat for $15,000 and with huge amounts of sailing skill and boat maintenance and rebuilding skill, enormous care, vast amounts of luck, and huge efforts at rebuilding along the way, that you can't find some older boat that permits you to go offshore.

If I were in your shoes, and wanted to go offshore in a less than $15,000 boat, some of the boats that personally would look at in that prioce range might include the Allied Seawind, C&C Corvette, Cal 2-30, Morgan 30, Bristol 29 (1960's era and not the 29.9), H-28, Tartan 27
(With the Tartan 27 and Bristol 29 as my first choices on the list).

Of course any of these boat that were actually available in your price range are likely to require a lot of work (and money) to make them robust enough, properly equipped, with adequate consumable capaciuties, and in the necessary shape to reliably make the kinds of passages implied when you talk about safely and reliably doing long distance, off-shore cruising.

Jeff
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boats

Architect! Cool.

I am fairly new to the sailing world, but i love it already...!

I studied aeronautics, so i am familiar with the power plants and structural things (metal rather than wood!). but Boats are quite different beasts, and you have salt water rather than misty air to deal which i found out is a pretty amazing eating machine!

I understand that with older boats there are tons of stuff that can fail or weaken over time.

This boat has had a lot of work done to it already including a newer diesel, rigging, sails, etc...thats why i liked it.
but the interior on them is absolutely terrible and this one is not that great! ..
I really like Islander 30 boats, C&C and tartan, not familiar with other makes you mentioned, but will keep an eye for them indeed.

PS;
i did miss a great deal on a nice Corvette 31 ..

thanx alot.



Last edited by conquistatadore; 01-25-2010 at 04:54 AM.
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Old 01-22-2010
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Jeff_H is a fount of information and really seems to have an encyclopedic knowledge of many, many boats. He has been on and around cruising boats for far longer then you or I have and is the 'resident expert' on boat designs and he is also a moderator here so you should be glad that he took the time to post such an insightful reply. You can tell by his reply that he also has worked in the boat building/design biz in one way or another.
Jeff_H generally does not seem to be partial to many of the older boats and he has laid out his reasons well succinctly in other threads. If you search the forums for 'IOR' & 'CCA' something should come up. You could also click on Jeff_H's avatar and view all his posts.
One boat in particular comes to mind for your intended purposes is the Nor'sea 27' but I'm not sure you'll find one for <$15k. Other brands to look into might be Pacific Seacraft and CS (Canadian S..).
There are also a bunch of other similar threads where folks are asking: "What's the best boat for ...". A search of the forums for 'best boat' would probably find you a whole mess of these you could peruse for ideas on other models to consider.

Good luck.
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Old 01-22-2010
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boat

It appears boat hunting is no easy task!

But Jeff's detailed reply certainly has shed a lot of light on the subject and he sure knows his stuff, it all about experience.

One thing i have already realized looking at so many boats in the last year is how well the boat has been kept up rather than what model it is.

Most boats i have seen seem to be neglected, at least in $20k and under category, since they are older boats i guess and people just forget they even own them after a while ...

And the nice ones sell very quickly!

thanx.

Last edited by conquistatadore; 01-22-2010 at 05:33 PM.
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Old 01-22-2010
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el conquistadore,

Since I have a boat of this vintage (1967) and one of the few models Jeff_H seems to moderately like (Tartan 27') I'll chime in again.

Some things to watch out for on this vintage of boat are:
- chain plates, water intrusion rots wood core and weakens chain plate
- soft decks, again from water intrusion. Decks were usually made with wood cores
- engine age/hours
- rigging age and condition

Even though Jeff_H mentioned the model of sailboat I have I can tell you that I would not take it to Hawai'i (or Bermuda for that matter) in its current condition. Before I headed out to anywhere like that I would want to:
- re-build all chain plates
- replace all standing rigging
- re-power with a newer diesel (current A4 is 42 years old)
- re-core the few soft sections on my decks
And that is just the short list that does not include extra gear for blue water (radar, ssb/sat phone, life raft, EPIRB ...) useage.

That said, our boat was well maintained by the previous owners and is in good shape for a boat her age and just fine for near coastal use. We also got lucky that the PO had already bought himself a larger boat (Irwin 32') and was tired of paying 2 yard fees so we paid $4k.

I agree with you that how well the boat has been kept up is key to older boats. They do not even maintain book values for boats older then 1975 as each boat is unique in how it was maintained.

What model it is determines it's best usage. A Catalina 27' is always a C27, right?
check out this link: The Ultimate Catalina 27
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Old 01-22-2010
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thanx for info;

...i like this Caty ! may i'll try a double decker myself....

------------------------
quote; ...

"....What model it is determines it's best usage. A Catalina 27' is always a C27, right?
check out this link: The Ultimate Catalina 27"
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