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post #11 of 25 Old 02-19-2010
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I am a Transport Canada Appointed Tonnage Surveyor and a SAMS Accredited Marine Surveyor.

If the vessel is no more than 15 meters LOA you do not need my services as a Tonnage Surveyor, you can register it yourself on line and its a fairly simple process that cost $250.00. Here is the link.

Procedures for Registration in Canada - Registration of Vessels - Vessel Registration Office - Operations & Environment - Marine Safety - Marine Transportation - Transport Canada

Canadian Registration (= US Documentation) is internationally recognized and you will have no issues on that score.

PM me if I can help

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Last edited by boatpoker; 02-20-2010 at 01:49 PM. Reason: spelling
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post #12 of 25 Old 02-20-2010 Thread Starter
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Hello All!

It seems that I can get the boat registered as a Canadian vessel by completing the Simplified Method of Tonnage Measurement (Form #4) from Transport Canada. This form doesn't need to be completed by a Tonnage Surveyor - who would charge $2k for their services for a 30 foot sailboat. Plus, I'd still need a marine survey done anyway.

The Vessel Documentation company I'm using in Texas has contacted Transport Canada and advised that registering as Canadian will not be an issue, and for a boat of this size will not require a Tonnage Survey. It can all be done from Texas.

They also insist that there is a 3 month period of grace in Texas - not 20 days - before having to pay any Sales and Use tax. I argued with them about this because I contacted Texas Tax Info directly myself and they told me 20 days. But the Documentation Company assures me it's 3 months. What can you do?

Someone suggested registering in the BVI. Not being a British citizen, I'd have to register a Corporation ($1500 + $600 per year to maintain), get a tonnage survey ($2000) and pay the registration fee ($3500) - so it's an expensive way to fly a cool flag.

Besides, the Canadian flag is pretty cool already.

Thanks for your replies!

Cheers,
Tanny
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post #13 of 25 Old 02-20-2010
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How 'bout the Antilles

Howdy!
Very recently, a boat was sold by its owner, a Canadian of all people, who said he had it registered in St. Martin/the Antilles because it was tax free there. Don't know what kind of registration fees are involved, but this might something to chew on, considering you're heading down to that neck of the woods.

Also, I wouldn't worry about two Texas gov't. officials/employees disagreeing with each other, as much as I would worry about the seller who's trying to collect the taxes disagreeing with what the gov't. official is saying. I believe you have also have two government entities to deal with in Texas- The Texas Comptoller's Office, which oversees the local county tax assessor's office for the taxes, and then the Texas Parks and Wildlife Department who deals with the registration/title aspect. I don't remember if the local county tax assessor's office is a one stop shop for all of it or not.

Whenever you try to get info from local govt. entities, ensure they realize you are not a Texas resident.

As a Texan with a past in retail and automotive industries, I've witnessed numerous retailers charging tax on items when they weren't suppose to or different have to. Do you think the collectors filling the coffers are going to object?
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post #14 of 25 Old 02-20-2010
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In Texas, registration and taxes are all paid at the TPWD office. TPWD collects the state tax and registration fees. There is no county tax required on boats.

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post #15 of 25 Old 02-20-2010
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I just want to make sure you don't give us Tonnage Surveyors a bad name. Up here is Canada a typical Tonnage Survey is about $350.00 NOT $2000.00

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post #16 of 25 Old 02-20-2010 Thread Starter
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Hello boatpoker,

I'm not trying to give anyone a bad name.

Hare's the actual email I received to do this survey of a 30 foot Baba Tashing from an accredited Texan surveyor;

"Our approximate fee for calculation and preparation of the Tonnage Certificate and Certificate of Survey will be $1,960.00. ( Tonnage Certificate $1,470.00: Tonnage Survey $450.00: Expenses $40.00)."

The point is, it wasn't necessary - and anyone wishing to register their US purchased sailboat in Canada doesn't need to get a full-blown Tonnage Survey - as long as the boat is less than 15 tonnes.

They just need to fill out the simplified form, which they can do themselves.

Cheers!
Tanny
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post #17 of 25 Old 02-20-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanny View Post
Someone suggested registering in the BVI. Not being a British citizen, I'd have to register a Corporation ($1500 + $600 per year to maintain), get a tonnage survey ($2000) and pay the registration fee ($3500) - so it's an expensive way to fly a cool flag.

Besides, the Canadian flag is pretty cool already.
That's only $5500. Canadian taxes and duty on a $100G boat is going to multiples of that, GST alone would be $5G.

Thats why I asked what the boat is worth. If $5G is expensive then yes there are much cheaper ways to go.

Be sure to pay taxes. I know of at least one guy on the hook for big money, I guess we would say really big money, as in buy a whole boat type of money, when he gets back or audited. The CRA are not nice people if they think you are trying to keep their money.

Sounds like you got it well under control, through.

I also got crazy quotes for a Tonnage Survey in Florida. I suspect it happens when they hear your accent.

Which reminds me of an American telling me of a deal at one of their local West Marine outlets. I asked about it but I was told it was list price only. I went back to my buddy and he asked if I had used that Canadian accent when I inquired about the deal. I said "eh? What accent?"

Have faith that the oceans are going to rise and flood the world, that plague and pestilence brought on by Climate Change is going to punish us for not believing. Please do as they say it is our only hope. :P
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post #18 of 25 Old 02-20-2010
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Hello boatpoker,

I'm not trying to give anyone a bad name.

Hare's the actual email I received to do this survey of a 30 foot Baba Tashing from an accredited Texan surveyor;

"Our approximate fee for calculation and preparation of the Tonnage Certificate and Certificate of Survey will be $1,960.00. ( Tonnage Certificate $1,470.00: Tonnage Survey $450.00: Expenses $40.00)."

The point is, it wasn't necessary - and anyone wishing to register their US purchased sailboat in Canada doesn't need to get a full-blown Tonnage Survey - as long as the boat is less than 15 tonnes.

They just need to fill out the simplified form, which they can do themselves.

Cheers!
Tanny
As I stated before, you do not need a tonnage surveyor and can register the vessel on line by yourself. I want to make it clear to everyone following this thread that the quote you were given is bogus as there are no Transport Canada Appointed Tonnage Surveyors in Texas. the link below is to a list of all Transport Canada Appointed Tonnage Surveyors and these are the only people authorized to perform Tonnage Surveys for Transport Canada.

Tonnage Measurements - Registration of Vessels - Vessel Registration Office - Operations & Environment - Marine Safety - Marine Transportation - Transport Canada

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" If you don't owe the tax duye to the sale, then the state hits you with the same tax for the "use"."
USE TAX generally applies only to RESIDENTS of a particular venue, to prevent htem from going over the border, buying something big, and taking it home--without paying sales taxes on it.
As an alien buying a boat in a state and then promptly removing it to "take it home" and register it elsewhere, you'd generally owe no taxes at all.

Problem being, a Canadian-registered boat can stay in the US for only one year, IF a cruising permit is issued for the boat. And then it must go bye-bye for 15 days before asking if it can come back. It may or may not be granted a renewal, you can't depend on that.

Bottom line? Pay the tax man, register or title your boat in your home. Don't like the taxes? Change homes! That's the only way the tax men aren't going to be watching you.
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post #20 of 25 Old 02-21-2010
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While I agree it doesn't apply to this purchase, there is a Transport Canada appointed Tonnage Surveyor in Texas. It is on the link you provided. Scroll down a bit.

Brian
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