Interesting Sailboats - Page 139 - SailNet Community
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post #1381 of 6763 Old 09-05-2011
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Hei Andrews,

If you have the catalog at home I would like to know if you have seen the 37 or the 41.

Regards

Paulo
Paulo,
It was the 41. To me it didn't offer a great deal more than the Hanse. Maybe it was just that I expected more. I must admit though that for the money the Salona's look the goods though for mine I'd rather go for something a bit more up market and a few years old.

I fully appreciate that I lose out in performance and some of the more modern bits and pieces.

I was watching a new Beneteau out on Sydney Harbour last weekend. Must say they are an impressive boat to look at and a good turn of speed. I don't know if it was the 41 (are they likely to be in Oz yet ?) but going on what I saw at the boat show and looking at your post I can't say I think much of the interior. I'd rather less open space in the fore cabin and bring the v-berth further aft, while I still want a purpose built chart table and seat. I know they are not really used for navigation any more but I like the desk with a comfortable seat. The more I see of them the less impressed I am with any of the modern crop of Ikea interiors.

Gieffe 60 - now that is impressive.

Essence is just plain silly. I don't get that at all. To me the sailing boat equivalent of those gawd awful ****'n'balls stink boats.

Andrew B

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post #1382 of 6763 Old 09-05-2011 Thread Starter
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After being sailing and cruising for a month and a half without internet I was catching up and found out an amazing report about the last Fastnet (August) the biggest edition with more than 300 boats and this time with much more true racing sail machines.

The race had strong winds and it has a hard and fast race and the big news are the VOR 70:







The three made an incredible race beating all 100fts including the record older, Leopard. They arrived 1th, 2th and 3th on monohulls (real time), all the three beating the old record that belonged to the 100ft Leopard (2007).

The winner was a surprise, the Arab boat with a British skipper, beating Groupama with Camas for just 4 minutes (they had a lot of problems on Groupama).

http://www.regattanews.com/pressrele...=187&year=2011

Volvo Ocean Race 2011-2012 | Azzam takes record-breaking Fastnet win

The race could be even more interesting if the Maxi Rambler (100ft) would not have lost its keel when was leading the monohull race (mid-race). It was then chased closed by Leopard and the three VOR 70.

Some interesting videos:

http://www.regattanews.com/gallery.a...id=2&year=2011

Volvo 70s in Record Breaking Fastnet Battle - Volvo Ocean Race 2011-12 1080P HD - YouTube

Volvo Open 70s shine at the Rolex Fastnet Race - Volvo Ocean Race 2011-12 1080P HD - YouTube

Rolex Fastnet Race 2011: the start - YouTube

Rolex Fastnet Race 2011 start - YouTube

http://www.regattanews.com/gallery.a...id=2&year=2011


But of course, line honors went to Banque Populaire the big trimaran that only needed a bit more than half the time of the fastest monohull to complete the race

Fastnet 2011: Lo´ck Peyron bat 2 records sur Banque Populaire ! - YouTube

Last edited by PCP; 09-05-2011 at 08:45 PM.
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post #1383 of 6763 Old 09-05-2011
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Let's stop talking about dream boats and talk about boats most people buy and among those the Benetau Oceanis is one of the bestsellers. The 40ft boats are now probably the boats that sell more so let's have a look at the new 41 an important boat made to counteract the Jeanneau 409 domination on this important sector. This boat need to be good because the 409 is really a benchmark.























Before saying something about this boat I would like to hear your comments so please say what you think about it. Do you like it?


Oceanis 41 / Oceanis / Sailing Yachts - BENETEAU

Regards

Paulo
I like the boat okay I guess...but I'm perplexed. So was Hunter the visionary on the whole arch thing? Hunter leading Beneteau?

Actually, I'm just not diggin' the arch...on any boat. Yes, it does clean up the cockpit a great deal (I remember commenting on the amount of line in Giu's cockpit back in the day), but it just looks a little goofy.


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Last edited by smackdaddy; 09-05-2011 at 10:01 PM.
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post #1384 of 6763 Old 09-05-2011
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Damn Team Sanya placing third is a huge accomplishment. Someones unlucky China has a shot.

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post #1385 of 6763 Old 09-05-2011
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Was Mar Mostro in this one?


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post #1386 of 6763 Old 09-05-2011
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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
I like the boat okay I guess...but I'm perplexed. So was Hunter the visionary on the whole arch thing? Hunter leading Beneteau?

Actually, I'm just not diggin' the arch...on any boat. Yes, it does clean up the cockpit a great deal (I remember commenting on the amount of line in Giu's cockpit back in the day), but it just looks a little goofy.
I'm thinking the Scandinavians might just have got there a little earlier than Hunter (and I'm not at all sure they were the first) ....

hey you calling my girl goofy ?

At dawn you swine .... pistols or swords ?



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post #1387 of 6763 Old 09-05-2011
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Damn it! I just keep stepping in the poo with you dude! My humblest apologies.



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post #1388 of 6763 Old 09-05-2011
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Damn it! I just keep stepping in the poo with you dude! My humblest apologies.

Ha !!! You are only apologising for fear of facing the mighty Fuzzball in mortal combat you cad .....

Andrew B

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post #1389 of 6763 Old 09-06-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimbatete View Post
Hi Paulo and Anders,

While reading up on all these performance cruisers it seems like the Opium 39 has the best combination of upwind and downwind performance for 40 footers.

From some of the numbers, it seems to point better than a Pogo and better downwind than narrow boats like the Luffes ,Xs, Salonas. Interior seems better from the pics than the Js. Seems like a perfect racer/cruiser.

Am I making sense with regards to this boat?
Hi Chimbatete,
always difficult to evaluate performance since so many facors influence this. But from what I have observed now after sailing my Opium for a while is that when in non favourable conditions it is as good as other performance cruisers (Dehlers, Arcona, etc) while the advantages are still there: very light so good speed in light winds between 40-120 TWA, very quick to surf, fun to sail. Huge cockpit, twin aft cabins and big storage space and still full control due to twin rudders. And still a "normal" interior.

Regards,
Anders
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post #1390 of 6763 Old 09-06-2011 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimbatete View Post
Hi Paulo and Anders,

While reading up on all these performance cruisers it seems like the Opium 39 has the best combination of upwind and downwind performance for 40 footers.

From some of the numbers, it seems to point better than a Pogo and better downwind than narrow boats like the Luffes ,Xs, Salonas. Interior seems better from the pics than the Js. Seems like a perfect racer/cruiser.

Am I making sense with regards to this boat?
Well, I would say that for Anders it is the perfect performance cruiser since he had bought one but for Eric that is waiting the delivery of a Pogo 12.50 the Pogo would be the perfect performance cruiser while for me that probably will buy a Salona 41 (or 38) the Salona would be the perfect performance cruiser

This thread is not about the perfect boat, performance cruiser or otherwise, but about good boats and their characteristics, helping sailors to find the boat that more adjust to their concept of perfect cruiser: Different sailors, different perfect cruisers, cruiser-racers or any other type

Regarding speed the only way to know is having the boats on the water at the same time and see the differences. That has already been tested by a sail magazine with a comparative test between the Opium 39, a prototype for the Pogo 12.50 and a Dufour 40e. A Dufour 40e is closer to a Salona 41 but slower and with less pointing ability. I have posted about that:


Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
....

You should read this boat test:

YouTube - Match au sommet voiliers de 40 pieds !

They have made a comparison between a Dufour 40e, an Opium 39 and a Pogo 40 cruising (12.50 prototype). The wind was a good force 5 and the sea had short waves. Close to the wind the speed were the same (7.5), with the Opium (with a worst sail, the original was stolen) making less 5║ to the true wind.

They have said that the Dufour is a little better with winds lighter than 20K and the Pogo a bit better over 20k. The Dufour is more comfortable and passes better the short waves, the Pogo passes in power (I believe that is why he needs more wind to be faster than the Dufour).

Downwind the Pogo rules with 12k with the other boats making 8/9K.
Of course, for having that performance a Pogo is a much more stripped down boat with a poorer interior than the Dufour or the Opium. That has no importance to some but would have for me.

Regarding the comparative performance of narrower performance boats like the Salona 41 or the First 40 compared with the Pogo 12.50 it all has to do with the sailing conditions: Downwind, with more than 14K a Pogo 12.50 would go away, but look at the results of the last editions of the Sydney-Hobart race and you will see that a First 40 always beat a racing Pogo 40 (more powerful than a 12.50).

The Sydney-Hobart is a race with rough weather, lots of waves and lots of upwind sailing. On those conditions a traditional cruiser racer like the First 40, the Salona 41, the X 40 or the x 122 will go faster and most of all smother than a boat like the Opium or the Pogo.

If there was a perfect type of boat for having as a performance boat, all brands would be making that same kind of boat. They are not because boats are compromises, even in what regards performance and different sailors chose different compromises even in what regards performance.

Regards

Paulo
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Last edited by PCP; 09-06-2011 at 08:30 AM.
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