Interesting Sailboats - Page 220 - SailNet Community
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post #2191 of 6763 Old 03-31-2012
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

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Originally Posted by Chimbatete View Post
Heres the video of the A27. One gripe I have is that they shouldnt call a 27 footer a budget entry with a price north of $100k.
The sad thing is, these days that IS a budget entry. Luckily, with the 10's of thousands of GOB's out there, one can get into a decent big boat for less than the sales taxes on that 27'.

I, myself, personally intend to continue being outspoken and opinionated, intolerant of all fanatics, fools and ignoramuses, deeply suspicious of all those who have "found the answer" and on my bad days, downright rude.
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post #2192 of 6763 Old 03-31-2012
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Doesnt have to be that old Jonb I see 5 year old J100s less than the A27.
And as much as I love some of these boats but thats big dough for a daysailer carbon mast and all.

I think its Paulo who mentioned that some people prefer to spend more than an overnight on a boat then heck id get another modern boat like a Dehler 32 or Elan 31 for what? Another 20K? It caters to the same sailing program.

1974 CC 27

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post #2193 of 6763 Old 03-31-2012 Thread Starter
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

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Originally Posted by Chimbatete View Post
Doesnt have to be that old Jonb I see 5 year old J100s less than the A27.
And as much as I love some of these boats but thats big dough for a daysailer carbon mast and all.

I think its Paulo who mentioned that some people prefer to spend more than an overnight on a boat then heck id get another modern boat like a Dehler 32 or Elan 31 for what? Another 20K? It caters to the same sailing program.
I guess the guys that will buy new Archambault or new Jboats are guys that want to win races. A 5 year old boat will not be as competitive as a new boat (another model). Winning is a nice and valuable thing.

In what concerns devaluation these kind of boat have a big one when there is a new model that is faster. The older model can then be a very good option for the ones that like occasionally to race and want to cruise in a really fast boat.

One of the more interesting boats regarding this perspective is the "old" A40 that has a huge difference in price over the new A40RC even in boats separated by one or two years. The old A40 is even better for solo sailing and the difference in speed is marginal.

Look at this difference in prices:

Archambault A40 Boats For Sale

Look at this one:

2004 Archambault A40 Sail New and Used Boats for Sale - www.yachtworld.co.uk

You can have some great boats for not much more money. If the idea is cruising and occasionally racing I would buy this one over the 27 (I have seen even better prices), but off course you would not win major races on this one, only club ones.















But If you do sail as a sport and are good at it then the A27 will make sense and it can even be covered by a Sponsor. To have a good sponsor you have to win and to win you need a winning boat. I can also understand a guy with money that buys the A27 because it is beautiful and one of the fastest boats around and he just loves it. After all we only live once

Regards

Paulo
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Fantastic race on the VOR between Groupama and Puma. For almost a week the two boats maintained a 50NM distance sailing at about the same speed, flat out, leaving all boats behind.

Puma has finally managed to reduce that distance to only 10NM. Hot.

In meantime on Puma they have took time to shoot these wonderful photos of the Horn:





Volvo Ocean Race 2011-2012 | PUMA on the attack as Telefónica's repairs get underway

Volvo Ocean Race 2011-2012 | Race Data Center
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Paulo

Two questions on those A40 boats for sale. (understand that Im relatively new to sailing) First of all they are beautiful boats and would fit the need of 99% of those who race around the cans and regattas. Inside they are beautiful too.

Do you think that these boats are at a good discount because they are not as fast as the new boats like you say or is it because theyve been raced hard?

Second, wouldnt a fast boat like the A27 be racing under ratings? I have read that some boats are too penalized for racing that they would require high levels of sailing to win.

1974 CC 27
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post #2196 of 6763 Old 04-01-2012 Thread Starter
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

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Originally Posted by Chimbatete View Post
Paulo

Two questions on those A40 boats for sale. (understand that Im relatively new to sailing) First of all they are beautiful boats and would fit the need of 99% of those who race around the cans and regattas. Inside they are beautiful too.

Do you think that these boats are at a good discount because they are not as fast as the new boats like you say or is it because theyve been raced hard?

Second, wouldnt a fast boat like the A27 be racing under ratings? I have read that some boats are too penalized for racing that they would require high levels of sailing to win.
If you really want to win on handicap on club racing probably you should look for some easy old boat with a low rating, I don't know. Personally I would not give a dam about that and would be interested in finishing first in real time among boats of that size and in middle of much bigger boats and it seems that start's to be a tendency.

Besides this boat will teach you how to sail, I mean in a boat like this all trims count and this boat has an huge trimming possibility.

Regarding the boat to be worm out after racing I guess each case is a case but I can give you a generic opinion about what I have saw in the search of my cruising boat even if I never saw an used A40. Never saw one because that boat in what regards the interior is more naked than what I wanted. Like the Pogo it only has a door on the head and the galley is small for living aboard for a long time, I mean, at least with my wife that likes to cook (and I don't mind about that). That would be the kind of boat that I would have if I lived alone and sailed solo or with some friends.

Regarding boats used almost exclusively for racing I saw one J 133 from 2004, two Dufour 40 performance from 2007 and an 2007 Comet 41s Racing. These were boats with only one owner and used for serious racing and no cruising.

All shared some characteristics, the rigging and the running rigging, the winches all was very good and on top conditions, in some cases with many upgrades from a regular boat, like 3 speed manual winches and other stuff.

Almost all boats had the standard set of sails as new and some had an huge sail inventory with very expensive sails in very good condition.

The interior even if clearly not used for cruising (on more than one boat the stove had never been used) showed signs of racing use, I mean steps wear, little marks a bit everywhere, nothing big but things that my wife would not have accepted.

I guess we can divide this type of boats in two categories in what regards use: The ones that were seriously raced by a top team and the ones that are older and have already known several owners.

The first ones will be probably in tip top conditions: You don't imagine the money these guys give for winning big time. Nothing is spared to make the boat faster so everything should and is normally perfect. To give you an Idea of the money these guys spend, some years ago when I saw that J133, I tried to lower the price and the dealer said that he was sure the owner would not accept because the sail inventory had a value almost as big as the boat itself


The second ones were like that once before being bought by budget sailors that wanted a boat for club racing and the chances is that when they sell them they will not be in perfect conditions and will need some money spent in sails, and in rigging.

I believe the first ones are the ones that is worth to look for. The money you are paying for them is probably 1/3 of the money the boat and sails had costed them five or seven years ago and you can bet the sails only are one or two years old and that the running rigging was already replaced and is probably 3 years old, or less.

If you don't have a wife pointing to all that small interior imperfections, it is the best deal you can have for a fast cruising boat.

Regards

Paulo

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post #2197 of 6763 Old 04-01-2012 Thread Starter
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

So let's look at another type of boat one that will never grow old because it looks already old, old but beautiful in a classical way.

Among them I believe we did not talk yet about the Rustler 33 a fast and classical boat (with a modern rudder and keel) that would make proud any owner. A great way to daysail or weekend cruise a boat that would give a lot of pleasure to own and sail, a beautiful object by itself, one to keep.








http://www.rustleryachts.com/resourc...20Brochure.pdf


...

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Re: Interesting Sailboats

On the VOR, for the first time Puma has the lead over Groupama.

They have weak wind now but that is going to finish and they will get a depression that will lead them almost to the finish line and then another one will come and they will finish power sailing style.

No tactical big play till the finish line, only good sailing and the best to win. I guess these two deserved already to win. It is going to be exciting till the end!!!

Volvo Ocean Race 2011-2012 | Race Data Center




On Groupama the 1st of April lye: They say that they are taking a rest and that from now one only a guy will be on deck while the others are below sleeping after all they are almost all solo sailors

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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
So let's look at another type of boat one that will never grow old because it looks already old, old but beautiful in a classical way.

Among them I believe we did not talk yet about the Rustler 33 a fast and classical boat (with a modern rudder and keel) that would make proud any owner. A great way to daysail or weekend cruise a boat that would give a lot of pleasure to own and sail, a beautiful object by itself, one to keep.





http://www.rustleryachts.com/resourc...20Brochure.pdf...
Oooooohhhhhh! Gorgeous. I could definitely see that as a "last" boat. Funny thing though, to me, boats without pulpits and lifelines have an unfinished look about them.

I, myself, personally intend to continue being outspoken and opinionated, intolerant of all fanatics, fools and ignoramuses, deeply suspicious of all those who have "found the answer" and on my bad days, downright rude.
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

And just for fun, two more movies on the incredible cathegory. Maybe you have saw them, maybe not






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