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  #3421  
Old 01-25-2013
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Interesting books that can be downloaded for free:

Practical Seamanship : Essential Skills for the Modern Sailor - Free eBooks Download

RYA Advanced Sailing: Advanced Handbook - Free eBooks Download

RYA Navigation Handbook - Free eBooks Download
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  #3422  
Old 01-26-2013
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Dufour 36 P

Quote:
Originally Posted by zdamen View Post
...

Just as curiosity, there's one in Belém right now, that's going to cross the atlantic as it's headed for Brasil.

The owners tried it out last saturday(!) and as it seems it didn't went under... 50knts registered aboard!!!

Wasn't my first choice but let's hope it was the right one.

Cheers all!
Hi José,

That is very interesting. Who are those guys? I want to meet them. Can you invite them to come to this thread?

I have questions and they have interesting information to share, like what was the sail they use to sail in 50K wind (if any sail at all) a light boat like the Dufour 36P and how the boat behaved.

And not only that but to know about their plans. I am interested to know Portuguese long range cruisers. It would be nice not only to meet them as to sail with. Tomorrow I have a lunch with 4 that comes in that category and there are plans to sail the Eastern med and also to Sail to Brasil and Argentina. So please see if besides that invitation you can get me their email.

Regards

Paulo
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  #3423  
Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Hanse 415/HR 412

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post

About the HR 412, I visited the boat with my daughter that is almost a graduate in design, to show her a boat with a quality interior. Well, she was not impressed at all, neither me. The quality is good but probably not as good as on a Solaris 37 that we had visited previously and the design quality is just vulgar while on the Solaris is outstanding.

The overall design of the boat is also of average quality and I men cabin and cockpit and even my daughter noticed that. The only thing that stands out is the aluminum fixed spraywood that looked as good as ever.

But most of all what was really odd was the lack of storage space on the cockpit, a bit like the Hanse. You just don't have space for taking the fenders in and that is ridiculous in my opinion. Many shipyards have been investing too much in interior space, the one most people notice most on the boat shows, at the cost of outside storage and functionality in what regards cruising.

I was not expecting Halberg-Rassy to be one of them. My boat or the Salona 41 have incomparably more outside storage space than the HR 412. Both boats can be used for cruising with a 3 cabins set-up, not the HR 412, that is like the Hanse 415 strictly a 2 cabin boat in what regards cruising, I mean, not week-end cruising.

I find that unacceptable on a 12.6m boat, specially if it is a main stream cruiser and not a performance boat like the Salona 41 or the Comet 41.


Regards

Paulo
Paulo,
I agree with your take of the Hanse interior. It is a shame, because there is a lot to like about the boats, but the interior quality and finish is a deal breaker, at least for me. The 415 I was on had such thin flooring, the gaps would pinch your bare feet. It is good to know, that Dehler hasn't lowered its quality standard since its marriage with Hanse, unlike Moody.
I am however perplexed at your take of the HR 412. I have not seen the 412 yet, but have been on quite a few HR's and crewed on a 372. The build quality has always been exceptional, and the boats are designed for the reality of sailing, and life aboard underway.
Why do you say the HR is strictly a 2cabin boat? There are 3cabin versions. From a storage point of view?
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  #3424  
Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Hanse 415/HR 412

Quote:
Originally Posted by bjung View Post
Paulo,
I agree with your take of the Hanse interior. It is a shame, because there is a lot to like about the boats, but the interior quality and finish is a deal breaker, at least for me. The 415 I was on had such thin flooring, the gaps would pinch your bare feet. It is good to know, that Dehler hasn't lowered its quality standard since its marriage with Hanse, unlike Moody.
I am however perplexed at your take of the HR 412. I have not seen the 412 yet, but have been on quite a few HR's and crewed on a 372. The build quality has always been exceptional, and the boats are designed for the reality of sailing, and life aboard underway.
Why do you say the HR is strictly a 2cabin boat? There are 3cabin versions. From a storage point of view?
Let me add something negative about the Hanse: They don't have an water proof bulkhead between the rudder and the rest of the boat. Has you know a violently broken rudder can be one of the reasons for water ingress on a boat and several had sunk that way, including at least one Hanse. That is also a deal breaker for me.

Regarding the HR 412 being strictly a 2 cabin version, yes, it has to do with storage. Any boat that has not on the cockpit lockers enough space for the storage of a liferaft, fenders and some ropes will not fit me and that is very clearly the case with the 3 cabin version of the HR 412 that I had visited.

Some sail with the fenders over the deck. Not me, it is not only ugly as it complicates maneuvering and it is just plain dangerous with bad weather.

Regarding the interior I had not said the interior was of bad quality, I have said that the interior design was average while other quality boats have not only high quality build interiors but also very high quality designed interiors. I am not talking about style, more modern or conservative, I am looking at it as a professional, I mean you can have high quality in design no matter the style.

I guess that HR is one of the boat builders that did not understood yet that as the same way that the hull and rig design should be left to the best professionals, the same happens with interior design. I bet that the HR interior is house designed. No matter the quality of finish that is not enough to warranty the best overall quality and they are going to pay for it. XC yacht has a better design quality as well as others. Just take a look at a comparison photos with the much smaller Solaris 37:









and regarding 360 pictures, have a look at the HR 412:

http://www.yachtingmonthly.com/fileB...F/hr412-s_.swf

and at the older winner 12.20:

http://www.yachtingmonthly.com/fileB...nner_1220_.swf

or at the Moody 41:

http://www.yachtingmonthly.com/fileB...1_classic_.swf

or at the Jeanneau 409:

http://www.yachtingmonthly.com/fileB...neau409_s_.swf

or the smaller Xc 38:

http://www.yachtingmonthly.com/fileBank/SWF/xc38-s_.swf

Note that I am referring to quality in design, not style or build quality and I am not saying that HR has bad quality in design, just average. Older boats do not have trough hull views but they can mount them at request.

Regards

Paulo

Last edited by PCP; 01-26-2013 at 11:36 AM.
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  #3425  
Old 01-26-2013
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Vendee Globe

While the Kid is at less than 24 yours to win the race the attention is on Jean-Pierre that had to sail his boat without keel on heavy seas and high winds. He had survived but CHAPEAU to Mike Golding, look a this:


Email from Alex sent yesterday to Jean-Pierre:

"Hello Jean-Pierre,

The sea is increasingly big today.

I'm not letting you navigate alone only when the wind will strengthen in a few hours. I'll come and join you gybe, navigate at your side until the weather conditions (wind and waves) become more moderate in the Azores.

I know you did not ask for assistance, but it will not make a big difference to my race and anyway, I have not see any other boats for a few months, I feel alone!

I hope everything goes well for you,

Alex "



Answer from JP to Alex Thomson:

"Thank you Alex. It touches me deeply.

I will study the weather to see if I can continue to safely navigate to the Sables d'Olonne".


and some great images:


Day 77 Highlights por VendeeGlobeTV


Vendée Globe 2012 - Week 11 Highlights por VendeeGlobeTV

Last edited by PCP; 01-26-2013 at 02:02 PM.
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  #3426  
Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Sorry, Paulo, if you've covered these, but today there was an inquiry about a Schoechl Sunbeam 34 (Austrian?) and I found an '09 video showing they were still in business then.. do you know of them or are they covered earlier?
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  #3427  
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

PCP,

I feel you are right about the HR's. They really are just a good cruising boat and not a great cruising boat. Both my wife and I do not feel they are worth the money. Like you say no exterior storage because the company feels it needs bigger sea berths instead of the proper smaller sea berths. Too bad they felt it needed to push out the ends like they did. It's not only fenders one can not stow away its outboards, inflatables, drouges secondary and 3rd anchors, all the fuel cans and all the lines needed to run a boat safely. I have no respect for boats that look like gypsy boats with everything strapped down on deck. There is no need for that in this day and age of good design. My wife has sailed HR's for many miles in her past and always felt the deck layout was poor. She always felt off balance while working on deck, things like shroud layout made for tough movement on deck. Reefing seemed unbalance to her also maybe because there is always too much equipment strapped down on deck.
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  #3428  
Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Faster View Post
Sorry, Paulo, if you've covered these, but today there was an inquiry about a Schoechl Sunbeam 34 (Austrian?) and I found an '09 video showing they were still in business then.. do you know of them or are they covered earlier?
I don't think so but in fact I was thinking in making a post about the new 28.1 but there are so many new interesting sailingboats....

Yes I know the sunbeams, I have been inside several and last summer I overtook a Sunbeam 44ft passing really close with 25k wind and the boat was going really well for an heavy boat, stable as a rock

10 years ago they looked like CC Bavarias, only a bit better build but they really have been making a big way in what regards design, well Bavarias too, specially in the last years.

Take a look at their new creation, the 28.1, a weekend cruiser. Who would say that this boat come from a very conservative builder












http://www.sunbeam.at/fileadmin/user...2013_quer2.pdf

In 2011 they have released a more conservative cruiser but a nice one with overall great quality and a very nice interior (the Sunbeam were always expensive boats):





Regards

Paulo
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  #3429  
Old 01-26-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

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Originally Posted by hannah2 View Post
PCP,

I feel you are right about the HR's. They really are just a good cruising boat and not a great cruising boat. Both my wife and I do not feel they are worth the money. Like you say no exterior storage because the company feels it needs bigger sea berths instead of the proper smaller sea berths. Too bad they felt it needed to push out the ends like they did. It's not only fenders one can not stow away its outboards, inflatables, drouges secondary and 3rd anchors, all the fuel cans and all the lines needed to run a boat safely. I have no respect for boats that look like gypsy boats with everything strapped down on deck. There is no need for that in this day and age of good design. My wife has sailed HR's for many miles in her past and always felt the deck layout was poor. She always felt off balance while working on deck, things like shroud layout made for tough movement on deck. Reefing seemed unbalance to her also maybe because there is always too much equipment strapped down on deck.
hannah, it was not really that what I wanted to say. In fact in what regards rigging and sailing the new HR are a lot better than the old ones and they are good sailing boats. What I was saying is that it is expected a 41ft to have the storage space to cruise with 3 cabins, at least medium range cruising. Many 40ft boats can and have the storage for that. Not the HR 412.

That does not mean that the HR 412 with 2 cabins has not an adequate storage for long range cruising. In fact it has. Comparatively the HR 372 is a better boat. For a lot more money the HR 412 offers not much more, just a bit bigger everywhere, but not really able to offer a practical 3 cabin boat.

Regarding price...well they are expensive and I like more the XC line of Xyachts in what regards that type of boats, but then the XC are even more expensive

Regards

Paulo

Last edited by PCP; 01-26-2013 at 08:08 PM.
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  #3430  
Old 01-27-2013
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Vendee Globe

And for the ones that want to follow the finish in direct they can do it here:

Vendée Globe - Vendée Globe 2012-2013

It will start at 13.30, local time and that should be in a bit less than half an hour.

The kid is coming home at 17K, what a come back

Jean-Pierre is now 4th and I believe he can keep that place if he manages to maintain the boat the right side up. For the ones that missed most of the race he is sailing without a keel since Brazil. Armel will be second and Alex 3th.

The time will be an incredible one, 78 days. I believe this record would be difficult to beat on the next edition.

Last edited by PCP; 01-27-2013 at 08:00 PM.
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