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  #4571  
Old 09-14-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

And SIRIUS Yachts announced the new 40ft in Dusseldorf 2014,
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  #4572  
Old 09-14-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Najad went down together witn new owner Nord-West motoryahts. It took a long time until a real estate developer and a local motor yacht reseller bougt the lot. As saying goes right now there are not any plans to restart Najad.

Maxi is now owned by Delphia so is it a Maxi or Delphia - hm...but carrying the Maxi label,

Yes, I know that the more waves the slower a beamier hull will be. The message I wanted to bring forward was that these beamy boats can be rather nice going upwind in - as Yacht magazine also concluded in their test. And sorry, it was a Comfortina 42 with racing sails and definitively without all the extras I had on board. And it is a rather sharp boat. The Dehler 36 with racing sails and a competent crew, also without all the stuff I had on board and a dingy trailing after me, that I rolled ower did not either had a chance against that boat, as all the other boats doing the 15 NM miles beat that day up Lilla Bält in Denmark. Yes, flat water but also only 8-10 knots of wind.

Regards,
Anders

Last edited by JAndersB; 09-16-2013 at 09:46 AM.
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  #4573  
Old 09-15-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by JAndersB View Post
Najad went down together witn new owner Nord-West motoryahts. It took a long time until a real estate developer and a local motor yacht reseller bougt the lot. As saying goes right now there are not any plans to restart Najad.

Maxi is now owned by Delphia so is it a Maxi or Delphia - hm...but carrying the Maxi label,

Yes, I know that the more waves the slower a beamier hull will be. The message I wanted to bring forward was that these beamy boats can be rather nice going upwind in - as Yacht magazine also concluded in their test. And sorry, it was a Comfortina 42 with racing sails and definitively without all the extras I had on board. And it is a rather sharp boat. The Dehler 36 with racing sails and a competent crew, also without all the stuff I had on board and a dingy trailing after me, that I rolled ower did not either had a chance against that boats, as all the other boats doing the 15 NM miles beat that day upp Lilla Bält in Denmark. Yes, flat water but also only 8-10 knots of wind.

Regards,
Anders
Nice discussion and I think in the end we agree.

Yes, beamy fast boats can go very well upwind in flat water and even with waves, even if not so well, because they are powerfull (hull stability + big ballast or big draft) but at at cost of a more uncomfortable motion.

Yesterday on the Corinth Golf, while must boats were motoring against the wind or coming back I was beating upwind with 20/24k wind and 1.5/2m waves on genoa only (sometimes full) making 26º off the wind (apparent) and a speed between 6.3 and 7.3K. In the end I made the 20K to the next port (directly upwind) at a VMG between 4 and 5K. That's the conditions were a narrow boat will have the advantage. Probably a Luffe 40.04 would have been even faster than my boat, certainly a J122 would.

Regarding Maxi and Delphia, I think Maxi will have a great degree of Independence, the same way Grand Soleil has under Bavaria ownership or Dehler under Hanse.

Guys, I have no internet anymore because I am crossing to Italy so I will not be around much.

Regards

Paulo
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Last edited by PCP; 09-15-2013 at 06:51 AM.
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  #4574  
Old 09-16-2013
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Re: French aluminum centerboarders

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
Welcome to the thread!

I have an idea LOL. Aluminiun French centerboarders were born as voyage boats and a voyage boat sooner or later will get bad weather. Yes, all of them can take bad weather and many have endured storms.

May I recall you that one of the most famous voyagers, Jimmy Cornell after several circumnavigations with different types of boats had choose as is final perfect voyage boat a French aluminium centerboarder? A OVNI 435. Now Cornell is even more impressed with Allures that in my opinion are a step ahead of traditional OVNI even if OVNI has now a different kind of centerboard that I know not well but looks promising.



That does not mean that this type of boat is the only suited to voyage but certainly it is one of them and the one favored by the French that have a huge variety of boats to choose.

Here you have a movie of one enduring 70K at port in the Arctic (I would hate to have my boat on those conditions) and some sailing with heavy wind even if not in storm conditions.







Regards

Paulo
Hi Guys,

In Spain and first chance to look at interesting sailboats in 4 weeks. Sorry I will not be able to write a lot about how our new French centerboard Boreal 44 is doing but a quick note. Gurnsey to Brittany on first major sea trial. Bean reach 30 to 35 knots from west 3 knots of current from east. Typical lousy English channel day. Waves standing and breaking 3 to 4 meters just a messy day. RC LOUISE sailed perfectly with one reef in Genoa and one in main. I swear not one pooping a few bits of spray every few hours. We made lunch below in the worst of the weather ate in the cockpit, no sea sickness.

North coast of Spain with trough over Spain and Portugal, Azore high off the coast, Paulo and others know this one lousy crazy weather. 30 plus knots dead down wind, no other way of doing it. Seas 4 meters plus after an hour of 3 to 4 meters. Up the centerboard and just used the main, I have never been able to do that with any cutter rig in my 40 plus years sailing around the globe. We had lunch again in cockpit never once even thought that we would round up while surfing. Speed 6 knots at very top of climb and surfed between 9.2 and 11.2 knots totally under control.

All these French boats handle this way granted some better than other but all well. We think we did the best after talking with many of owners of the other makes, they would agree also. We feel confident in big seas over 5 meter but we will have to wait till we cross the pond later hopefully we don't have to see big seas I'm too old now for that size sea.

Jimmy Cornell we have heard asked for a Boreal and Boreal laughed their ass off at him. I love the French serious sailors.

I'll post more the good and the bad about our new Boreal. Their is not much bad just French culture built into the boat that makes it hard for most non French but again nothing serious.

Cheers

Steve and Tracy.
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Last edited by Faster; 09-17-2013 at 09:55 AM. Reason: fixed quote
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  #4575  
Old 09-17-2013
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Oceanis 38

New promotional video from Beneteau:


First magazine review:

First review of the Oceanis 38 » BENETEAU


Regards,
Anders
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  #4576  
Old 09-17-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

There is a new Varianta coming up-the 37. She's based on hanse 375 and is to cost less than 80 000€. I cant post links or photos, but you can see the first photo of varianta 37 on Yacht magazin's website. I like the concept of inexpensive, well sailing boat. Hopefully they will eliminate some weak points of older 44(lack of anchor locker, stowage room)... With a few add-ons she could even look good.
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  #4577  
Old 09-18-2013
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Re: French aluminum centerboarders

Quote:
Originally Posted by hannah2 View Post
Hi Guys,

In Spain and first chance to look at interesting sailboats in 4 weeks. Sorry I will not be able to write a lot about how our new French centerboard Boreal 44 is doing but a quick note. Gurnsey to Brittany on first major sea trial. Bean reach 30 to 35 knots from west 3 knots of current from east. Typical lousy English channel day. Waves standing and breaking 3 to 4 meters just a messy day. RC LOUISE sailed perfectly with one reef in Genoa and one in main. I swear not one pooping a few bits of spray every few hours. We made lunch below in the worst of the weather ate in the cockpit, no sea sickness.

North coast of Spain with trough over Spain and Portugal, Azore high off the coast, Paulo and others know this one lousy crazy weather. 30 plus knots dead down wind, no other way of doing it. Seas 4 meters plus after an hour of 3 to 4 meters. Up the centerboard and just used the main, I have never been able to do that with any cutter rig in my 40 plus years sailing around the globe. We had lunch again in cockpit never once even thought that we would round up while surfing. Speed 6 knots at very top of climb and surfed between 9.2 and 11.2 knots totally under control.

All these French boats handle this way granted some better than other but all well. We think we did the best after talking with many of owners of the other makes, they would agree also. We feel confident in big seas over 5 meter but we will have to wait till we cross the pond later hopefully we don't have to see big seas I'm too old now for that size sea.

Jimmy Cornell we have heard asked for a Boreal and Boreal laughed their ass off at him. I love the French serious sailors.

I'll post more the good and the bad about our new Boreal. Their is not much bad just French culture built into the boat that makes it hard for most non French but again nothing serious.

Cheers

Steve and Tracy.
Nice to know that you like your new boat but there is some confusion, the problem is not going downwind with 4 or 5m waves in 30k wind but going upwind on those conditions. But let me tell you that it is not worst than trying to do that on the med in 25K with 2/3 meter steep waves of short period.

Those can create an even nastier motion on the boat and they are so short that sometimes you are down with the first wave when you're hit by the second one that comes over the boat and sweeps it.

We have done it nicely and last week (since Corinth) all we have done is close upwind sailing, many times beaten. All went well until yesterday when a head port that normally Isabel leaves slightly open (protected by the spraywood) let enter in the boat an amazing quantity of water. Isabel opened the head's door and the water come crashing down. The wash basin was full as also the bottom of the boat.

Today we made the passage to the last of the Ionian Islands (Zakhintos) between 30 and 45º, most of the way well over 8K. Wonderful ride. When we came to port we were helped by a French couple in a steel boat. Very nice people, it turned out that they have been living on the boat for the last 25 years and have just finished a circumnavigation. I was complaining that my wife would not want to listen about crossing an ocean and the guy said: "why? It's a lot more difficult to sail here" LOL. Even so my wife was not convinced

Regards

Paulo
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  #4578  
Old 09-18-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kubota View Post
There is a new Varianta coming up-the 37. She's based on hanse 375 and is to cost less than 80 000€. I cant post links or photos, but you can see the first photo of varianta 37 on Yacht magazin's website. I like the concept of inexpensive, well sailing boat. Hopefully they will eliminate some weak points of older 44(lack of anchor locker, stowage room)... With a few add-ons she could even look good.
Like the 44, I mean withoust an anchor locker. If I was a young guy I would be very tempted but without an anchor locker?

I could accept a manual winch but no anchor locker? That is crazy and makes it a marina boat and not for the med where you use your anchor even on marinas and ports.

Regards

Paulo
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  #4579  
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Hi Paulo,

I hear you, the boat seems to handle well going to weather but no 30 knots and 3 to 4 meter seas yet. Beam is best I can tell you about in lousy seas. I hope over the next 5 years of sailing I don't ever have to sail to weather in over 30 knots and 4 meter seas, I'm sailing to enjoy.

About the downwind stuff. I've sailed down wind for a lot of years in conventional full to full cut away cutter rigs. In those boats and in close seas as I mentioned the problem was always rounding up on the surfing part of the wave. Not over powered but over speed on the down hill and a mast about 18 inched further aft than a sloop rig. We always seemed to pivot at the mast at least it seems that way. With the new boat we have no pivot we never want to round up just a nice sea kindly down wind ride. I could stand behind the helm, NKE on with hands in my pockets and never feel like I was going to get thrown off my feet.

The boat drives very well through wave when going up wind in normal conditions. We do not seem to get slowed down going through a wave as long as we keep her 45 degrees and not less in 2 to 2.5 seas. That's all we have experienced so far. We have sailed well to windward 32 degrees in calm seas.

When will you be back in Portugal? Send us an email. Thank you for the advice on wonderful Galacia. Great wine and great sea food, I love the fish soup and goose neck Barnicles. I caught a nice Blue fin Tuna in the Bay of Biscay small but at about 4 or 5 kilo more than enough for us.

Cheers

Steve and Tracy
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  #4580  
Old 09-18-2013
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Re: Oceanis 38

Quote:
Originally Posted by JAndersB View Post
New promotional video from Beneteau:

Regards,
Anders
This is a very interesting video and speaks, quite clearly, to Beneteau's intended market. They start by making the sales pitch to exactly the person who is going to have to approve the purchase - the professional woman who is willing to consider the sailing lifestyle but may have misgivings about her ability to sail and about sacrificing comfort to do so.

Notice that the first half of the video shows the woman singlehanding the boat in "Daysailing" configuration. The experience is shown to be very easy and non-threatening - clearly our professional woman can step right aboard and sail this boat by herself, which is an important consideration as many women might be intimidated by the idea. These images are juxtaposed with shots of the open, comfortable, light-filled interior space, just like a vacation condo on the beach.

When the man finally arrives, in the second half, for "Weekend Cruising", the tone shifts to romantic getaway mode (notice the absence of children - again speaks to the target market). Note that conditions are always tranquil and our couple does not stray too far away from shore. No beating upwind in 30 knots for these customers, just peaceful motorsailing or reaching from romantic spot to romantic spot, unfurling the gennaker with ease.

I predict Beneteau will sell a lot of these boats to exactly these kinds of customers. From my perspective, I think I could easily "sell" my wife on this boat, except that I'd be deceiving her about my own true intentions, for which, alas, the Oceanis 38 is not the right boat. So I probably won't be showing her this video. Perhaps some Vendée Globe highlights would be more appropriate, after which I can be quite sure I'll be going alone.
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