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  #4851  
Old 10-29-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

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Originally Posted by PCP View Post
J109 is an older slower boat. Try J111 owners

These guys scream of joy



However I don't think the J111 is as adapted as the A35 (or the JPK 10.10) to solo or short crew sailing, specially downwind. I don't imagine a guy going relatively fast downwind at the J111 while sleeping

Regards

Paulo
I see that there is now a new crew position on racing yachts: GoPro camera operator. Something borrowed from Volvo Ocean Racing - i.e., the media "crew". Would like to have that job on the boat, and get off the bow for a change.
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  #4852  
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Re: On Design: market tendencies and mechanical systems.

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Originally Posted by MrPelicano View Post
.. Admittedly, in cruising boats you don't typically trim your sails all that much, so presumably you wouldn't drain your batteries by using electric main sheet, primary and secondary winches, but in performance cruising mode you'd probably suck some amps, particularly if you're shorthanded and running autohelm, AIS and other instruments.

So, probably need to see continuing improvements in power generation and storage before these systems become ubiquitous. And, of course, there's always that underlying issue about electricity and salt water - you'll need to have some kind of manual back-up solution in the event you lose power.

Interesting stuff.
I posted this on another thread but as it seems to be relevant and related with what you said, I will post it here also:

"the typical cruiser boat, specially the ones that are used offshore are much bigger than 30 or 40 years ago but they are not more difficult to sail. They are more stable and we can do all reefing from the cockpit without going forward on a narrow smaller boat that is much more unstable than a much bigger beamier boat.

40 years ago it was unthinkable to sail solo a 50 or 60ft sailboat, even with a little help from the wife: too much efforts, too much difficulty. Today there are lots of couples there sailing boats like those, because it had become easy: Smaller sails (from the same size of boat), Jib on a traveler, all (easy) reefing from the cockpit and remote controlled winches took most of the effort of sailing and made easy big boats. Because big boats are more seaworthy have a better sea motion and are faster the market went that way, or should I say, cruisers went that way?
....

I have to say that I prefer to keep it simple, if I can, but some facts with my own boat helped me to change of opinion regarding these systems:

I would not have bought a sailboat with electric winches but mine come with an electric winch and a remote control, that I thought it were pretty useless on a 41ft sailboat. I was wrong. I cannot put my big main (52 m2) fully up without the help of a winch and even putting 2/3 up it takes a considerably effort that I can do (for now) but someone weaker will not be able to do (I am big). Even for myself and using a non motorized winch it take a considerable effort to put the sail up. Using the Electric winch I just pull the first 1/5 of the sail up by hand, out of the lazy bag and then use the electric winch and voilá, the sail is up in 10s without any effort.

The boat is 7 years old and the winch works like if it was new.

Regarding the winch remote control, a weightless thing very small, I was so suspicious that on the first year never used the thing. Give it a try this year and now it is always around my neck. How coll it is to trim the main sail from the steering wheel at the push of a button? Very cool I can tell you. I only regret that the winch is not one of the new ones that allow trimming on the two positions, to let go and to pull.

I guess that on the third year with the boat I will have to learn how to use properly the remote control for the steering wheel that I confess, never used but that can proven very useful to solo sailing. In fact Solo racing sailors use it extensively."


I don't think the consumption is significant, except to hoist the main but I always do that with the engine running. The consumption is much less than the one on the autopilot and even in what regards guys that like to have the sails right (I try) you don't use it that much time, I mean each time you use it it will be for one or two seconds each time.

Regards

Paulo
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Last edited by PCP; 10-29-2013 at 01:06 PM.
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  #4853  
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Sad, bad strange and maybe beautiful - movie

Livorno, collisione durante una regata: affonda una barca, salvo l'equipaggio - Video Il Tirreno
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  #4854  
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Didn't see the Morris 45RS in this thread:
45 RS - Morris Yachts
Beautiful boat.
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  #4855  
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Mini Transat - Finaly!!!!

They are out going at 10K. The fastest is the American doing almost 12K


Départ Mini transat : Ambiance por minitransat

Sailing a proto Gwénolé, a Briton (French) is first, Giancarlo, an Italian (NA Lombard - Antoine Riou), 2th (NA David Raison). On the series boat the first is Ian Lipinski sailing a Pogo 2, a Finot design.

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Cartographie | Mini Transat 2013 - Douarnenez / Lanzarote / Pointe-à-Pitre
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  #4856  
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Re: Sad, bad strange and maybe beautiful - movie

Wonder if the skipper of "Telepathy" was awarded redress in the race or if he got tossed for breaking Rule 14.

Hard to say who was at fault, but typically when one boat t-bones another, it's a port / starboard incident and the boat making contact is typically the port tack boat, in my experience. In which case, judging from the damage, it looks like "Telepathy" is going to score DSQ in that one. Insurance company won't be happy.
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Re: Mini Transat - Finaly!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
They are out going at 10K. The fastest is the American doing almost 12K

Sailing a proto Gwénolé, a Briton (French) is first, Giancarlo, an Italian (NA Lombard - Antoine Riou), 2th (NA David Raison). On the series boat the first is Ian Lipinski sailing a Pogo 2, a Finot design.

Hot

Cartographie | Mini Transat 2013 - Douarnenez / Lanzarote / Pointe-à-Pitre
Yes, indeed, Gahinet went out fast, with Pedote and Pulve hot on his heels. With the breeze at 309 NNW and the boats heading 206, you'd think that 747 would have a speed advantage in confused seas and 16 knots of breeze. But we know from early season races that Gahinet is blazingly fast in almost every condition. It will be a fast first leg, I predict, and hopefully the fleet will get past Finisterre without too much drama.

As for McFarlane, he almost didn't make the race when he lost his first boat, in very rough conditions, doing his 1,000 mile qualifier in the Med. Fortunately, he was able to secure another boat, perhaps even better than the one he lost, but he didn't have much time to get it dialed in. Apparently, he used his time well.
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  #4858  
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Re: On Design: market tendencies and mechanical systems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
I posted this on another thread but as it seems to be relevant and related with what you said, I will post it here also:

"the typical cruiser boat, specially the ones that are used offshore are much bigger than 30 or 40 years ago but they are not more difficult to sail. They are more stable and we can do all reefing from the cockpit without going forward on a narrow smaller boat that is much more unstable than a much bigger beamier boat.

40 years ago it was unthinkable to sail solo a 50 or 60ft sailboat, even with a little help from the wife: too much efforts, too much difficulty. Today there are lots of couples there sailing boats like those, because it had become easy: Smaller sails (from the same size of boat), Jib on a traveler, all (easy) reefing from the cockpit and remote controlled winches took most of the effort of sailing and made easy big boats. Because big boats are more seaworthy have a better sea motion and are faster the market went that way, or should I say, cruisers went that way?
....

I have to say that I prefer to keep it simple, if I can, but some facts with my own boat helped me to change of opinion regarding these systems:

I would not have bought a sailboat with electric winches but mine come with an electric winch and a remote control, that I thought it were pretty useless on a 41ft sailboat. I was wrong. I cannot put my big main (52 m2) fully up without the help of a winch and even putting 2/3 up it takes a considerably effort that I can do (for now) but someone weaker will not be able to do (I am big). Even for myself and using a non motorized winch it take a considerable effort to put the sail up. Using the Electric winch I just pull the first 1/5 of the sail up by hand, out of the lazy bag and then use the electric winch and voilá, the sail is up in 10s without any effort.

The boat is 7 years old and the winch works like if it was new.

Regarding the winch remote control, a weightless thing very small, I was so suspicious that on the first year never used the thing. Give it a try this year and now it is always around my neck. How coll it is to trim the main sail from the steering wheel at the push of a button? Very cool I can tell you. I only regret that the winch is not one of the new ones that allow trimming on the two positions, to let go and to pull.

I guess that on the third year with the boat I will have to learn how to use properly the remote control for the steering wheel that I confess, never used but that can proven very useful to solo sailing. In fact Solo racing sailors use it extensively."


I don't think the consumption is significant, except to hoist the main but I always do that with the engine running. The consumption is much less than the one on the autopilot and even in what regards guys that like to have the sails right (I try) you don't use it that much time, I mean each time you use it it will be for one or two seconds each time.

Regards

Paulo
Just curious but have you tried a 2:1 main halyard set-up? Makes it a bit easier to hoist the main when you're shorthanded. I'm not a big person (1.7M and 70.3 kg) but I've never had trouble putting up the main on a Swan 42 or Farr 40 jumping from the mast, with someone tailing in the cockpit. Usually the last meter or so has to be winched up, but not a big problem with adequately sized cabin-top winches and a decent winch handle. We had an electric halyard winch on the Santa Cruz 52 that we used, but two people could get that main up at the mast by hand.

But no question that using an electric winch for halyards makes sense and wouldn't drain your battery. I was thinking more in terms of electric main and jib trimming in a perfomance context - e.g., like on the King 40 I described - where you are tacking pretty often and continually trimming the main. I'm trying to imagine that kind of set-up in a smaller boat, like a Mini 6.5 or a Pogo 30. Probably requires that you have an inboard diesel or auxiliary generator of some sort - solar / wind / hydro is not going to do the trick, I think. Could be wrong, though.
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  #4859  
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Morris 45RC

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Didn't see the Morris 45RS in this thread:
45 RS - Morris Yachts
Beautiful boat.
Probably not. From Morris we have beam posting about the M series designed by S&S that in my opinion are a much better design (as a classic boat) than the Morris 45Rs as a performance cruiser.

The boat has a very high quality nice interior but has an old Chuck Paine hull with a Jim Taylor keel (even that alteration has more than 5 years) and if the boat is certainly better with that keel than with the original old designed big non bulbed keel, the hull remains old and not very interesting. Besides that all that wood makes the boat heavy and for about 1.5 million dollars you can get a much more interesting and much faster performance cruising boat.

I believe they are making and selling well the M series (classic boats) but I doubt that they will sell the 45RC for that price as a performance cruiser, at least any significant number.

That's a pity. I do not understand why a brand with such tradition, quality of building and workmanship does not invest in modern cruising and performance cruising designs (hulls) and have not some of the best contemporary NA working with them on that. Even Bavaria has its cruisers designed by Farr







Regards

Paulo
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Last edited by PCP; 10-29-2013 at 04:30 PM.
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  #4860  
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Re: On Design: market tendencies and mechanical systems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPelicano View Post
Just curious but have you tried a 2:1 main halyard set-up? Makes it a bit easier to hoist the main when you're shorthanded. I'm not a big person (1.7M and 70.3 kg) but I've never had trouble putting up the main on a Swan 42 or Farr 40 jumping from the mast, with someone tailing in the cockpit. Usually the last meter or so has to be winched up, but not a big problem with adequately sized cabin-top winches and a decent winch handle. We had an electric halyard winch on the Santa Cruz 52 that we used, but two people could get that main up at the mast by hand.

....
Yes, probably I would not have a problem in putting it up like you say, except that we would need three to do that. I mean one to put the boat on the wind another to pull the sail at the mast and another to tailing from the cockpit.

Sometimes I do it alone with a little help from the autopilot (always from the cockpit) but most of the times I do it with my wife putting the boat on the wind (with the autopilot it requires more time to find the right course against the wind that sometimes is light and changing).

From the cockpit you have increased friction and besides cruising sails are a lot heavier than racing sails. I have no problem putting a 38ft sail up from the cockpit. I have tried with the Salona 38 and the Elan 380 but with a 41ft with a big sail I have to winch the last 1/3 and even so it is not that easy (I could not do it with the Salona 41 either).

With the electric winch it is fast and easy.

Regards

Paulo
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