Interesting Sailboats - Page 546 - SailNet Community
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post #5451 of 6763 Old 12-16-2013 Thread Starter
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Back to the Django 770... a new and faster version.

They have a new version with deep keel (2.0m) more RM and a sail with more area. This baby has become even nicer







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post #5452 of 6763 Old 12-17-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Love the Djangos. The 12.70 will be a great passagemaker. Can't await to see pictures of the interior of both...
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

it really scares me, if i see a production boat with such a thin and flimsy keel blade...
it might be OK for a well maintained race boat which is more on the dry than actually sailed, but a cruiser? even if labeled racer-cruiser...

heck - the open 60s get there keels replaced even more than once a year and still they tend to snap and fall off, as seen in this years edition of the vendee globe...
how many keels did part with the hull? safran, virbac paprec (although JP dick managed to finish), acciona... am i missing one?
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post #5454 of 6763 Old 12-17-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by capt vimes View Post
it really scares me, if i see a production boat with such a thin and flimsy keel blade...
it might be OK for a well maintained race boat which is more on the dry than actually sailed, but a cruiser? even if labeled racer-cruiser...

heck - the open 60s get there keels replaced even more than once a year and still they tend to snap and fall off, as seen in this years edition of the vendee globe...
how many keels did part with the hull? safran, virbac paprec (although JP dick managed to finish), acciona... am i missing one?
You need to put this in perspective. No cruiser will ever sail his/her boat at the outer limits of its performance window - i.e., pushing hour after hour at sustained speeds of 20+ knots, in big breeze and seas, for thousands of miles, under racing conditions. Just isn't going to happen. In which case, the only thing one should be concerned about is the ability of the keel strut to sustain impact damage from striking submerged objects like containers, tree trunks, sharks, etc., or grounding. That's a legitimate concern, and I'm sure the designers of the Django 7.70 have taken it into consideration when developing the specifications for this particular keel.

Ultimately, in my opinion, this configuration will appeal primarily to sailors interested in performance cruising which would include participating in events like the Transquadra. Indeed, I was looking online at an Archambault 31 for sale in Spain that swapped out the standard fin keel for a strut-and-bulb percisely to improve performance in the 2011 Transquadra, in which it ultimately finished 2nd overall in the doublehanded division. I suspect most people who buy a Django for cruising will opt for the twin keel. For me, I would go with the strut-and-bulb configuration because I still intend to race, as well as cruise.

We deal in lead, friend.
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post #5455 of 6763 Old 12-17-2013 Thread Starter
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Keels

Quote:
Originally Posted by capt vimes View Post
it really scares me, if i see a production boat with such a thin and flimsy keel blade...
it might be OK for a well maintained race boat which is more on the dry than actually sailed, but a cruiser? even if labeled racer-cruiser...

heck - the open 60s get there keels replaced even more than once a year and still they tend to snap and fall off, as seen in this years edition of the vendee globe...
how many keels did part with the hull? safran, virbac paprec (although JP dick managed to finish), acciona... am i missing one?
The problems with the keels on the Open 60's has nothing to do with it. They know already what is the problem that has to do with the fact of being canting keels and with metal fatigue due to movement and stress. They are still developing knowledge that in some years will be applied to cruising boats.

The Django keel has nothing new and the technology that is behind that is well known and used successfully in race boats for many years and they don't change the keels neither they have problems with them. You have also to consider that the Django 7.70 on that version weights less than 1400kg and that keel will probably have about 500Kg. Consider also that this boat, in his unsinkable version is the smaller boat to have passed RCD class A certification.

Regarding what a "flimsy" keel like that can take look at this video (min 2.40) and take into consideration that the boat had already suffered an identical treatment when it was
throw to the beach by big waves. At the end the keel was alright and it was needed just small repairs on the rudders for the boat to be able to be sailed back from Brazil to France again.



Take also in consideration that this was a production race boat (a Pogo) that it was not a new one (it had 6 years and many races) and that it had the original keel.

Regards

Paulo


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post #5456 of 6763 Old 12-17-2013 Thread Starter
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Sydney 43 by Salona.

What seems to be the first Sydney built by Salona was presented on the Nautic de Paris. The press was impressed by the quality of the finish and by the building quality.

The boat was a Sydney 43, an incredibly fast cruiser racer, the won that won last Sydney-Hobart (compensated) and that made an incredible race in real time finishing among the big yachts.

The boat is not a striped out racer and allows cruising, a bit like a Pogo 12.50, in a kind of Spartan way, but with everything that is needed, including a big sail pleasure



















The press was surprised with the quality and I was surprised with the price: 380 000 euros including 20% VAT. That is a great price taking into consideration the type of boat. This is a very light boat with 6950kg but most of all the biggest part of that weight is ballast. That needs an hugely strong hull to be able to sustain the loads that such a B/D ratio will create. This type of boats is always very expensive to built.

I hope they succeed in Europe. I believe that what is needed is two or three boats racing at high level... and I am sure, winning a lot

This risks to be the first Ker design to be sold in considerable numbers and not only to very top racers.


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post #5457 of 6763 Old 12-17-2013
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

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Originally Posted by robelz View Post
Love the Djangos. The 12.70 will be a great passagemaker. Can't await to see pictures of the interior of both...
,,,count me in on that one
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

PCP
The strut on the mini looks a lot sturdier than the one on the django...
Besides - a mini weighs around a ton with roughly 3 - 400 kg in the bulb... If it is a heavy one...
And granted - race boats with their canting keels impose really big loads on the strut, especially if driven hard which is their usual state of motion...
Anyway, i would not feel safe with a thin strut like this one...

Last edited by capt vimes; 12-17-2013 at 10:03 AM.
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post #5459 of 6763 Old 12-17-2013 Thread Starter
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DSS on Wild Oats

I was afraid that was not true but that's confirmed. It will be very interesting to see the effect of that on the Sydney Hobart performance of the yacht.





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post #5460 of 6763 Old 12-17-2013 Thread Starter
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Bavaria 41 s

If someone wants a better sailing boat, one that could be more enjoyable to sail but does not want to spend a lot more on a performance cruiser, the Bavaria 41s can be the right solution.

The 41 has a nice well design Farr hull and has now a much better version for ones that want to enjoy as much sailing and cruising, the new 41s.

The boat comes with a bigger mast (50cms), more sail area, a bigger draft (2.30m), a better and deeper rudder, it is lighter, with more and bigger winches and a carbon spi pole. In the end we have significantly better sailing boat, not only faster but more agreeable to sail. If we join that to the much nicer cabin design and a better designed interior (from the 41) we will have a nice boat very hard to beat in what regards what offers: a lot of boat for the money.

The boat will cost about more 20 000 euros than the standard version (without sails). The price 169 220 euros including German VAT is very good even if you have to join about more 8000 euros for decent sails.











Have a look at the interior and storage space here (that is the regular 41 that in this regard is the same as the 41s):



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Last edited by PCP; 12-17-2013 at 03:31 PM.
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