Interesting Sailboats - Page 550 - SailNet Community
 1269Likes
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #5491 of 6763 Old 12-21-2013
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 80
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 4
 
Re: Interesting Sailboats

Hello,

I am trying to help some friends in Portugal, they bought a sport sailing boat long time ago a DYAS.




The boat is quite old and needs, and they want to renewed it. I can't find the website of the producer in switzerland. Can you help me?

We are in Portugal and i would like to find a place where we can renovate it.

Thanks for your help !
APP Mode is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #5492 of 6763 Old 12-21-2013 Thread Starter
PCP
Senior Member
 
PCP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 103 Times in 86 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
Re: Interesting Sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by APP Mode View Post
Hello,

I am trying to help some friends in Portugal, they bought a sport sailing boat long time ago a DYAS.




The boat is quite old and needs, and they want to renewed it. I can't find the website of the producer in switzerland. Can you help me?

We are in Portugal and i would like to find a place where we can renovate it.

Thanks for your help !
I can try.

I cannot see the photo. It is one of these:

DYAS sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com

Please give me more information by a PM: Were is the boat?, Size? Where do they want to store it? On an open space? Closed space? they want to renovate it themselves? They want professional help?

Regards

Paulo


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
PCP is offline  
post #5493 of 6763 Old 12-21-2013 Thread Starter
PCP
Senior Member
 
PCP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 103 Times in 86 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
Celebrating a year in sailing - An American movie?

Posted by CNN:



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by PCP; 12-21-2013 at 07:02 PM.
PCP is offline  
post #5494 of 6763 Old 12-21-2013 Thread Starter
PCP
Senior Member
 
PCP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 103 Times in 86 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
Open 60's (Imoca) new rules regarding the boats for 2014



Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
and they go in the right direction: less costs and more reliability.

The hulls will be free (inside the existent rules) but the keels and masts will be standardized.

Two kinds of masts will be allowed: fixed with masts spreaders and rotating wing masts, type "tuna" with their big outriggers.

In what regards the keels they will be more reliable since they will be all carved from a steel block. More expensive and unreliable carbon fiber or welded structures will not be allowed (of course, the bulb will be lead).

There was talk about the canting keel system to be also standard but it seems that did not went ahead also has the old idea to have the boats using only renewable energies.

and some figures related with $$$$$$$ and the IMOCA class:

816 TV hours and over 400 million euros media value for the past 4 years

and that's why it is a great class with beautiful fast boats and a big evolution in what regards design: the average life of a winning boat is of about 4 or 5 years. No money, no new boats, no high tech, no development.
Some very interesting additional information and some corrections:

It seems that after all the canting mechanism will be standard. I read an interesting interview with Vincent Lauriot-Prévost that explains the consequences of these modifications namely about the importance of the elimination of the limitations regarding the heel at 10º.

Without the elimination of that limitation the old boats would be faster than the new ones. The canting system will be more reliable but also heavier as well as the keel foils, now in solid steel, while the faster boats had it made in Carbone or in a kind of void steel structure.

The standardization of masts will also imply a stronger mast but also an heavier one.

All that would give an heavier boat and the small hull improvements risked not to be enough to compensate that. They would have a problem in what regards making faster new boats.

To compensate that they eliminated an old rule (from 1996) that demanded that a boat in its worst configuration, meaning ballast full and the keel on the wrong size, should not have an angle of heel superior to 10º

VLP says that rule does not make sense anymore because it created prejudicial results: For respecting that angle the solution passed for creating water ballast that had no influence on that angle (more nearer the center of the boat). He says that the water ballast needed to achieve that arrived to 4000 liters on a boat that weighted about 7000kgs.

without that limitation it is possible to have boats that need a lot less water ballast, boats that will be lighter while sailing. VLP says that the design of the new boats will pose new challenges. Now they can put the ballast on the more effective position and use less ballast for the same effect. The boats will have a max RM of 25,5 t/m at 25° of Wheel. To manage that there are a lot of options now and the boat design is a lot more open. The bulb will have a max weight of 3 100 kg but it is possible to have less and compensate with water ballasts.

The max beam is a bit reduced (5.85m) and the angle of the canting keel is the same for all: 38º

Juan Kouyoumdjian and VPLP-Verdier have made about the same recomendation to make the new boats faster (the ones that where adopted) while Farr purposed to take measures to make the existent boats slower.

We will see if they manage to make faster boats than the ones from the next generation and it will not be easy since the bulb max weight was bigger (3 500kg) and the max RM at 25º was bigger too (26,5 t/m).

With heavier masts and heavier keel foils and heavier canting keel mechanisms it will be a true challenge to make faster boats.

The only advantage of the new boats will be a more effective position of water ballasts (needing less water) and improvements in what regards hull design and boat balance.

Very interesting stuff and again very interesting developments ahead in what regards boat design: the new boats will be probably much more different between them since there are more options to achieve the same result in what regards Max RM allowed

Jauge IMOCA-Vincent Lauriot-Prévost : « On a supprimé un facteur pervers : le test de gîte à 10°? » - Annonce bateaux - Annonces bateaux - Occasion Bateaux - Occasion Voiliers - Occasion voiles


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by PCP; 12-21-2013 at 08:31 PM.
PCP is offline  
post #5495 of 6763 Old 12-21-2013
Senior Member
 
MrPelicano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Western Connecticut, USA
Posts: 720
Thanks: 10
Thanked 9 Times in 6 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: Celebrating a year in sailing - An American movie?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
Posted by CNN:

And for all that talent and achievement, ISAF gave the award to 470 sailors? A boat that nobody sails other than a handful of Olympic hopefuls? And these undoubtedly outstanding sailors were more worthy than the man who obliterated the world sailing speed record? Or the man who not only won the most grueling offshore race in the world, but did it on his first try, at 29 years of age, while shaving 7 days off the record? And despite my personal indifference to the Americas Cup, wasn't Jimmy Spithill's accomplishment nothing short of miraculous in the history of yacht racing, coming from an 8 race deficit to win the Cup?

Sometimes I think ISAF is more concerned with kissing the ass of Olympic sponsors than really honoring the sport of sailing (again, taking nothing away from this year's winners). Oh well...

We deal in lead, friend.
MrPelicano is offline  
post #5496 of 6763 Old 12-22-2013
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Germany
Posts: 684
Thanks: 5
Thanked 5 Times in 4 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: Knierim P33

Knierim builds in an outstanding quality. The P33 is 3 years old. There is one for sale (2010, 220.000€ incl. VAT, huge sail wardrobe and Nexus NX2 complete)...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
The First time I heard about Knierim yachrs was when an almost new 65fter (a Botin design) won the ARC.

It turns out that it is a very specialized German shipyard that for years had made carbon high performance boats by command of some of the more important designers an that know decided to commercialize its own brand : Knierim Yachts.

I know some of the boats built there like the Ker 50 Varuna. They have also build besides that big and fast 65fter and the ker 50, a KNIERIM 50, an ELLIOTT 57S, a 53' Performance Cruiser, a 60' Daysailer e several other mostly big performance cruisers and racers.

The exception regarding big yachts is a very interesting 33fter, the P33, this baby:









The boat is beautiful and when I look at the dimension of this judel/vrolijk design....well, I want to go ut sailing one. Just look at this:

LOA 10 m, beam 3.20m, Draft 2.50m, weight 2780 g, ballast ratio: 54%, sail area upwind 65.4 m2 (SA/D 33.6) sail area downwind 153.8m2.

This is a very stiff and powerful sailboat and not only a nice one. The boat is going to be at Dusseldorf and I want to see this beauty on the flesh or should I say on the carbon?




http://www.knierim-yachtbau.de/downl...ierim_P33D.pdf
robelz is offline  
post #5497 of 6763 Old 12-22-2013 Thread Starter
PCP
Senior Member
 
PCP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 103 Times in 86 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
Re: Celebrating a year in sailing - An American movie?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPelicano View Post
And for all that talent and achievement, ISAF gave the award to 470 sailors? A boat that nobody sails other than a handful of Olympic hopefuls? And these undoubtedly outstanding sailors were more worthy than the man who obliterated the world sailing speed record? Or the man who not only won the most grueling offshore race in the world, but did it on his first try, at 29 years of age, while shaving 7 days off the record? And despite my personal indifference to the Americas Cup, wasn't Jimmy Spithill's accomplishment nothing short of miraculous in the history of yacht racing, coming from an 8 race deficit to win the Cup?

Sometimes I think ISAF is more concerned with kissing the ass of Olympic sponsors than really honoring the sport of sailing (again, taking nothing away from this year's winners). Oh well...
ISAF has a problem in what concerns a vision of sail as a sport. The many inside conflicting interests and a lack of a structure with different levels of importance, in what regards sail sport, make it impossible for them to have a significant role in what regards the development of sail as a world wide major sport

Compare for example ISAF with other wide world federations regarding main world wide sports with different types of series inside a main body: FIA or FIM for instance.

Regarding cars and FIA the attribution of the prize for the world's best sailor to a 470 sailor would be like to attribute that price in what regards car racing to a Kart driver instead to a formula 1 or to a WRC driver. It does not make any sense and it only means how poorly ISAF is organized to promote sail as a world wide sport.

If you talk about a world wide sport you have to define clearly levels of championships and define what are the top championships the ones were all the best sailors want to be involved in but very few (only the best) are chosen and have a place there. Obviously the best world sailor has to come from one of those championships and not from minor championships, even if they are world ones.

Regards

Paulo
daviid, EricKLYC and capt vimes like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
PCP is offline  
post #5498 of 6763 Old 12-22-2013 Thread Starter
PCP
Senior Member
 
PCP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 103 Times in 86 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
The Oracle victory on the AC and Spithill

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPelicano View Post
... And despite my personal indifference to the Americas Cup, wasn't Jimmy Spithill's accomplishment nothing short of miraculous in the history of yacht racing, coming from an 8 race deficit to win the Cup?

...
Regarding Spithill achievement on the AC being a sportive one, I don't think so. In fact at the time I said that I did not believed that all those straight victories, after the Oracle boat have being out-sailed consistently by the NZ boat, had to do with nothing but with anything that was introduced in the American boat regarding foil control, something that the NZ boat didn't have.

Today I know that I was right, so, given the big difference that created on the two competing boats Spithill, that is a top sailor, had no trouble in beating the NZ team, but it was not a fair fight nor a big sportive achievement.

I am talking about this:







This had been accepted by the jury and the Oracle team said with a lot of hypocrisy that the NZ team, instead of filling a protest should have developed a similar system. of course they forget that they presented the system to the jury in August giving no time or chance to the NZ team to develop something similar since they were busy racing winning the right to be the defying team and the main races with oracle were just days away.

For maintaining fairness the jury should have refused that system presented almost at the beginning of the main event: The races between the defender and the challenger.

It was not Spithill that have beaten Dean Barker but that hydraulic/electric system that only they had.

Regards

Paulo


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by PCP; 12-22-2013 at 09:13 AM.
PCP is offline  
post #5499 of 6763 Old 12-22-2013
Senior Member
 
MrPelicano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Western Connecticut, USA
Posts: 720
Thanks: 10
Thanked 9 Times in 6 Posts
Rep Power: 3
 
Re: The Oracle victory on the AC and Spithill

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
Regarding Spithill achievement on the AC being a sportive one, I don't think so. In fact at the time I said that I did not believed that all those straight victories, after the Oracle boat have being out-sailed consistently by the NZ boat, had to do with nothing but with anything that was introduced in the American boat regarding foil control, something that the NZ boat didn't have.

Today I know that I was right, so, given the big difference that created on the two competing boats Spithill, that is a top sailor, had no trouble in beating the NZ team, but it was not a fair fight nor a big sportive achievement.

This had been accepted by the jury and the Oracle team said with a lot of hypocrisy that the NZ team, instead of filling a protest should have developed a similar system. of course they forget that they presented the system to the jury in August giving no time or chance to the NZ team to develop something similar since they were busy racing winning the right to be the defying team and the main races with oracle were just days away.

For maintaining fairness the jury should have refused that system presented almost at the beginning of the main event: The races between the defender and the challenger.

It was not Spithill that have beaten Dean Barker but that hydraulic/electric system that only they had.

Regards

Paulo
With all due respect, when you know you have a speed disadvantage in match racing, then you have to resort to a different strategy to win. And this is where I think Spithill deserves credit... or perhaps, Dean Barker deserves somce criticism. If you are ETNZ and you suddenly realize your competitor is faster, you need to get extremely aggressive to draw penalties and force the comeptition to make mistakes. Either Barker wasn't aggressive enough, or Spithill (and Ainslie / Slingsby) did a superb job of not picking up fouls or making mistakes. My 2 cents.

But, as I said, it was just an example and the AC isn't my cup of tea anyway. And let me add that I've got nothing against recognizing Olympic dinghy sailors as ISAF sailors of the year - e.g., Scheidt and Ainslie both deserved that recognition, given the magnitude of their achievements in that venue. But both of those sailors are at the top of the sport regardless of what they're sailing - e.g., Scheidt in Stars, Ainslie in AC45s (and just about everything else he jumps aboard). But totally agree that ISAF doesn't have its act together in general, perhaps because it doesn't have access to the big $$$ that auto racing and football do (and other international sports we could mention - e.g., FIBA).

BTW, any sighting of the Pogo 3 which was supposed to be on display at Paris Nautique? I can't find any reference to it on the PN or Structures' sites, and Googling for photos comes up with nothing other than 3D renderings.

We deal in lead, friend.
MrPelicano is offline  
post #5500 of 6763 Old 12-22-2013 Thread Starter
PCP
Senior Member
 
PCP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal, West Coast
Posts: 16,201
Thanks: 21
Thanked 103 Times in 86 Posts
Rep Power: 11
 
Paris boat show

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPelicano View Post
....
BTW, any sighting of the Pogo 3 which was supposed to be on display at Paris Nautique? I can't find any reference to it on the PN or Structures' sites, and Googling for photos comes up with nothing other than 3D renderings.
You said already that but I don't think the Pogo 3 was on the Mautic of Paris. In fact I never saw a Pogo there: They simply don't go with their boats to the Nautic. Too expensive and they prefer to make the boats as inexpensive as they can. The max I had saw from Pogo on past Paris boat shows were miniatures of the boats

Here you can see a presentation of new sailboats on the Paris boat show. Not a shadow of a Pogo, including the Pogo 30.



Regards

Paulo


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
PCP is offline  
Closed Thread

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 12 (0 members and 12 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cruising sailboats for sale welch Cruising & Liveaboard Forum 10 04-25-2012 05:20 PM
THE Yacht Builder List T37Chef Boat Review and Purchase Forum 26 07-08-2011 05:51 AM
Noob wonderings and questions about sailing, life at sail and sailboats Vans General Discussion (sailing related) 49 06-20-2011 12:18 AM
A List of ALL sailboats made with layouts? Myblueheaven Boat Review and Purchase Forum 8 10-08-2010 11:32 AM
Failure to Navigate - interesting post on Panbo Blog & from the NewsReader Mass Bay Sailors 0 12-11-2006 06:15 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome