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  #6191  
Old 02-15-2014
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RC 44, Virgin Gorda

Beautiful scenery great racing. After day 2 the British from Peninsula Petroleum increased the advance, the Italians from Bombarda maintained second place but the Russian team Synergy is closer, at only 2 point.

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  #6192  
Old 02-15-2014
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RM 890 : Better than what they hoped for:



Photo taken from the last edition of Voile magazine: You can read a short boat test there (first impressions) but I would say that the boat sailed incredibly well for a performance cruiser with a great interior.

With more than 10k wind the RM makes 6K close to the wind. Opening the course the boat makes 7 and then 8K. With an asymmetric spy they went till 10K (on one occasion). The truth is that they did not exactly tell what was that bit more than 10k but I hope we can assume that it was not much more.

If the boat goes like that with medium wind I cannot wait for a test with stronger wind. It seems this one does not need much wind to plan.

As a negative point it is confirmed that the standing height is only for small to medium sized guys, with 1.79cm near the stairs and 1.69cm on the head...but this is a 29ft boat and in what regards me I prefer it like that than an ugly boat with more windage.

It seems Marc Lombard got it right one time more.

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  #6193  
Old 02-15-2014
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Talking Re: RM 890 : Better than what they hopped for:

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
Photo taken from the last edition of Voile magazine. You can read the first impressions there but I would say that the boat sailed incredibly well for a performance cruiser with a great interior:

With more than 10k wind the RM makes 6K close to the wind. Opening the course the boat makes 7 and then 8K. With an asymmetric spy they went till 10K (on one occasion). The truth is that they did not exactly tell what was that bit more than 10k but I hope we can assume that it was not much.

If the boat goes like that with medium wind I cannot wait for a test with stronger wind. It seems this one does not need much wind to plan.

As a negative point it is confirmed that the standing height is only for small to medium sized guys, with 1.79cm near the stairs and 1.69cm on the head...but this is a 29ft boat and in what regards me I prefer it like that than an ugly boat with more windage.

It seems Marc Lombard got it right one time more.
How much more do you think the RM 850 will cost than the Elan 320? If they are close I would go with the RM. Otherwise, I will continue to lust after the Elan. I'm one of those small-to-medium sized guys you referred to (1.74m), so will only bump my head slightly in the head.
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  #6194  
Old 02-15-2014
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RM 890 / Elan 320

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Originally Posted by MrPelicano View Post
How much more do you think the RM 850 will cost than the Elan 320? If they are close I would go with the RM. Otherwise, I will continue to lust after the Elan. I'm one of those small-to-medium sized guys you referred to (1.74m), so will only bump my head slightly in the head.
I was going to say that the Elan 320 was not necessarily slower since it has a bigger boat (9.25 to 8.90m) but then I looked at the LWL and quite incredibly the RM has a bigger waterline ( 8.81m to 8.71m). It seems that slightly inverted bow is not there only for the looks

The RM is lighter ( 3200kg to 3690kg), beamier (3.42m to 3.22) and it carries upwind 1.5m2 less sail area than the Elan 320. I bet that downwind it can carry as much sail and probably more.

The hulls are very different being the one of the RM based on Open boats and the one from the Elan more traditional and adapted to IRC racing. The beam all pulled back on the Elan can be deceiving but in fact it is not particularly beamy, for instance an A31 has 3.23m of beam, almost the same as the Elan.

The keels are similar but on the more sportive version the Elan has 2.15m draft while the RM has only 1.90m, an advantage in what regards saving weight in ballast for the Elan. The Elan has a B/D ratio of 0.243, the RM has 0.302. The difference in draft is not even near to make for that difference in B/D ratio. So the RM will have not only a much bigger hull form stability as it will have more RM coming from the keel with the boat heeled, and that means a much stiffer and powerful boat....and the performance is there to show it.

Probably there will be some conditions and points of sail where the Elan 320 is faster but not downwind or on a beam reach...and regarding the other conditions and points of sail, the difference is not going to be much, if any.

The Elan will perform better in IRC being easier to sail to its handicap and on a transat race the RM will for sure be faster.

Regarding prices I can give you prices at the factory but they are not meaningful to a boat deliver in US.

The Elan 320 costs 77 990 euros, but you would have to join the performance pack. You can see the price of that and other extras here:

http://www.argolis-yacht.com/pdf/Pri...0_08062013.pdf

The RM 890 costs 80 936 euros but probably you will not need all the extras that you need on the Elan to make it a faster boat. I don't believe the monokeel is more expensive than the twin keel and unless you want a carbon mast, it is all there, except electronic and other comfort type extras.

http://www.boats-caribbean.com/sites...churerm890.pdf

NOUVEAU RM890 - Blog RM Yachts | Chantier Fora Marine

Regarding the RM they don't have dealers on the US. You would have to pick up one on the French Martinique. This is the dealer:

RM 890: RM Yachts RM 890 Sailing Monohull on Boats-Caribbean.com

And an interested one since it was the only place I could find more pictures of that test by Voile magazine, these ones:













Regards

Paulo
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Last edited by PCP; 02-15-2014 at 09:52 PM.
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  #6195  
Old 02-16-2014
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Oceanis 48

A funny video with a lady (Betsy) trying her brand new Beneteau Oceanis 48. I love her facial expressions, from pure delight to some fright I bet she was used to a smaller boat.

She shows very clearly the pleasure and delight we all feel with a brand new boat especially if we like the way it sails.

congratulations Betsy



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Last edited by PCP; 02-16-2014 at 08:46 AM.
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  #6196  
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

About the Luffe:

Controls on the tiller are good
Steering is very precise, pointing is easy
More than 8kn under spi but hard to steer then - too much pressure on the tiller
A lot more space inside than in older Luffes
Nav station is higher than usual to use it while standing, too
High built quality at a good price (compared to other Scandinavians)


The rest of the time he only tells what he shows...
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  #6197  
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

Quote:
Originally Posted by robelz View Post
About the Luffe:

Controls on the tiller are good
Steering is very precise, pointing is easy
More than 8kn under spi but hard to steer then - too much pressure on the tiller
A lot more space inside than in older Luffes
Nav station is higher than usual to use it while standing, too
High built quality at a good price (compared to other Scandinavians)


The rest of the time he only tells what he shows...
Thanks!

Odd that they mention nothing about the boat not having a traveler and how it sails without it. Maybe on the magazine they say something about that.

I am curious because Oluf is a great sailor and I it is hard for me to believe he would make a boat that could not be trimmed correctly. He had already used a boat with this type of main sail set up years ago on the 43DS.

Regards

Paulo
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  #6198  
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Re: Oceanis 48

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
A funny video with a lady (Betsy) trying her brand new Beneteau Oceanis 48. I love her facial expressions, from pure delight to some fright I bet she was used to a smaller boat.

She shows very clearly the pleasure and delight we all feel with a brand new boat especially if we like the way it sails.

congratulations Betsy
It's always a delight to see people enjoying their boats. At the same time, I found myself cringing a bit at the thought of Betsy trying to control her new boat without another one or two experienced sailors on board. It appeared to me that her skills are rather basic, and the absence of a traveler control at the helm station makes it very difficult to depower the main in puffs. You could see her instinctively start turning down in the puff, which only exacerbated the boat's heel, rather than feathering into the wind, as the dealer instructed her.

I hope she gets more instruction and keeps sailing the boat. All it takes is one close call or accident to discourage new sailors from going out. Then the boat sits lonely in its slip, while the owner pursues other interests. Sort of wish the dealer had pointed her to a smaller boat.
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  #6199  
Old 02-16-2014
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

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Originally Posted by bjung View Post
Can we please stop the bobperry bashing?! His only infraction was disagreeing with the "Pope", the words "silly" and "stupid". Does it deserve to in return being called arrogant, rude, self-centered, etc. over and over and over? That to me is just, well...rude and silly!
I really enjoy this thread, and the participation of Bob Perry is very welcome. It adds another view, a very competent one, from the only NA here. I sure hope he sticks around and keeps giving his candid opinion, even if opposing views are not acceptable here.
Agree totally.
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  #6200  
Old 02-16-2014
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Re: Interesting Sailboats

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Originally Posted by funjohnson View Post
Agree totally.
A little late to the dance, aren't we, FJ?

If you'd turned up a bit earlier you would have had the complete context of the exchange. Piling on after the fact just looks opportunistic and a tad obsequious.

Bjung doesn't accurately relate the exchange between Bob, Paulo and several others in the thread (including myself). And his claim that "opposing views are not acceptable here" is utterly false - indeed, it suggests that he hasn't spent much time in the Interesting Boats thread at all, though I know he's spent a fair amount (to what effect it's hard to say).

Anyway, peace has returned to the valley and Interesting Boats are once more the topic of everyone's conversation. Bob continues to make poignant contributions and Paulo continues to keep us all apprised of the latest developments in performance yacht design from around the world.

Looking forward to enjoying your salient contributions as well.

Regards,

MrP
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