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  #911  
Old 04-28-2011
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Kiriacoulis Yacht Management Program

Hi folks

Has anyone had anything to do with Kiriacoulis and more specifically their yacht management program? They offer various schemes that allow you purchase a yacht from an approved yacht list. In exchange for the yacht being used in their yacht charter fleet for the duration of the agreement - 3.5 years or 5.5 years - you are given personal use rights that are season dependent but can add up to our required 12 weeks and they cover all expenses including marina charges and maintenance. At the end of period, the yacht is surveyed before being removed from the charter fleet or alternatively a new deal can be negotaited. In addition, you are able to use a similar yacht at any of their bases in the Mediterranean and Caribbean. The scheme has some attraction for those that will only be able to use their yacht for 3 months a year. The downside is that you are restricted in the choice of boat which brings me to my second question.

The yachts that are available in the 35 to 38 foot range are the following - Jeanneau 36i, Beneteau Oceanis 37 (the First range is not available), Bavaria Cruiser 36, Dufour 375 and believe it or not the Dufour 34e. I have asked Kiriacoulis if they would allow for some level of customisation on the yachts to improve their performance including opting for the performance version of the Jeanneau and upgrading the standard specs to suit performance cruising on the others. I have also enquired whether they would consider a Salona 37 or an Elan 350 but I am afraid not.

We would be using the yacht for coastal cruising and would prefer to have a yacht that gets us from A to B fast We have no intention of racing or entering regattas but who knows.

After looking at all the usual performance and safety ratios, my take is as follows:

Jeanneau 36i - definitely would prefer the perfomance package, like the looks, seem to have a solid reputation for build quality and resale value. Still not sure about the weight (load bearing capability) particularly if we want to do the ARC one day and re-locate the yacht to the Caribbean. Separate shower below decks in 2 cabin version a definite plus for liveaboard. We are chartering one in September in Croatia. Could always wait for that Jeanneau 379

Beneteau 37 - seems to be a good compromise between performance, safety, comfort and price. The polar charts actually show that the yacht is quicker than the Jeanneau 36iP! With a LOA at 11.48, beam at 3.92 and weight at approx 6350 kg, there will be more tankage and load bearing capability than the Jeanneau and the Dufour 34e. Loads of comments in the forums about poor quality finishes and most worrying that the hull is not as good as it should be though.Anyone know the STIX rating?

Bavaria Cruiser 36 - seems to have a hull that is really well built and with the right options could be a quick boat BUT I personally don't like the look that much - yachting monthly have just described it as a bloated whale and scored it 77/100 pts. Also the interior doesn't do it for me. I like contemporary but the Ikea look could get to you eventually. At 7,000 kg's the yacht is the heaviest by far which can't help in light winds. Really good value though. Anyone have the polar chart for this yacht?

Dufour 375 - great looker IMO, seems to be very beamy though and the SA/D at 18.5, although not bad, is quite a bit lower than the others. I have really struggled to find the polar charts for this yacht as well as the STIX and AVS ratings but to no avail, so I don't have the full picture yet. Also it is the most expensive - about 7% more than the Beneteau and the Jeanneau. Polar chart, STiX and AVS would be most welcome

Dufour 34e - Again a great looker (IMO), has a racing pedigree with great comfort thrown in but it also the smallest and lightest and therefore not sure about its cruising capability. With a mast height of 15.1m, it is also possibly a little under sheeted - seems to be confirmed by comments in the forums - unless you opt for a taller rig but this requires a visit to your sailmaker which is not going to work in a yacht management program. I am thinking of chartering this boat for a week in October in Croatia for a first hand experience. Again polar chart, STIX and AVS would be most welcome.

You folks out there are way more experienced than I am and I am always keen to hear the views of the experts so any help and comments would be useful.

All the best

David
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  #912  
Old 04-28-2011
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Well, I consider it as finished. But the Voiles et Voiliers guy did not try to lift the keel, so he has not seen the whole system mounted. That is maybe why.
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Hi Capado!
The FoX boats make a real good impression. I am seeing the 11.60 as a nice, more comfortable alternative to the Pogo 12.50. Very interesting!
Can you let us know how much payload you actually have including crew and what speeds you achieve with that?
Ulf
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  #914  
Old 04-29-2011
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New boat:

Let's look at another interesting 38ft, an Italian one. It is not really new (2008), but I like it a lot. I love the looks

The Comet 38s it is fast it's very well made, has a quality interior even if not for all tastes. It has a small defect (not any port hull) and a big one : It is expensive.

The boat has an unusually high ballast/displacement ratio (36%) probably because on its standard version does not have a bulb (can have one as an option).

The boat is really fast and the speed with light wind is great. On the Yacht magazine test they measured with 10k wind:

42ºTW - 6.3K ---- 60ºTW - 7.2K ---- 90ºTW - 7.8K ---- 130º - 6.9k ---- 180º - 5.4K

on the Solovela test they measured with with between 10 and 16K (without geenaker) :

30ºAW - 7.5K ---- 60ºAW - 8.4K ---- 90ºAW - 8.1K ---- 120ºAW - 6.8K ---- 150AW - 6.5K ----- 180AW - 6.1K

This is boat really excels in upwind performance it is a relatively narrow boat with only 3.73m of beam, light (6400kg) and with a lot of sail (80.6m2).

On Solovela they say about it:

"Fast on the water: Very good response at the wheel, soft and comfortable on the wave passage and very good effectiveness of all sail regulations....it is on the sea that the Comet 38s show its essence: the capacity of transmitting to the wheel man information and emotion...a true thoroughbred"







[IMG]Photobucket[/IMG]




















Last edited by PCP; 04-29-2011 at 04:57 PM.
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  #915  
Old 04-30-2011
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New boat, the Elan 394:

The Ean 394 is going to replace the Elan 384 on the series of more "fat" and more comfortable interior boats from Elan, the ones that are equivalent to the Oceanis Beneteau series or Jeanneau DS series.

The 384 and 434 are around for more than half a dozen years, are designed, as all Elans, by Rob Humphreys and were locked as a slightly more seaworthy alternative to the Oceanis (Beneteau) and Jeanneau Ds line even if in my opinion the overall design of Jeanneau and Benetau is better.

They have changed last year the 434 fot the 444. I saw the boat in Eslovenia and it has so ugly that I don't even posted here the photos I have taken

ELAN Marine - Sail - Sail Yachts

The boat looked puffed and a lot more "fat" than the previous model and I really did not understood their intention. 9 months later they still have the 434 in their catalog side by side with the 444 and that means something regarding public acceptance of the new model.

They are now presenting the 394, the one that is going to replace the 384 and by the first images, it looks a lot better than the 444 in what regards design. After the 444 I will reserve my opinion till I see more of the boat

Here are the first images:





Regards

Paulo

Last edited by PCP; 04-30-2011 at 07:42 AM.
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  #916  
Old 05-01-2011
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Hi Paulo, Azuree 40 Fast Cruiser is on my short list. I would be thankful you could give your opinion about this boat. Thanks!
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  #917  
Old 05-01-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G1000 View Post
Hi Paulo, Azuree 40 Fast Cruiser is on my short list. I would be thankful you could give your opinion about this boat. Thanks!
Hello, welcome to Sailnet and particularly to this thread.

I have mixed fillings about the Azuree 40. Roxbot has made the same question as you and we have already discussed the boat. Look at pag. 84, post 837 and subsequent posts till 847.

Regarding what was said two new things, the Wauquiez Opium 39 is back in good health and with a new integrated carbon pole and there are another contender coming in, the RM 1260 and I suspect we will have for next summer an Elan 400 on the same lines.

Read what was said and just say what you think about it, but basically, for most the biggest objection to the Azuree was looks. If you find it attractive (I like the interiors), try the boat and if you like it, go for it. After all what one sailor finds attractive others will find ugly and that's a subjective matter anyway.

Regards

Paulo
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  #918  
Old 05-01-2011
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New boat and one that looks nice even if not very innovative. The new 39 from Cantieri del Prado, the Grand Soleil 39.

This boat is the first one from the Shipyard since Bavaria had taken control. I would expect a cut in price regarding previous Grand Soleil and that would be nice news, specially because this seems to be an interesting boat.

The boat is from the same "classical" family of Salona, Comet or Dehler, with a relatively small beam (3.7m) and a relatively high ballast/displacement ratio (36%). I say relatively high because this is probably a bulbed boat and that bulb in the standard version (with that ballast ratio) with be low on the water, cause the boat has a 2.4m draft. I am sure the boat will come with a smaller draft for cruising, but then will have even more ballast and a bigger ballast ratio.

Another boat that will excel in upwind performance and will have a very good overall performance. The transom seems also to be maximized for a good downwind performance

The previous 40 was already an interesting and fast boat. I am sure this will be faster but in my opinion the bigger progress is on the interior. While the previous model had a dark mahogany interior with a very small port hull, this one will have TWO BIG port hulls and a light modern interior. I like it

The old 40 had what Europeans call modern galley and that is one all along the saloon. I never liked that disposition and this one returns to the classic layout, and it seems a lot better to me.

Lets see what they will manage with the price. The new Dehler 41 (Hanse) is coming with a lower price than usual, so I really hope this one will cost also less than the previous 40. Let's see
















Last edited by PCP; 05-01-2011 at 07:28 PM.
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  #919  
Old 05-01-2011
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Hey Paulo,
Must say I quite like the Elan though to be honest probably prefer the old 384. I'm not convinced by that teardrop window shape. Twin wheels are nice, shame about the resultant short cockpit seats.
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  #920  
Old 05-02-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
I have mixed fillings about the Azuree 40. Roxbot has made the same question as you and we have already discussed the boat. Look at pag. 84, post 837 and subsequent posts till 847.
Thanks. I have already read discussion twice. Just some time passed and wanted to double ask considering today's perspective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
Regarding what was said two new things, the Wauquiez Opium 39 is back in good health and with a new integrated carbon pole and there are another contender coming in, the RM 1260 and I suspect we will have for next summer an Elan 400 on the same lines.
I wouldn't be so sure about Wauquiez good health, this just based on "Group Experton-Revollier acquires Wauquiez Shipyard", but do we real know anything else? Wauquiez range is so short, that Opium 39 sales should skyrocket to be afloat. But with current competition and upcoming Elan400 and Maxi11 this hardly possible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
Read what was said and just say what you think about it, but basically, for most the biggest objection to the Azuree was looks. If you find it attractive (I like the interiors), try the boat and if you like it, go for it. After all what one sailor finds attractive others will find ugly and that's a subjective matter anyway.
The more I look at Azuree 40, the more I like it. Specially a black one then double windows "merge" with the hull. Plus bowsprit becomes part of the boat. On the over hand I do not like nor Opium 39, nor RM 1260, so "look" factor is really very personal. Azuree interior is really nice and should be perfect for a couple to liveaboard full time.
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