First Time Buyer Frustration.... - Page 2 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Boat Review and Purchase Forum
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #11  
Old 07-08-2010
sailingdog's Avatar
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 43,291
Thanks: 0
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Rep Power: 13
sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice sailingdog is just really nice
Oh, if you're going to take KD3PC's advice and go see the boat, do take a look at the Boat Inspection Trip Tips thread I started...so as to learn whether the boat is a turkey or a diamond in the rough...
__________________
Sailingdog

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.

Still—DON'T READ THAT POST AGAIN.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #12  
Old 07-08-2010
bljones's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Coast Ontario
Posts: 8,165
Thanks: 32
Thanked 72 Times in 65 Posts
Rep Power: 7
bljones has a spectacular aura about bljones has a spectacular aura about
Look, not to defend lazy brokers, but sometimes the requests for info can be a little vague, like this:
"Hi, I saw your listing on yachtworld, can you tell me any more about this boat?"
Come on, we have ALL sent an email like this to a broker about a boat we saw on Yachtworld that is half the world and half our annuual take home pay away from us that we just like or dislike but have no intention of buying...

in other words, cybertirekicking. Get 10-15 of these emails a day or week, plus dozens more from scammers ("Hello I am seeing your add for sailboat for sail and I wish to buy boat today proposing to send you a cheque for $145,000 and you please be sending the difference to my business partner in Baltimore who will shipping the sailboat to me in Nigeria...") and your response tends to get pretty perfunctory.


Real buyers are asking WHEN and WHERE they can see the boat, and who cares if it has a recent survey? If you're spending more than $2-3K you should get a new survey anyway. If it doesn't have a recent survey, are you NOT going to take a look at the boat? you're gonna miss out on an awful lot of great deals that way.

You want a broker to respond to you and be eager to help? Let them know you are ACTIVELY BUYING, not just looking. Something like this:

"Hi, I saw your listing on Yachtworld, and the ________ 32 you have listed may be the right boat for us. Here's the deal: we are a family of four looking for our first sailboat after years of sailing with friends. We are looking for a boat in the 30-35 ft range suitable for weekending and week long cruises on Lake Erie/Lake Huron. We want something with full standing headroom, inboard diesel, fin keel, wheel steering furling jib dodger, bimini and a private head. We have an ALL CASH budget of up to $20 K for the right boat, and we want to be on the water by Aug 1. Are you the right broker, with the right boat for us?"

Now canadaler, if this IS the type of email you have been sending, and you have been get a lacklustre response, let me know, and I will set you up with a great Canadian broker who will happily find the boat of your dreams.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #13  
Old 07-08-2010
Dreamer
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 62
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
jordanship is on a distinguished road
In an ongoing search for understanding...

The story below is an anedote I heard one day in a gam with an old sailor off Tonga. He had an old Holga Dank design with patched sails. He laid down a passarelle and boarded my ship. He grabbed my arm with a steely grip and said, "Arggh, I have got a story for ye. It be called 'The Broker's Fable.'"

Once upon a time, a broker was sitting in his office when two clients walked in. They said, "we would like to see the Trintella and the Hallberg Rassy you are advertising." This was inconvenient because the broker had made plans to meet with another client. He asked if they could re-schedule. "No, we are from New Zealand and leave tomorrow." He called and delayed his meeting. He wished they would have emailed or called and made an appointment. He felt like not showing them the yachts. He could tell they were not ready to purchase, but in the interest of long-term goodwill, good karma, and just inherent optimism, he gave them directions and promised to meet them at the first boat in an hour. He also mentioned some other local yachts they might be interested in. They replied, "Oh yes, we saw those on Yacht World and are planning to go to that broker later and see those." He suggested he could show them those as well. "No, we want to see the boats with the other broker." That was the last straw for him. He told them, "Then, as this is inconvient for me, please go to the other broker and have him show all the yachts. I think that will work best for all parties."

"What is the lesson of the fable?" I asked the old sailor. His face was knarly and weathered from years before the mast. He chewed on his gums a bit, spat, and looked in deep thought. Then he release his grip on my arm, turned around, reboarded his ship, and went out of sight below. I followed him, but when I went below, no one was there!
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #14  
Old 07-08-2010
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 199
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
LauderBoy is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canadaler View Post
"Inexpensive" for me is <$20K. I've been looking in the Great Lakes and Northeast regions. The "plan" I had was to gather as much information as I can, if that looks good, take a trip to see it, then survey/offer.
Don't just use yachtworld.com/brokers for this. Go to sailboatlistings.com and craigslist(yes, craigslist) for a boat in that price range. Camp both of those sites and check them daily.

You'll see a lot of okay/decent value old listings with prices that come down every X months or so as the sellers get motivated to sell them. Then you'll also see some real gems that get listed and get snapped up pretty quick.

Also, do yourself a favor and look at a lot of boats in person. Every boat I looked at I learned more about what I wanted and didn't want. I ended up making an offer(and buying) a boat I had looked at a month prior.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #15  
Old 07-08-2010
BarryL's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 1,618
Thanks: 3
Thanked 28 Times in 27 Posts
Rep Power: 12
BarryL is on a distinguished road
Hey

What you have found is typical. IMO most brokers are not good. But - a few are. My suggestion is to find a good broker and just work with them for any boats near them - even if they don't have the listing.

Lastly, planning a vacation around an older, unknown, cheap boat doesn't sound like a vacation to me.

Good luck
Barry
__________________
Barry Lenoble
Deep Blue C, 2002 C&C 110
Mt. Sinai, NY

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #16  
Old 07-08-2010
F4d3d's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Banff, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 103
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
F4d3d is on a distinguished road
In the age of the internet, I don't think that boat brokers (or real estate agents) are worth their fees. Anyone can post an ad on Craigslist or another classified ads site, and it will be seen as readily as it would on YachtWorld. With the thousands saved on listing with an agent, I think a seller is more likely to strike a deal with a buyer which keeps some extra cash in the pockets of both parties.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #17  
Old 07-08-2010
EJO's Avatar
EJO EJO is offline
Dutchman
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: SW Michigan
Posts: 253
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 5
EJO is on a distinguished road
Lake MI brokers

I was in a similar position as you are. A buddy of mine wanted a sailboat and asked if I wanted to partner up. He had zero zilch boating experience but liked it when he saw these sailors in the cockpit leaving the channel to go sailing on Lake Michigan. He knew I had the experience and could teach him. He was looking at yachtworld every day and sent me links. Boats of $50K and less.
As he didn't know if he would like sailing I told him why don't we try for an older solid 28' to 34' boat in the $15K range, keeping investment at a minimum if he didn't like it and wanted to sell after one season.
We found many on the East and West coasts of Lake Michigan and finally contacted a broker via e-mail for a boat listed in West Michigan. Found out that sometimes the contact shown is not really the listing broker (think real estate) the broker was in FL for a listing in MI???.
We found out who the "real" broker was by looking at the boat in person in the middle of winter. Doing this we saw many more boats for sale (as all are on the hard) in various marinas in the towns we drove through.
Finally narrowed it down and called the listing brokers and/or owners and made appointments for preliminary viewing and more specific detailed background info. This broker was very professional helped us with many details, did a sea trial with us, filed registration, did the deed, etc. and all for $800 . He went by 'if he services us now we will come back later' because we all know that the happiest days of our lives are the days when we buy a boat and when we sell a boat. My partner is hooked so he/we will buy a more expensive boat in the near future, listing our current boat with this broker and using him to buy another one.
Send me a PM and I let you know who it is.

ps. Our first sail was 81 miles on the big Lake Michigan starting with frost on the deck and sun in the back 12:30 hrs later at our home-port and a novice hooked. Preparation, preparation, preparation is all it takes for a longer trip.

E-J
s/v SAILMATES, 1973 IRWIN 32 Classic

Last edited by EJO; 07-08-2010 at 02:11 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #18  
Old 07-08-2010
primerate84's Avatar
Just a Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 272
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
primerate84 is on a distinguished road
I had a good and bad experience with brokers. The first time I called a broker about a boat that was listed at his marina, he basically blew me off, even when I was trying to set up a time to look at the boat (a three hour drive for me). After numerous calls and e-mails, I quit making any further attempts.

When I was at a marina with my friend, he mentioned that his broker (different guy) was very helpful when he was buying his Beneteau 28. I met up with him at a boat show and casually mentioned what I was looking for, 28 to 30 feet, around $20 to 22 thousand. Within two weeks, he found me a boat that I ended up buying. The guy went out of his way to make the deal work. So the moral of the story is, there are good and bad brokers. Find the good one.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #19  
Old 07-08-2010
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Central Arkansas
Posts: 209
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 5
tomwatt is on a distinguished road
Another good site I could recommend is at Sailing Texas.
Sailing Texas, sailing lessons, sailboats for sale, yacht sales, sailboat rentals, charters, sailing videos
It's not just about Texas. Boats advertised there from all over the place.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #20  
Old 07-11-2010
bljones's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Coast Ontario
Posts: 8,165
Thanks: 32
Thanked 72 Times in 65 Posts
Rep Power: 7
bljones has a spectacular aura about bljones has a spectacular aura about
Notice that the OP has not been back to this thread to either acknowledge the advice he has received or to provide new info. If this is the approach he has taken to communicating with brokers as well, I am unsure what right has to bitch about the responses he has received.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
First time sail boat buyer martinojon Boat Review and Purchase Forum 20 05-26-2014 09:16 PM
Double Breasted, Maycock and Loggerhead Cays, Jumentos Bahamas 4-6&7-10 skipgundlach Cruising & Liveaboard Forum 0 04-28-2010 05:50 PM
First time boat buyer - I want a live-aboard Toyboat Boat Review and Purchase Forum 14 07-19-2006 12:17 PM
How Other Sailors Learned Mark Matthews Learning to Sail Articles 0 08-31-2001 08:00 PM
What Time Is It? Jim Sexton Her Sailnet Articles 0 03-24-2001 07:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:02 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.