Flaking a Mizzen - SailNet Community
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 10 Old 08-11-2010 Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Vienna, Virginia
Posts: 82
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Flaking a Mizzen

Hello,

I am currently shopping around for a boat - I am quite a ways off from an actual purchase - and I have been looking at ketch boats because of the advantages a ketch plan affords.

However, I have never sailed a ketch before. I am curious - how do you properly flake and tie a mizzen with half the sail sticking off the stern? I imagine that doing so at sea could be fairly hazardous and present issues with MOB.

Thanks!

zboss
zboss is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 10 Old 08-11-2010
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 116
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Having never sailed, owned, or been within 2,000 feet of a ketch, I'll go ahead and proffer my dangerously unqualified and amateur opinion ...

Lazy jacks would probably help in this area. In-mast or on-mast roller furling would also make it easier, but that's a whole other can of worms.

But I'll be anxious to hear what others have to say on the matter.
jcalvinmarks is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #3 of 10 Old 08-11-2010
Senior Member
 
remetau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Bradenton, FL
Posts: 780
Thanks: 0
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
I think you mean a yawl with the mast aft of the rudder post. Most of the ketch that I have seen, do not have their masts hanging over the transom.

Don & Diana
sv Re Metau an HC33t

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
remetau is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #4 of 10 Old 08-11-2010
Moderator
 
Jeff_H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Annapolis, Md
Posts: 6,961
Thanks: 5
Thanked 164 Times in 133 Posts
Rep Power: 10
     
Having sailed on quite a few ketches, the mizzen boom generally does overhand the transom but there is often a boomkin (aft facing bowsprit) to balance on while reefing or flaking the sail.

The fact that it is hard to properly stay a mizzen mast, and it is hard to flake or handle or get a proper sheet lead angles on a mizzen sail, is one of the reasons that the Ketch rig is largely a anachronistic sail plan, which retains almost no real advantages in a world where better hardware, materials and methods allow more efficient and easily handled rigs.

Jeff


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Curmudgeon at Large- and rhinestone in the rough, sailing my Farr 11.6 on the Chesapeake Bay
Jeff_H is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #5 of 10 Old 08-11-2010
Senior Member
 
CaptainForce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: living aboard since 1972
Posts: 1,715
Thanks: 0
Thanked 12 Times in 12 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
I do well with my ketch, but I concede that the former advantages of the split rig are no longer applicable with the sail tending opportunities of modern rigs. One advantage, howeverr, is retianed,- I frequently pass under 55' fixed bridges....Cape May, Marco Island, Fort Lauderdale and Miami.....that give me access unavailable for a sloop of my LOA. As for the ending of the mizzen, I have full access to all of my mizzen boom on deck. Take care and joy, Aythya crew
CaptainForce is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #6 of 10 Old 08-11-2010 Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Vienna, Virginia
Posts: 82
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
That's actually the reason...

I am looking at ketch rigs. I want the option of a larger over-all boat but want lots of room for a mast to under bridges.

I do understand that cutters and sloops have significant advantages as well.

I was looking at the following boat - which brought my question to light - it says it is a ketch.

37' Endeavour PLAN A KETCH Photo 1 photo
zboss is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #7 of 10 Old 08-11-2010
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 116
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 6
 
Looks like she has a stack-pack to flake the sail without you having to go any further aft than the stern rail.
jcalvinmarks is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #8 of 10 Old 08-11-2010
Moderator
 
Jeff_H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Annapolis, Md
Posts: 6,961
Thanks: 5
Thanked 164 Times in 133 Posts
Rep Power: 10
     
My Mom lived aboard and cruised an Endeavour 37 sloop which I thought had one of the worst motions that I ever experienced in my life. Build quality was not too great either. They sold that boat pretty quickly and moved onto a brand new Endeavour 40, which was a nice boat in most ways but which also had whole range of build-quality issues, some minor some not so. The Endeavour 37 was a good case of a boat which never should have been built as a ketch as the Ketch rig exacerbated almost every issue that we had with the sailing ability and motion comfort of the sloop.

Jeff


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Curmudgeon at Large- and rhinestone in the rough, sailing my Farr 11.6 on the Chesapeake Bay
Jeff_H is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #9 of 10 Old 08-11-2010 Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Vienna, Virginia
Posts: 82
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Good to know Jeff! Thanks.

I did see that the particular boat had a stack-pack but I have seen quite a few that don't. So, I still have to wonder how safe would it be under adverse conditions. Worrying about TWO sails, one of which is further aft than I would feel comfortable flaking while preparing for a gale.

I guess the trick is to assume you would have a stack-pack, so that would be an item to add to the 'purchase' or built list. I just picked up the latest copy of "this old boat" and they have some instructional material for building your own.
zboss is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
post #10 of 10 Old 08-11-2010
TQA
Bombay Explorer 44
 
TQA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,937
Thanks: 0
Thanked 79 Times in 75 Posts
Rep Power: 7
 
I cruised for 7 years on a 38 foot ketch on the transatlantic circuit. I can not ever remember having to drop the mizzen at sea. It was always the first up and the last down at anchor. it was never a worry to flake I think maybe a foot of boom sticking out the back.

Although it is clearly a less efficient rig esp to windward, reaching between the Windwards and Leewards was a joy. If it got snotty the option to drop the main and continue under headsail and mizzzen gave me a balanced boat.
TQA is offline  
Quote Quick Reply Share with Facebook
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome