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  #461  
Old 04-15-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
...even giving really irritating people a voice...and enough rope to hang themselves!
Some are given much more more 'rope' than others... It's unfortunate and sad; because so many people with experience and good knowledge have ditched this forum because they are so sick of arguing with people like you and PCP. To see you use these words here is pretty much the biggest oxyMORON of this entire thread.
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  #462  
Old 04-15-2011
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Originally Posted by KeelHaulin View Post
Some are given much more more 'rope' than others... It's unfortunate and sad; because so many people with experience and good knowledge have ditched this forum because they are so sick of arguing with people like you and PCP. To see you use these words here is pretty much the biggest oxyMORON of this entire thread.
Ahhh - so that's what it is. Okay.
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  #463  
Old 04-16-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeelHaulin View Post
Some are given much more more 'rope' than others... It's unfortunate and sad; because so many people with experience and good knowledge have ditched this forum because they are so sick of arguing with people like you and PCP. To see you use these words here is pretty much the biggest oxyMORON of this entire thread.
Last post... actually Keel, it's you and your name calling (oxyMORON? yeah, ok ). We're out. Marty, see you out there!
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  #464  
Old 04-16-2011
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Enjoy the weekend on VC.

I may have to bop over to CA, usually look in SA when I do!
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  #465  
Old 04-16-2011
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Last post... actually Keel, it's you and your name calling (oxyMORON? yeah, ok ). We're out. Marty, see you out there!
I was not the guy doing nothing but interjecting snide remarks and innuendo THIS ENTIRE THREAD. I did it ONCE here at the end of it given the INNUENDO in his post; which I quoted; and I get slammed by you, yet another guy who has been circling this thread putting in meaningless inflammatory posts. Please, don't let the door hit you in the @ss.
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  #466  
Old 04-16-2011
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keel

if you come to the east coast , you can catch a ride with me , and yes, you
are right , these people are not worth the effort
if you are interested, i will message you with my contact info
otherwise keep sailing and don't share your info with jerks
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  #467  
Old 04-16-2011
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And they all lived happily ever after.

So, williamkiester, OP of this fine thread...after all the shouting and running mascara, the moral of this story seems to be...buy a Bene First series. It's hard to go wrong.

(PS - I'm joking of course. Personally I'm all over the Bene - but you need to be all over the boat that fits your needs. You've gotten A LOT of great info out of this thread. So find the boat that works for you and, most importantly, go sailing! Even if it's a pig in light wind, upwind, downwind...it's still sailing!)
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  #468  
Old 04-16-2011
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It also shows, some are willing to look at ALL options, others will only go with one, that is what they will stick with come hell or high water. When reality is, there is almost always more than one way to skin a cat, or differences in boat design that will allow better results or some such thing. Its tough to debate with the single mind set person, even if you agree to a point with there claim, but show a different approach that "MAY OR MIGHT" work better, you get slammed. Happens in politics and other ways and means of life too.

Reality is, there is more than one type and style of sailboat that one can cruise in, go well in light winds, handles heavy, points and goes down wind. We all can not have a Santa Maria, or Pinta, or newport 41, or a Bene first 45 or 50, when a 30 or 35 would do well in my world of sailing.......


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  #469  
Old 04-16-2011
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I totally agree. Without open mind and interest for development no evolution takes place. I agree with all of you that have tried to debate bringing forward facts and an open mind, not over reacting. For me personally the 99/1% rule discussed earlier dictates the boat I will buy next. A thrilling sail more important than the perhaps never occuring difficult storm (that I might outrun anyway).
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Anders
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  #470  
Old 04-17-2011
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It's not that gang. Never said that I oppose racers going out and crossing oceans in the 'open' class hulls. But I heard something said by a guy who knows one hell of a lot more than I do about boats; Brion Toss this afternoon at a Strictly Sail seminar. He said: "racing sailing is incompatible with good seamanship practices". This is the point I am trying to get across to those who think a racing boat can have an interior dropped in it and become an ocean crossing cruiser. The boats that race cross ocean were built in a 'to the limit of strength' and do not have much (if any) safety factor designed into their construction. When you put a cruising interior and a cruising equipment load in one of these boats you drastically reduce the performance of the boat; while you increase the working loads on it. You -could- end up with a boat that neither can out-run a storm or squall (which are regular occurrences) as the hull was designed to do; and a boat that with the cruising load may not survive a storm because it was not designed heavily enough to ride one out either.

I'm not saying these boats have no place in the 'market' for sailboats. I am saying that a potential buyer should do their homework and make sure that they are buying a boat that can live up to the task that it may be asked to do. We get inquiries about blue water cruising a Newport 30 on our yahoo forum all the time. While there are known N-30's that have gone coastal cruising and a few who have crossed to Hawaii or further; generally we tell people considering it that the boat was not originally designed to do it. You -could- take one offshore but it would be ill advised. I consider a Newport-30 more heavily built than many of the current racer/cruiser designs BTW.

If your Jenneau is the one that base rates 156, blt2ski; I hardly think you should be throwing stones at a boat that rates ~50 sec/mi faster than yours (and was constructed at a similar time).
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