Catalina 375 vs 400

rayjanine · #1 (**permalink**) 10-25-2010

Hi Brian:

Any opinion on the 375 vs 400? The 375 has a 4'8" published draft which would be great where I sail but the SA/D is alot lower than the 400 (16 vs 17.26) and also the comfort ratio (23.32 vs 25.84) is not as good. I am concerned about you stating the draft of the 400 is more like 5'10" vs 5"4" which Catalina publishes. Are you still living on your boat? Any issues with the 400 you can share being so knowledgeable about it (electrical system, generator, air conditioner, etc.)? What year is your boat? What year did the 400 draft change from 5'4" to 5' as published in the Catalina web site?

Thanks,

Ray

Cruisingdad · #2 (**permalink**) 10-26-2010

Boy, this could be a long discussion.

You cannot compare the 400 to the 375. Two completely different birds. THe 400 is more of a performance cruiser where the 375 is well, the 375. The only boat, ONLY BOAT, I would consider outside of the 400 (for 2 staterooms) is the new 445 which is a awesome boat and more modern.

I have owned a Catalina 25, 320, 380, and 400. I have sailed and or crewed on most of the others. The 42 is a nice performing boat too, but I still take the 400 over her. The 400 is more of a 'flat' bottom boat which gives her great stability (sure footed) and fast. I have exceeded hull speed many times on my boat. There are no major problems with any of the MKII's. There are a few irritants, like the rediculous shower pump setup (centrifugal vs diaphram), but all those things have a work around and if you want more details on the little irritants just let me know. But remember this - ALL BOATS HAVE THEIR OWN LITTLE IRRITANTS. Gawd knows I have seen enough to know.

Lets see, to answer your other questions: Yes, we still live aboard and love it. She's a great boat and no regrets. As far as the draft, the new 400's (after HN circa 307) are much closer to the published 5'4, if not right at 5'4. Before that will be a 5'10 boat, including all the MKI's. Be aware that there is a tradeoff on the shallower boats in that they will not point as well and subsequently perform as well. But I have not heard complaints.

The secondary systems on the boat will likely be dealer added items (generator, a/c). Some opted for the factory to do it, which does a good job, but many do not. I have a 16k btu and 12kbtu a/c/heater which works well and without incident, but if I could go back, I would not have put in a 12kbtu in the aft becuse it is too much. I would have gone with an 8. I have a mastervolt 3.5 whisper which is fine, but I would have opted for a larger generator (5kw) if I could go back. Electrical system is super and without incident. I did add an extra 110v panel to accomodate water maker and other ac loads.

I think the 400 is the best boat Catalina makes and is actually one of the best boats from the prodcution builders. I think I like the ndew 445 better... but get ready with teh checkbook - though the new 400's are not cheap either. Feel free to let me know if you have any other questions. I will answer them. You are also freee to call if you want.

Take care,

Brian

rayjanine · #3 (**permalink**) 10-26-2010

Hi Brian:

Thanks for info. I could use a little more of why you think the 375 is not a great boat or even close to a 400. You also mentione that the 400 has a flat bottom. I had a 2007 Hunter 41DS that also had a flat bottom and in 5ft waves under motoring into the waves the boat would pound. Not a little but alot which I have to wonder how it would handle in 10ft seas or greater. How does your 400 handle in rough weather? I would like to buy a boat that is coastal cruising with a descent cockpit to entertain at anchor and also a boat that can go off shore (Newport to Bermuda) without any serious worries. My selection is getting between the following boats from best to least desireable for what I want to use it for: Catalina 400, Beneteau 40, Jeanneau 409, Tartan 4100, and Sabre 402.

Regards,

Ray

blt2ski · #4 (**permalink**) 10-26-2010

Ray,

If you want the honest truth, ALL 5 of those boats will do and go where you want to go, and probably beyond!

Granted there are some differences in the different boats, but reality is, ALL are decent boats! Now it is a matter of deciding the ambiance of the boat, storage, sailing ability, etc. I know of a person with a Jeanneau SO39iP that went from the great lakes in Canada, IIRC lk Ontario down to the Bermuda area with spouse and 2 kids. The 409 is a bit bigger, should do well. An SO42i would be a skoosh bigger. There is also a 439 that Jeanneau just announced a week or so ago that could also fit your bill too.

Reality is, find something you can handle, including the minor issues as Brian stated, then you will enjoy the trip. I would not go with a catalina, probably a Jeanneau or a first series Bene over the boats you listed. I would also get the deepest draft I could too. Then again, where I sail, draft is not an issue!

marty

Cruisingdad · #5 (**permalink**) 10-28-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by rayjanine

Hi Brian:

Thanks for info. I could use a little more of why you think the 375 is not a great boat or even close to a 400. You also mentione that the 400 has a flat bottom. I had a 2007 Hunter 41DS that also had a flat bottom and in 5ft waves under motoring into the waves the boat would pound. Not a little but alot which I have to wonder how it would handle in 10ft seas or greater. How does your 400 handle in rough weather? I would like to buy a boat that is coastal cruising with a descent cockpit to entertain at anchor and also a boat that can go off shore (Newport to Bermuda) without any serious worries. My selection is getting between the following boats from best to least desireable for what I want to use it for: Catalina 400, Beneteau 40, Jeanneau 409, Tartan 4100, and Sabre 402.

Regards,

Ray

Just got back in town. You want to discuss over phone?

Brian

rayjanine · #6 (**permalink**) 10-28-2010

Hi Brian:

Just a few thoughts if you would concerning the handling of your boat thru waves (5ft or greater) under power and then also under sail. As I mentioned to you my Hunter 41DS pounded in approx. 5ft seas under power. The wave period was short (going out Shinnecock Inlet with depth around 15ft and also the surrounding area near the inlet where the depth was about 30ft or less). I think the hull shape of the Catalina 400 is more rounded in the bow than the hunter and the displacement/ballast is 20,500lb/8000lb vs 19,400lb/6616lb which should help to take the waves better.

I want a boat that can handle fairly large seas (15ft or less) since I am planning on taking the boat from Newport to Bermuda in a few years.

Thanks,

Ray

Cruisingdad · #7 (**permalink**) 10-29-2010

You mean like this:

We wre caught in a gale coming across the gulf. Still did over 9 knots. She does pound some, but it is not bad. Honestly. I am not sure how other boats would do. I owned a C380 and sailed it in similar conditions and she did not pound. However, she was slower than hell. A round bottomed boat like that will all be slower. I would rather have some pounding than bobbing around out there like a cork.

You can reduce the pounding by slowing the boat down. We were jumping off the waves into the crest of 10+ foot seas, but if we slowed the boat down it reduced the poiunding considerably. But the reality is that in 10 footers you are going to be uncomfortable any way it goes.

I saw the B40 out right besude a 400. THey have almost EXACTLY the same hull shape. Scary, actually, how close they looked to a naked eye.

The Catalina is NOT 20,500. It might be designed that way, but it is not going to weigh in that way. I would be shocked if it does. I think 22-24k new is more realistic. Mine weighed in at just a tad under 28,000 - but remember that I have my boat loaded out for cruising. But I don't have 8000 lbs of crap on there, even with Kris' pots and pans. I honestly think that (20500) is designed weight, not actually weight.

We have had many C400's go to Bermuda. Here's proof:

I think he goes every year... but cannot remember now. I know this was not his first trip.

You would be very happy with the 400. Best boat Catalina makes, with maybe the new 445 as an exception. Only the 445, 470, and 400 have an internal flange Hull-deck joint. Very robust and expensive to manufacture. It is all solid glass in the hull. No coring or epoxies. MKII's have dual independent steering.

I would give you a list of projects you may want to consider doing on your 400 if you want (if you buy it) that we did to prep it for cruising. A lot of these have been detailed in Mainsheet, but I'm not sure you get Mainsheet.

Anyways, let me know how else I can help. Of all the boats you listed, I would choose between teh Sabre and the 400.

Brian

rayjanine · #8 (**permalink**) 10-29-2010

Hi Brian:

Thanks alot for the info. Will keep you posted on what we decide to buy.

Kind Regards,

Ray

vmerlot · #9 (**permalink**) 10-30-2010

You would be very happy with the 400 for sure!

nemier · #10 (**permalink**) 10-31-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cruisingdad

I think 22-24k new is more realistic. Mine weighed in at just a tad under 28,000 - but remember that I have my boat loaded out for cruising. But I don't have 8000 lbs of crap on there,

Brian

Hi Brian,
I have been patiently waiting months for an appropriate moment to ask you this question.

Do you still have the breadmaker onboard, and if you do - is it used?