C&C 29 Mk II Vs. Beneteau First 28.5/29

[MichaelZZ]

Hello,

Recently I have seen a few ads locally for Beneteau First popping up alongside C&C 29s.

C&C 29 Mk II asking prices range from about $30-35k Canadian. Models from 1983-84.

Beneteau First 28.5/29 - $42-45k Models range 1984-88

What is it about the Beneteau that motivates a relatively higher price here? Is it a "much" better boat and if so in what sense?

(In terms of equipment/age of sails etc there's some variance but it's not like all Beneteaus consistently have 6 new sails or the C&Cs 2 old sails. It varies across the makes.)

[hangupndrive]

Hi Michael-

I do not have direct experience sailing either of these boats. I have, however inspected (for possible purchase) the C&C 29 and I have read quite a bit about the Beneteau as well as talked with one owner. I like both boats and would have considered owning either of them.

I own a '88 C&C 30 MkII just so you know my bias.

I think the constructions and materials of the C&C are superior to the beneteau. I prefer the keel stepped mast of the C&C to the deck stepped of the beneteau. The C&C is going to have an end-grain balsa cored deck vs. plywood for the Beneteau. C&C will have a lead keel. Not sure about the Beneteau but they are more of a production-line boat so Iron would not surprise me. The C&C is a few years older (early 80's vs. late 80's) but assuming similar condition, I'd take the C&C. One possibibility that exists with the benneteau and not the C&C is trailerability. If you get the shoal draft with the wing-keel, it is entirely doable assuming an appropriate tow-vehicle. I had a nice chat with a fellow from California who towed his Beneteay 28 to the Gulf Islands for the Summer.

Also look around for a Cal 28 or a Tartan T 2800. Or, more expensive $35-$40k US, A J28.

The prices you are seeing seem way high. I know things cost more in Canada. Why, I have no idea. If you extend your search to the US, you should see both boats, depending on condition, well under $30,000 US. I hope this helps. If you're from Great-Lakes Canada, there seems to be a lot in Michigan, Chicago, Ohio for sale.

Good Luck

Doug Powers
Totoro
C&C 30 MkII
Seattle, WA

[MichaelZZ]

Originally Posted by hangupndrive

Hi Michael-

I do not have direct experience sailing either of these boats. I have, however inspected (for possible purchase) the C&C 29 and I have read quite a bit about the Beneteau as well as talked with one owner. I like both boats and would have considered owning either of them.

I own a '88 C&C 30 MkII just so you know my bias.

I think the constructions and materials of the C&C are superior to the beneteau. I prefer the keel stepped mast of the C&C to the deck stepped of the beneteau. The C&C is going to have an end-grain balsa cored deck vs. plywood for the Beneteau. C&C will have a lead keel. Not sure about the Beneteau but they are more of a production-line boat so Iron would not surprise me. The C&C is a few years older (early 80's vs. late 80's) but assuming similar condition, I'd take the C&C. One possibibility that exists with the benneteau and not the C&C is trailerability. If you get the shoal draft with the wing-keel, it is entirely doable assuming an appropriate tow-vehicle. I had a nice chat with a fellow from California who towed his Beneteay 28 to the Gulf Islands for the Summer.

Also look around for a Cal 28 or a Tartan T 2800. Or, more expensive $35-$40k US, A J28.

The prices you are seeing seem way high. I know things cost more in Canada. Why, I have no idea. If you extend your search to the US, you should see both boats, depending on condition, well under $30,000 US. I hope this helps. If you're from Great-Lakes Canada, there seems to be a lot in Michigan, Chicago, Ohio for sale.

Good Luck

Doug Powers
Totoro
C&C 30 MkII
Seattle, WA

Thanks much for this information, I appreciate it!

I would also love to hear from sailors who have sailing experience with these boats...

[Sanduskysailor]

I have sailed on both boats and raced on my C&C 29-II against the Beneteau. Observations, B 28.5 has more room in interior. One is ailed on had a tiller with slatted seats in cockpit. Usable room in cockpit was lacking. The 29-II interior is more compact but more room in cockpit because of wheel. The 29-II has much better sailing capability with a slicker hull design, better foils and larger sail plan.

If encounter chop and lighter air, the masthead C&C goes to weather significantly faster than the 28.5.

You can find good condition 84-85 C&C 29-II in the States for around 17K -22K. With the Loon currently worth more than the dollar there are good deals to be had.

[jackdale]

Some mid 80 Beneteaus had blistering issues. Any surveyor would be able to identify if that was a problem.

[MichaelZZ]

Originally Posted by Sanduskysailor

I have sailed on both boats and raced on my C&C 29-II against the Beneteau. Observations, B 28.5 has more room in interior. One is ailed on had a tiller with slatted seats in cockpit. Usable room in cockpit was lacking. The 29-II interior is more compact but more room in cockpit because of wheel. The 29-II has much better sailing capability with a slicker hull design, better foils and larger sail plan.

If encounter chop and lighter air, the masthead C&C goes to weather significantly faster than the 28.5.

You can find good condition 84-85 C&C 29-II in the States for around 17K -22K. With the Loon currently worth more than the dollar there are good deals to be had.

Sorry for the delay... thanks much for the info.

The current boat I'm looking at is $30k. Owner says absolutely no way going below that.

No visible blisters. Owner has 6 recent sails and it is absolutely impeccably clean. Water pump and hot water, shower. No dark spots interior. Boat (supposedly) only sailed fresh water in Canada 5 months a year. Not done survey yet so not 100% confirmed but the price difference with US seems incredible!?

[Sanduskysailor]

30K is crazy. When I was looking for a 29-11 at the end of 2009 I found several in the 20K range in the Great Lakes. Hot water and shower are nice optional features but hardly worth 10K. Real value of boat might be closer to 24K. I bought my 1985 for $17,500 at the end of 2009. I knocked off $4,000 after the thorough survey for a net of $13,500. I spent all of the $4,000 to have the boat professionally fixed. BTW- Engine was in great shape with low hours, boat had 2 year old Awlgrip paint job and the cushions were in average shape with an average sail inventory and all spinnaker gear and self tailing winches.

Make sure you get a good survey. There are 2 significant design flaws that are not easily observable. The cockpit sole in both of the 29-IIs I've owned has been delaminated. C&C used plywood in the aft section under the pedestal. Water gets in around the penetrations for the rudder post and pedestal with no way of getting out. Plywood deteriorates although there were no stress cracks evident. About a $2500 fix. Quick and dirty way to check is to lean heavily on the pedestal, if the the sole flexes at all the core is delaminated. Fix entails recoring the center area of cockpit sole preferably with solid glass under pedestal and rudder penetrations. 2nd major area of concern is under the keel step. There is a small closed off bilge area that can trap water. A few Midwest winter freeze/thaw cycles and you can have a problem. Check for cracks in gelcoat on outside of keel under the mast. Also check stringers under port bulkhead and area where port bulkhead meets the cabin sole.

When looking at boats check the hull numbers. Boats in the 600s were made in Rhode Island. Other hull numbers made in Canada. Starting in 1985 C&C went to a new method of attaching stanchions. The 85 and after models have stanchions attached to the toe rail which means there is a no cracking in the deck around this area. The earlier models were prone to cracking. Also the cabin portlights are prone to leaking. Make sure that the portlights have been retrofitted with new plexiglass and that they are properly bedded or you will be chasing leaks forever.

[MichaelZZ]

Thanks for the feedback. Sorry for not being on here for months.

For 2011 I gave up on buying my own boat having realized that the season where I live is 5 months. All that maintenance, scrubbing, getting in and out of the water and the boat isn`t even in water for more than 40% of a calendar year.

I struggle a bit as without my own boat I can`t get the experience I need for more advanced certificates but where I live is not a good place to have a boat...

Thanks again, cheers,