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  #1  
Old 02-28-2011
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77 Catalina 30, Whats it worth?

I went to look at a 1977 Catalina 30 I found on craigslist in my area. I currently live on a Catalina 27 and I am looking to upgrade. I just was wondering if I were to make an offer, what would be a fair price.

Heres the ad:

1977 Catalina 30 sloop rig w/inflatable dingy $15,000.00 OBO
LOA-29’ 11”
Beam-10’ 10”
Draft-5’ 3”
Displacement-10,200 lbs
Coastal Cruiser

New bottom paint 11/07, new floor in cockpit 08/08

Engine:
Universal m18-14hsp diesel fresh water cooled
20 gal fuel tank-plastic
Gauges in cockpit-temp., oil, tack, amp
New Oberdorfer Sea water pump 4/01
New exhaust 2008
Rebuilt started 2008
12 volt system-3 batteries-1, Trojan SCS225909, 2 deep cycle marine batteries

Sails and rigging:
Full batten main with reef system and jiffy blocks
135% Genoa, rolling furler, extra main sail and 110% Genoa
New rigging 08/09, upper and lower shrouds and back stay
Garhaoer traveler mounted on top of cabin
2 primary barlough wenches #20
2 lewmar self tailing 2 speed mainsheet wenches

Electronics:
Raytheon ST4000 auto helm
Standard horizon eclipse VHF radio w/swing out speaker
Ritchie compass
Garmin GPS #2010 chart plotter
AMFM CD player w/2 speakers
Horizon, digital speed & dept gauges

Safety equipment:
4 PFD’s type 2
1 Life sling
2 fire extinguishers
Emergency tiller
1st aid kit
Stainless steel gunwale ladder
12v bilge pump
Rule manual bilge pump located in cockpit

Head:
New stainless steel sink and mirrors
Whale manual pump
new groco pump 6/08
30 gal holding tank

Galley:
Origo 2 burner stove, alcohol
Built in ice box
Double stainless steel sink
Manual gusher fresh water foot pump
15 gal fresh water tank
plenty of storage

Great boat for fun and comfort! If you know of Catalina 30, you know the room!
Head room below 6’3”
Lots of interior room

Located in Gulfport FL
Call for more info and leave message 727-733-1776
No reasonable offer refused.

I thought the asking price was a little much before I even saw the boat. I asked around some of my friends around the marina who are much more knowledgable than I, which confirmed my suspicians.

The boat was in overall decent shape. The interior had some nice custom work with plate glass doors separating the head area from the V-birth (Im assuming custom, because I never found another Catalina with the same).

The interior was very bear bones otherwise with no liveaboard accomidations, no AC power except something he rigged up to plug an extension cord into the cockpit to feed a couple outlets inside (no breaker panel, inverter or switches). He said he was an electrician after he showed me that.. lol

It did have a Univeral 14HP diesel which started up fine and ran well.

Bilges were clean and the keel bolts looked brand new, even though he swore they had never been replaced. (?)

The DC electrical system only consisted of 2 deep cycle group 27s with no charger, and one starting battery (little dissapointed there).

It will be due for a bottom job soon, last done 3 and a half years ago.

The decks were solid with the exception of one approx. 2 square foot area forward from the mast where there was some delamination. (Not too worried, shouldn't be too painful of a repair given the location.) And it didnt give the impression there was alot of rot below. The decks also need paint, but it looks fair. Standing rigging looked brand new, chainplates looked dry and the bulkheads solid.

The cockpit floor was redone, which is now solid, but not done by someone not too gifted with fiberglass, a little bumpy and slanted in spots....

Given all this mentioned, I'd like to give him a fair offer, but I really don't think a fair offer is even near the $15000 neighborhood. Im thinking $9-10,000Am I wrong?

I would greatly appreciate any input.
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  #2  
Old 02-28-2011
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A diesel that appears to have been maintained and runs well is a big plus.. for you the lack of refrigeration, and proper AC power facilities is a minus.

The rough glass work in the cockpit sole is definitely a bargaining chip, and can be cleaned up and faired with a bit of work and patience, esp if repainting the decks is in the cards anyway.

It's a bit tough to answer your question... prices on these boats vary widely regionally. Based on the text of the ad and not having seen it, around here that would be a reasonable starting price with a diesel. However in the US these boats seem to generally be priced relatively low.

Given the willingness to entertain offers, there's nothing to be lost by trying it on at your suggested numbers. In all likelihood you'll end up somewhere in between.

You've given it a good going over, but still recommend you get a proper survey and haul it to look for the usual... blisters, keel joint cracks, etc. If the bottom hasn't been done in a while you'll have to have it cleaned to check all that, so it's gonna cost you a bit to do that.
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Old 02-28-2011
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Even allowing for differences between Cdn and US $, that asking price seems very low, even for a 1977.

Then you mentioned the repairs that had to be done, and the repairs that had been done. OMG! It doesn't sound like the person doing the work knew what they were doing,

On top of that, the boat hasn't been hauled for several years? This isn't looking good, and I haven't even asked how many hours are on the engine.

While your Catalina 27 (great boat, BTW) experience will serve you well, unless you really like projects, this may NOT be the boat for you.

If you decide to go ahead, make your offer subject to a hull survey and full mechanical inspection. From the sound of it, the investment of a few hundred dollars could save you several thousand dollars. After all that, you will have some peace of mind because you will have a pretty good idea of what you are getting into.

That's my $.02 worth. Hope it helps.
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Old 03-01-2011
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I didn't think about the regional price differences.... Around here, or at least it seems to me, these boats are priced 15-20 IF..... they are excellent condition and well equiped. It does have a chart plotter and autohelm, but its missing some more elemenary and important things...... Ive been told by the guy I was going to hire for the survey that I shouldnt spend more than 8 or 9 thousand for a boat of that year. I feel like that is a low ball offer, but at the same time, Hes been buying and selling boats longer than Ive been alive and Im still new at this. I was thinking $10,000 as a good price. I don't mind a few projects. I feel like a properly installed shore power system should be a given for a boat that size so Im dissapointed, especially for the asking price, that it doesn't have it....However, I worked for an electrician for a couple years, my dad is licensed, and dont mind doing some wiring....I completely rewired my boat (AC and DC) last year. And I don't mind the cockpit floor, it is very solid under your feet, it just needs to be faired out a bit.... Id probably cover it anyway with some woodwork down the road.... These things I mentioned more as just bargaining chips....I might try and offer 9 and try to meet him at 10 or 11...I just wanted some input here....
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Last edited by sync; 03-01-2011 at 05:21 AM.
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Old 03-01-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sync View Post
I didn't think about the regional price differences.... Around here, or at least it seems to me, these boats are priced 15-20 IF..... they are excellent condition and well equiped. It does have a chart plotter and autohelm, but its missing some more elemenary and important things...... Ive been told by the guy I was going to hire for the survey that I shouldnt spend more than 8 or 9 thousand for a boat of that year. I feel like that is a low ball offer, but at the same time, Hes been buying and selling boats longer than Ive been alive and Im still new at this. I was thinking $10,000 as a good price. I don't mind a few projects. I feel like a properly installed shore power system should be a given for a boat that size so Im dissapointed, especially for the asking price, that it doesn't have it....However, I worked for an electrician for a couple years, my dad is licensed, and dont mind doing some wiring....I completely rewired my boat (AC and DC) last year. And I don't mind the cockpit floor, it is very solid under your feet, it just needs to be faired out a bit.... Id probably cover it anyway with some woodwork down the road.... These things I mentioned more as just bargaining chips....I might try and offer 9 and try to meet him at 10 or 11...I just wanted some input here....

Sync,

If what you say is true about regional prices, find some comparable boats for sale that are cheaper and show him that when you make your offer. He probably has some wiggle room.
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Old 03-01-2011
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If you do a significant amount of motoring, I expect that you will find that 14HP isn't enough to move the boat effectively through any kind of wind or chop.

It takes 20HP to do that in a Catalina 30.
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Old 03-01-2011
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Take a look on yachtworld.com there are a number of 1977 Catalina 30's listed with a wide price range from $8k to $20k depending on shape and equipment. I would agree a 14hp sounds under powered. We have a 9.9 hp yamaha on our Catalina 27 and have to be careful of tides through the narrows and it makes slow progress in chop
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Old 03-01-2011
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Wow...

I've been following the market really closely for the past five years. That is when the wife and I started shopping around. We have bought and sold two and are on our third.

What has been really interesting is to watch the prices plummet since the crash in 2007. The boat you're looking at would have sold for $10,000.00 more than they are asking just five years ago. There are such deals out there, but there aren't that many that have been able to take advantage of them. Or at least that many that were willing to make sacrifices in their lives to take advantage of them. Seems that one of the first things to go when the finances have become tight are the boats and the marina dues.

That said, without pictures it is more difficult to tell what is really going on. Those of us that have learned the hard way how to do an in-water inspection might notice things in pictures. It may be a really great deal, but I have seen and been on some fixer uppers in that price range that are closer to the 40' range.

Take your time and keep a sharp eye out. There are some great deals as the bottom falls farther out of the market.
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Old 03-01-2011
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I think your strategy of offering 9 is sound. The cons on this boat are as follows (I'm basing this off my experience and my '78 Catalina 30):
- Hull inspection for blisters and keel issues (keel bolts should be replaced because in '77 they used iron - Catalina Direct sells a kit for this)
- Per above re the engine, it will be underpowered if you plan on motoring much. If you could live with 5 knots and its reliable, then good.
- AC Shore power is a good negotiating tool; I rewired my entire DC and added AC and its not that difficult if your handy (have a certified electrician review everything)
- Refrigeration - I would think you need this if your going to live aboard so price that accordingly.
- Deck - any compression wear / cracks at the mast base?
- Deck - core issues as described
- Battery and charging - could be another $600 here if you need a charger and have to replace the banks (depending on age).
- Canvas / dodger - what shape is it in?

Overall though - The C-30 is a great boat and plenty of room below for the size and price so enjoy it!!

- Rob
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Old 03-01-2011
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One other important thing to check. Since the boat is pre-1985, there's a good chance that the keel stub is reinforced or built with marine plywood rather than solid fiberglass. That means this boat will eventually suffer from the Catalina "SMILE", which occurs when the plywood gets wet and rots and allows the keel to sag. IIRC, they changed the keel stub design in 1985 or thereabouts.

If this boat hasn't had the keel stub re-built, then you have to factor doing that into the cost of buying the boat.
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