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  #21  
Old 05-02-2011
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In addition to the factors mentioned, consider the reduction in demand arising from the dramatic aging of the population in the US. As the population ages we can participation in most active sports to decrease.

Birding anyone?
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  #22  
Old 05-02-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hudsonian View Post
In addition to the factors mentioned, consider the reduction in demand arising from the dramatic aging of the population in the US. As the population ages we can participation in most active sports to decrease.

Birding anyone?
Overall I think this is true. But an aging population is also in less of a hurry to get there, which (along with gas prices) could eventually help sailboats vs. power boats.
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  #23  
Old 05-02-2011
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Sailing today vs. "old times"

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Originally Posted by baboon View Post
I think this is a good piont. My 30 ft boat was built in the early 70's and was mid to high end for it's time. I consider a night on the boat delux camping. No oven, fridge, forced air heat or hot water. Most cruising boats I see now are set up more like a small homes, and it is very hard to fit all the creature comforts into a 30 ft hull.
I think this is it. Nowdays, people want to take their creature comforts with them, it used to be people went sailing to get away from their daily life, now they want to sail while continuing to text, email, surf the net, chat on the cell, watch DVD's, play the XBox, etc.

People that want to sail are perfectly happy with a used boat missing all the lastest electronic gizmos. They want to sail. At least those of us that can only manage daysailing. I suspect it extends somewhat to more lengthy trips as well.
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  #24  
Old 05-03-2011
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1) North American consumer are marketed to believe bigger must be better. It isn't just sailboats, SUVs and McMansions are prime examples

2) As the market for New Sailboats has shrunk from 110,000 units in the late 1970's to 5,000 units in 2010, boatbuilders have had to sell fewer; larger boats to defend their margins.


These 2 factors combine to make the under 30 ft market small. WD Schock builds a charming 25 footer, a perfect weekender suitable for 95% of people's true sailing - the Harbor 25. Yet, new boat buyers are looking to buy a 45 footer, that they will rarely sail because it is too big
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Old 05-03-2011
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What about makers such as Catalina, Hunter, Com-Pac and Precision? They have several new model boats under 30ft. Also others such as WW Potter and McGregor, Seaward has a 26 model too. There are others I came across too on the net, don't remember those makers though. Seems like most people would be more likely to buy something like a Catalina 22MkII new then a Catalina 320MkII considering the financial obligation. I also thought not too many people have the time to actually go cruising, not to mention some can't live aboard either. I think now would be a smaller boat market, especially considering the bad economy in the US.
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Old 05-03-2011
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I guess the point I was making is that even Upper Middle Class families cant afford *ANY* boat, even a smaller boat unless they make cutbacks elsewhere.
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Old 05-04-2011
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I miss the 70's ...gone forever..like Grizzly Adams and Kenner stretch dolls..
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Old 05-04-2011
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I think sailing tech has something to do with it too. We just upgraded from a 1980 C&C 24 to a 2001 Catalina 310.

The C&C was a "simple" boat that had a hank on jib (changed that after a couple of years) and no traveler, just a main sheet in the middle of the cockpit. The engine was a 4 stroke, 6 hp outboard and tiller steering.

The Catalina has a roller furler, traveler, all lines lead to **** pit and a dutchman system. The engine is an inboard diesel and wheel steering. It also has items like a windless, full head, etc.

We are still getting to know the new boat (only had in the water one weekend so far) but it already seems easier to sail and maneuver then the C&C. (once I figure out the crab walk thing) So in the past people may have bought the smaller boat to learn on and then upgraded. Now it seems like you can just jump to that 30+ boat without needing to learn on the smaller boat.

I do also feel that the American consumer aspect pointed out by others is part of the reason. How many of us are just baffled by the beautiful boats sitting at the dock day after day while we go out sailing in our cheaper boats? It seems like many people just own boats are part of status symbol and not to get out and sail.

We spent virtually every weekend last year on the boat from Friday night to Sunday night. This year we plan to spend from Thursday night to Monday morning. And next year I am hoping to convince the wife to live on the boat all summer. So having items like pressurized water, a micro wave, etc. made sense to us. The TV came with the boat and the only reason we have not removed it yet is because we plan to use it to check the weather.

As I mentioned, we do a lot of sailing with just the two of us and the dog, so the autohelm was more of a safety item to us. As was the radar. I know people have sailed for years without these items but why not increase your safety with them?

The wind instruments were just a plus and I would likely not have installed them if they didn't come with the boat. I didn't even have a wind indicator on the C&C. Same with the windless. But they are nice to have as extras.
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  #29  
Old 05-06-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailguy40 View Post
What about makers such as Catalina, Hunter, Com-Pac and Precision? They have several new model boats under 30ft. Also others such as WW Potter and McGregor, Seaward has a 26 model too.
True, but if you look at the other production boat manufacturers, most of their offerings start at 34, some at 32.

As someone said previously, I think you have to give credit to the builders. Knowing what their market is the key since no one wants to be sitting with unsold inventory in these economic times and I kind of agree with them.

I'm still looking to purchase my first sailboat but when I started, I thought that a 28 would be fine. After experience on bigger boats, I thought a 30 would be the ideal boat. After more experience, I'm now set on a 32. If I wait any longer to buy a boat, I'll probably wind up on a 36 or even a 42 and will be living on it since I will lose the house in the divorce settlement.....
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Old 05-06-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bljones View Post
And the amount you saved was what you had left over after your monthly obligations- taxes, mortgage, utilities. So you saved, monthly, to buy your car. It was still determined by your monthly budget, you just reversed the order- you made the payments, to yourself, before you bought the car, rather than buying the car and making the payments to the bank after.
So you're not different, just more responsible.
It's funny. You're saying that (saving by "paying yourself first -- then buying) like it's a bad thing. Sounds absolutely right to me.
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