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  #1  
Old 08-12-2003
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Best sailboat?

Who would you say builds the best sailboat for sailing long voyages far away from the coast? What would you say is a good size sailboat for doing this.
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Best sailboat?

There are several Great boats for voyageing. I guess it comes down to what the indivual likes. For me that would be Pacific Seacraft. But just so I am not killed here there are many others just as sea worthy and liveable. The size depends on how many in your crew. I have heard of voyagers heading out in a 26 footer on a 2 year or so trip. I wouldn''t do it in anything smaller than a 34. That in my 2 cents worth and it''s worth about that too.
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Old 08-12-2003
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Best sailboat?

That is about as easy a question as "How long is a piece of string and who makes the best string?"

There is no universally right answer to either that question or to your questions above without a lot more information such as,

How many people will be cruising aboard and how many will be capable crew?

Where will you be sailing when you are not ''far away from the coast''?

What is your budget?

How experienced are you?

Do you care about how fast the boat sails?

Are you more afraid of capsizing or sinking?

How physically fit are you?

How handy are you at repairing things?

Do you prefer things comfortable more than you prefer things that are easy to maintain?

In the simpliest answer to "What would you say is a good size sailboat for doing this?" roughly 2 1/2 to 5 long tons per person, with as many as 7 tons per person if you have a big enough budget and enough time to buy more sophisticated hardware and maintain it.

Respectfully,
Jeff
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Old 08-12-2003
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Best sailboat?

How many people will be cruising aboard and how many will be capable crew?
3-4

Where will you be sailing when you are not ''far away from the coast''?
Around the world

What is your budget?
Low- close to a homeless persons budget

How experienced are you?
I will be experienced

Do you care about how fast the boat sails?
Somewhat

Are you more afraid of capsizing or sinking?
nope

How physically fit are you?
well

How handy are you at repairing things?
yes

Do you prefer things comfortable more than you prefer things that are easy to maintain?
To me comfortable means easy to maintain.
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Old 08-13-2003
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Best sailboat?

IMHO I would have to say that the yachts from Nautor in Finland make some of the best built boats on the planet! They are truely the Rolls Royce of sailing vessels, without the english "quirkiness" associated with the automobile. As far as a "Production" boat is concerned, the craftsmenship and attention to detail is second to none. If I had to choose a long distance companion for serious and safe offshore work, I would search out one of their 44'' models from the mid 70''s. An S&S design, prior to all the rule cheating goofyness of the IOR era, they are remarkable boats. I have sailed many thousands of blue-water miles on them and they are one of the most honest yachts afloat. I concider the size almost ideal for off shore work. Anything under 40'' seems to get intimidated when the foam is blowing straight off the wave tops.

The Swan 44''s were legendary for their extreme ruggedness. The rig is stout, the hull is massive, and they have all the right stuff for exended stays at sea. They excell in a blow and seem to enjoy it the rougher it gets.

One of their great failings is light air performance. A boat this tough and strong is no ULDB! While no slouch, a more modern design will sail by them in under 5kts of breeze. In addition, the design is a little "close" for work in the tropics, the semi-flush deck has a bare minimum of openings and ventilation could be better.

I was on one in a blow of probably 35kts+, carrying a chute on a dead run, way over canvassed, in steep 15'' waves when the unthinkable happened. Well, unthinkable on most other boats. We stuffed the bow into the backside of a wave, stopped dead in the water, pitch-poled, yet she bounced back like nothing had happened! The total damage? The spin pole track on the mast got a little bent! Amazing! An incedent like that would have dismasted just about any other boat!

Fine examples of these boats still command almost $300k. But there are quite a few in the mid $100k''s. As in any older boat, systems would have to have been kept up and updated. But due to these boats owners fanaticism, most are very well kept.

A Swan 44 would be my choice to cover the globe in security and style!

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Old 08-13-2003
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Best sailboat?

That''s a little better. To start with that suggests a boat with minimally 15000 lbs of displacement and more likely closer to 23,000 to 28,000 lbs of displacement. That is roughly a 40 to 45 footer with something around 35 feet as a bottom end although I doubt that you will find a 35 footer of that displacement that will sail "Somewhat" quickly, or carry the tankage and have supply capacity for 4 adults. When you factor in the
"Around the world" factor you are ideally looking for a very robust boat with little useage.I doubt you will find a boat for your "Low- close to a homeless persons budget". I would think that a boat that was robust enough, in reasonably sound shape, and suitable to sailing around the world with up to 4 people would minimally cost in the $40,000 to $60,000 range. I would suspect that getting that boat in sutable condition, simply equipped,with proper spares would require an additional $15,000 to $30,000 if you were capable of doing most of your own labor. Of course that is not really a "Low- close to a homeless person''s budget".

The question "Are you MORE afraid of capsizing or sinking?" is an either or question as this affects some of the necessary tradeoffs involved in selecting a boat.

Jeff

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Old 08-13-2003
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Best sailboat?

With all due respect, while the Swan 44 is a very nice boat and a real classic, I would think that their 7''-6" draft would make them pretty ill suited as a circumnavigator if the trip around includes such areas as the Bahamas or the Pacific atols.

I also disagree with your statement That the Swan 44 was designed "prior to all the rule cheating goofyness of the IOR era" These are quintessential early IOR boats with all of the "cheating goofyness of the IOR era" as an integral part of the design including pinched ends, huge headsails and small mainsail, and enough tumble-home to assure that you will roll the rudder up out of the water on a knockdown and roll like a son of gun downwind.

Given Jeff''s budget, if he is going the Sparkman and Stevens early IOR boat route, he would be far ahead to try to find an early 1970''s era Tartan 41 which were equally ruggedly built, lacked a lot of the high maintenance fru-fru (such as teak decks) found on the Swan 44.

Please don''t get me wrong here. The Swan 44''s are really neat boats, but IMHO they are really not in line with Jeff''s goals.

Respectfully,
Jeff
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Old 08-15-2003
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Best sailboat?

There are a set of qualifications I apply to the best cruising boat.


She should be sound.

She should have rigging, stearing, sails, and all other systems in proper working order.

She should have nothing you dont need.

She should be paid for.

Those sound like about it.

Happy sailing.

-- James
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Old 08-15-2003
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Best sailboat?

I would agree with jbaros. only adding - You should like the boat too.

Being a skilled sailor sort of figures into all this as well. The skilled sailor counts more than the parentage or length of the boat. When you are skilled enough to do it you''ll be better equipped to repose the question.

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Old 08-15-2003
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Best sailboat?

I have been looking around at boats for a little bit for an upgrade to my 29 foot boat and am budget challenged also. I have 2 boats to toss out and see what people think of them. They may work for what Jeff is looking for.
First is a Bayfield 32, built in the 70''s and 80''s. A strong Canadian boat, several of which have been around the world. There are 2 for sale in Vancouver between $25k and $30k. I think the boat would work for a coulpe, but be really tight for 3 or 4 people. It has very limited water tankage so some modifications would have to be made or lots of Jerry cans brought. I don''t think its an especially fast boat, but I think it could do the job. Draft is 3''9".
Second is A Chris Craft sail yacht 35 foot. These were built in the 60''s and 70''s. Its a center cockpit with a seperate aft cabin in the 60''s boats and a huge engine space, while the 70''s boats have an inside passage and a second head with a smaller engine space. There is a lot of deck space and a lot of stowage space. It seems to be a strong fast boat around 20,000 lbs. It is a S&S design and I have seen one sell under $15k that needed lots of cleaning but was otherwise well outfitted. I see others from $25-35K and I see them rigged from sloop to yawl and some with two headsails and a bowsprit. They have deck stepped masts with a compression post and seem to have held up well. Draft is 4''8".
There are lterally thousands of boats out there for every budget. Both of these are from the lower end and both are full keel boats although there are more and more boats going out with fin keels, it just depends on what you are happy with.

Ken
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