Build Quality: Ericson, Pearson, Sabre, Tartan - Page 10 - SailNet Community
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post #91 of 116 Old 09-09-2011
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Originally Posted by blt2ski View Post
A lot of boats to a degree were more heavily built if you will back in the 80s vs today. I can compare my 85 jeanneau to a current one, there ARE some differences. I have seen similar in Bene's also. Hunter might be the only one that seemed to have some issues with 80's builds IIRC. There was a decade that they were not too good!

Otherwise, frankly, look at the maintenance of the boat vs brand. Not that it has been mentioned, but after 20-30 yrs, you will find some badly built Hunters that will be better overall than a GREATLY built swan of that vintage.....assuming you look hard enough!

Reality is, ANY of the major producton built brands from that era will be good. Try to figure out boat style and type vs brand. Ericson has some race/cruisers, and some that were just plain cruisers! The latter would not be a first choice for me and how I sail. But I know of a fellow across puget sound that luvs his E30Cruiser! He wrote and had published a review int he most recent issue of Cruising World. He also writes for GOB too. I personally look for race/crusiers.

I would also not look too bad on A4's, they seem to be good motors for what they were designed and intended to do etc.

Marty
Indeed. You're taking all the fun out of this, GRR! The world is your oyster right now, there are so many great boats to choose from.

+1 on the Atomic Bomb. They are less expensive to maintain than a diesel, parts and online support are readily available over at the Moyer Marine forum. They are casting engine blocks and cylinder heads again! Although primative, they are easily upgradable to electric fuel pumps and electronic ignition.

Don't get me wrong, diesel engines are good too and if my boat had come with one, I wouldn't rip it out for an Atomic 4 unless the diesel was dying, obsolete AND inadequate to the task of pushing the boat.

Alacrity, 1981 Tartan 33 #168
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post #92 of 116 Old 09-09-2011
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So I've located a Pearson 34 that I'm considering going to see. This is a model that has been on my short-list. It is relatively close to where I live compared to the other examples on the market (in fact, if I ended up with this boat I could possibly sail it home rather than having it trucked) and has always been a freshwater boat save for 1 trip to the Bahamas. So that is the upside.

But there are some potential downsides:

1) The broker tells me that the boat was "side-swiped" about twenty years ago. He did not know a lot of detail, other than that he thinks the boat was able to be motored to a boatyard that had an excellent reputation for its work. He said some fiberglass work was done and then the hull was painted. He said you cannot tell by looking at the boat where the collision occurred, so apparently it is at least cosmetically okay. There is no paperwork for this repair. It is a two owner boat and the second owner reportedly knew the first owner well enough that he was not concerned about the integrity of the repair (and apparently the first owner) when he purchased the boat. The second owner apparently felt confident enough in the integrity of the hull to take the boat to the Bahamas.

That's the beauty of fiberglass. It's relatively easy to repair. So long as the repairs are good, I don't know that I'd be concerned enough NOT to go have a look a the boat.

2) This boat has the original Universal 5416 engine which rates at 16hp. It was pulled 3-4 years ago and completely rebuilt to the tune of about 3k. So, how long could I expect a rebuilt engine to last (ballpark)? I know the issue of underpowering has been debated elsewhere about the 16hp in a Pearson
34, with some folks saying you should always go with the 2hp/1,000lbs rule while others said that 16hp was good enough for Bill Shaw. I'm concerned about difficulty motoring in current/swells, although reportedly the current owner has never had difficulty motoring anywhere and felt confident enough to take it to the Bahamas and back.


Hard to say. Ask who did the work. If you make an offer, have the engine surveyed.

3) All the electronics work, but are old so would need replaced in the coming years. Also, the main and genoa would likely need replaced in the next few years, but not immediately.

The boat is priced 7-10k below other examples that have bigger engines and more upgrades, but in the same ball park as some other examples with similar engines.


A new main and genoa will cost you nearly the 7k difference in price. Add some electronics upgrades, and you're well into the pricing for boats with better electronics and sails. It's up to you. Remember, there's the asking price, and there's what you offer. If you like the boat but the sails are in poor condition, then subtract that cost from your offer. The worse the current owner will say is "no". They might also make a reasonable counter offer as well.


Worth a look or keep movin' on?

Again, why not go have a look? It's not a bad way to spend part of a day. You might see some other boats at the dock that look interesting. Buying a boat is a process. So long as you're not in a rush, you'll find something that suits both you and your budget.
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post #93 of 116 Old 09-09-2011
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Personally, If the boat is overall in good shape, but as mentioned, electronics and sails are old.....you have the chance to put in what YOUR WANT! not what is already there! You may find yourself hooked up with a local YC< doing some club racing. have brand new dacron sails, and in two years are buying some pentex sails! With old ones, those could be the cruise daysail sails, or you buy a decent pentex/string main as I have, get some race sails, and a cruise jib as i wanted, not what they wanted! Electronics were the same on my boat, old, sorta worked, I put in what I wanted.

It was more fun in my book doing it this route. And yes, the boat was price accordingly!

Marty

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I drives me dinghy!
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post #94 of 116 Old 09-13-2011
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Just to add to the list of cost associated with sailing... I bought a fairly clean boat to start with, but the itch for new toys and upgrades have been severe.

I bought the boat for $55250 and have spent over $25,000 in the past year and a half. Very little, maybe $2000, has been repairing anything... the rest has all been upgrades. Really, I cannot believe I have spent even half of that. I just adds up way too fast!

Here is a link to cost up to may of this year:

Matt & Jessica's Sailing Page Ľ COST

1989 Sabre 34II Targa
mjsailing.com
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post #95 of 116 Old 09-13-2011
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Although I can't specifically speak for Sabre but I think you will find a common difference with most sailboat builders from models in the 70's to early 80's vs late 80's to 90's.
Older sailboats tend to have a modest beam but heavy displacement vs a wide beam but light displacement (compared to older models). Both will have a different feel while sailing and it becomes a personal preference.
It is a buyers market right now so you will be able to take advantage of some good deals... but good built sailboats will not drop a whole lot. I was thinking of getting a larger sailboat this year with a budget of $35k-$40k (Always loved the older Tartan 37s) but everyone I looked at within this range needed work or was not maintain well. Realistic budget would have been more like $55k plus some extra money for upgrades / rigging refit, etc..
Good luck!

Patrick

S2 11.0A 36'
Kinsale, Va
Tanzer 16'
Moseley, Va
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post #96 of 116 Old 09-13-2011
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Matt: great cost analysis. I am currently going through our P35 this fall/winter from bow to stern... I have not even started yet and I have already spent $4,000. I think there is a initial costs incurred which is buying the sailboat and then the recurring costs and constant upgrades and upkeep, and wants and needs.

Patrick

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Kinsale, Va
Tanzer 16'
Moseley, Va
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post #97 of 116 Old 09-13-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patrscoe View Post
Matt: great cost analysis. I am currently going through our P35 this fall/winter from bow to stern... I have not even started yet and I have already spent $4,000. I think there is a initial costs incurred which is buying the sailboat and then the recurring costs and constant upgrades and upkeep, and wants and needs.
It's amazing how fast the price gets away from you. Our only fairly large purchases have been davits, windlass, watermaker and solar... everything else have been $100 here and $100 there.

We still need to redo the standing rigging and purchase a new radar and chartplotter. I'm guessing I have at least another $5000 to put into it before we are ready to leave for the islands.

1989 Sabre 34II Targa
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post #98 of 116 Old 09-15-2011
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Just to add to the list of cost associated with sailing... I bought a fairly clean boat to start with, but the itch for new toys and upgrades have been severe.

I bought the boat for $55250 and have spent over $25,000 in the past year and a half. Very little, maybe $2000, has been repairing anything... the rest has all been upgrades. Really, I cannot believe I have spent even half of that. I just adds up way too fast!

Here is a link to cost up to may of this year:

Matt & Jessica's Sailing Page Ľ COST
Amazing. You can do your bottom with only 2 quarts of VC17m?
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post #99 of 116 Old 09-15-2011
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Mark,

It would not surprise me Matt could do his bottom with 2 qts of paint, assuming only once coat with some double layers, ie front of keel/waterline etc. I used all of 3-3.5 qts last feb with 2 full coats all around, and 4 at the waterline, leading/trailing edges of the keel and rudder. There were some notes in my OM from the originl owner that said something like 5 qts to paint the bottom. Maybe Matt and I were less liberal per coat than some?!?!?!?

Marty

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I drives me dinghy!
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post #100 of 116 Old 09-15-2011
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Quote:
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...they hired a company called Dry Boat (ever heard of this?) to fix the problem.

... would the gaskets remain or would this be replaced by something else?
Sorry for the delay--been away--but it looks like you've been covered. But no, never heard of Dry Boat. I thought that the decks on Pearsons, of the late 80's at least, had no core out at the toerail and for a couple of inches in.

Tossed my gaskets and just bedded with butyl--the gaskets will always allow too much flex.
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Northern Chesapeake Bay

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