2012 Beneteau Oceanis 41 and 2011 Catalina 445 - Page 4 - SailNet Community
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post #31 of 64 Old 01-12-2012
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Thank you PCP,I will buy it, ( the magazine), am french canadian, so won't be a problem for me.
I will be in Toronto this week end to take a look at the new Oceanis 41. I am new in the sailing world and after just a few resurch on the internet, I figure out, this boat is probably the one for me. I've been racing vintage cars for a while now and looking for a new hobby.
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post #32 of 64 Old 01-12-2012
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Thank you PCP,I will buy it, ( the magazine), am french canadian, so won't be a problem for me.
I will be in Toronto this week end to take a look at the new Oceanis 41. I am new in the sailing world and after just a few resurch on the internet, I figure out, this boat is probably the one for me. I've been racing vintage cars for a while now and looking for a new hobby.
If you have been racing probably you would appreciate a more sportive boat with a good interior and good cruising abilities.

Besides the Beneteau you should look at the Jeanneau 409 (that has a performance version) to the new Hanse 415 to the more Sportier Dehler 41 and to the Dufour 40e. They will be all more fun to sail, specially the Dehler that has a Dealer in Chicago.

Take a look at this thread where all those boats were commented:

Interesting Sailboats

Regards

Paulo
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post #33 of 64 Old 01-12-2012
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Originally Posted by PCP View Post
If you have been racing probably you would appreciate a more sportive boat with a good interior and good cruising abilities.

Besides the Beneteau you should look at the Jeanneau 409 (that has a performance version) to the new Hanse 415 to the more Sportier Dehler 41 and to the Dufour 40e. They will be all more fun to sail, specially the Dehler that has a Dealer in Chicago.

Take a look at this thread where all those boats were commented:

Interesting Sailboats

Regards

Paulo
A C&C 121 would out sail any of those if sporty is what he wants.


However, he'd likely not be able to get in to Rock Hall.

PalmettoSailor
s/v Palmetto Moon
1991 Catalina 36

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post #34 of 64 Old 01-12-2012
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A C&C 121 would out sail any of those if sporty is what he wants.


However, he'd likely not be able to get in to Rock Hall.
Well, it out price certainly any of those even if I don't believe that it out sail a top spec Dehler 41 (not the inexpensive one that I am referring).

I referred those boats because they offer performance and sail pleasure at an affordable price and good cruising accommodations. The C&C is a much more expensive boat.

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Paulo
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post #35 of 64 Old 01-12-2012 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by PCP View Post
If you have been racing probably you would appreciate a more sportive boat with a good interior and good cruising abilities.

Besides the Beneteau you should look at the Jeanneau 409 (that has a performance version) to the new Hanse 415 to the more Sportier Dehler 41 and to the Dufour 40e. They will be all more fun to sail, specially the Dehler that has a Dealer in Chicago.

Take a look at this thread where all those boats were commented:

Interesting Sailboats

Regards

Paulo
I love tweaking the sails to get that last 1/2 knot out of her. Another hobby of mine is trackdays on a motorcycle. Speeds up to 150 mph.

However, I don't look at sailing the same way. At all. Objectively and comparatively, all the boats you mention are just sloooow.

Course, I don't race....
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post #36 of 64 Old 01-12-2012
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bcc,

you may or may not know of one Chip Hanuer?!?! one of the unlimited hydro drivers more winning racers that has retired. Guess what he does not to race? yep, sail boat, small 12' butterfly's IIRC. says it is just as an adrenalin rush as racing hydros over the water at 200+ down the straightaways. Granted a bit different rush, but adrenalin just the same.

If you like Bene's, I'd look look at the first 40 personally. Not sure I would look at a C&C 121.

Marty

She drives me boat,
I drives me dinghy!
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post #37 of 64 Old 01-14-2012
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Thanks everyone, I have checked the boats you've mentioned. The 409 is nice, not sure about the Dehler with all the cables on the floor of the cockpit, C&C and the Fist 40seems a bit to narrow... Anyway. I understand that sailboats are slow, and I won't let go racing my Lotus 23B. Racing in the summer and sailing in the winter. I'm just affraid that everytime I will see another sailboat , I will try to pass him... But since my wife is part of the sailling adventure,(we plan to cross the ocean ) I guess I will have to compromise on the speed. So What I'm really looking for is a fast, luxury, ocean cruiser, easy to sail, around 200K. Did I mentioned that we have 5 kids, (don't worry we don't plan to bring them along all the time). Monday we will be at the boat show in Toronto, and will visit a bunch of sailboats for the first time. I will get back to you with my appreciations later on.
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post #38 of 64 Old 01-14-2012
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Thanks everyone, I have checked the boats you've mentioned. The 409 is nice, not sure about the Dehler with all the cables on the floor of the cockpit, C&C and the Fist 40seems a bit to narrow... Anyway. I understand that sailboats are slow, and I won't let go racing my Lotus 23B. Racing in the summer and sailing in the winter. I'm just affraid that everytime I will see another sailboat , I will try to pass him... But since my wife is part of the sailling adventure,(we plan to cross the ocean ) I guess I will have to compromise on the speed. So What I'm really looking for is a fast, luxury, ocean cruiser, easy to sail, around 200K. Did I mentioned that we have 5 kids, (don't worry we don't plan to bring them along all the time). Monday we will be at the boat show in Toronto, and will visit a bunch of sailboats for the first time. I will get back to you with my appreciations later on.
Let me tell you something that I have learned with time and sailing in different modern sailboats:

Sailboats are slow if you compare them with a car and a car is slow if compared with an airplane but, as Marty have said, the sensations you can get on a sailboat are not with accordance with that slowness, the same way you can have much more vivid sensations in a car comparing with an airplane that is way faster.

Between sailboats a 1K difference is a lot and you can say that is nothing but that is not what is more important between a Dehler/Dufour 40e and a Oceanis (Benetau) it is the sensation you have at the wheel. You should understand that very well. The sensation yo got at the wheel of your little Lotus has nothing to do with the sensation you have on the wheel of a modern turbo diesel BMW sedan even if the two can go at the same speed. That's about it that I am talking about (and in what regards the boats they will not go at the same speed).

And you will want to catch any boat that appears on the horizon, I can tell you that.

Probably I am not very different from you, I have raced motorcycles for more than 10 years and I drive a tuned up Mr2 so it is possible that I know what you would like as a boat. I am also a family man and the boat was part of the my kid's education. I would say that if you can afford it a cruising boat with a sportive character would be what serves you better. From the ones You can have there probably the better (at a lower price) is a Dufour 40e or the new Dehler. Both are more expensive than the Benetau or the Jeanneau.

The Dehler is by far from the three the better offshore boat and the one I would chose if I wanted to sail a lot offshore. It is also from all the boats (with the exception of the Hanse) the one that have the poorer designed interior even if the quality is probably better than the one from Benetau.

I did not say nothing about the First because the First 40 has in my opinion two capital defects has a cruising boat: Very insufficient outside storage and not a decent anchor locker. In what regards sailing characteristics is not very different from the Dehler, including in its offshore capability (very good).

If you don't chose the right boat now you will find it later and to change for the right boat you will then waste a lot of money. You should try both types of boats, I mean Bavaria/Benetau type and Dufour 40e/Dehler 41 type and then you would understand precisely what I am trying to say. Charter is a good way to do it.

Regards

Paulo

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post #39 of 64 Old 01-14-2012 Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone, I have checked the boats you've mentioned. The 409 is nice, not sure about the Dehler with all the cables on the floor of the cockpit, C&C and the Fist 40seems a bit to narrow... Anyway. I understand that sailboats are slow, and I won't let go racing my Lotus 23B. Racing in the summer and sailing in the winter. I'm just affraid that everytime I will see another sailboat , I will try to pass him... But since my wife is part of the sailling adventure,(we plan to cross the ocean ) I guess I will have to compromise on the speed. So What I'm really looking for is a fast, luxury, ocean cruiser, easy to sail, around 200K. Did I mentioned that we have 5 kids, (don't worry we don't plan to bring them along all the time). Monday we will be at the boat show in Toronto, and will visit a bunch of sailboats for the first time. I will get back to you with my appreciations later on.
Take pics at the show, if you don't mind. I'm going to try to swing a business trip up there so I can take in the show the following Saturday.

Anyway, let me tell ya how to get the right boat, IMO. Show your SO the boats under consideration and let her pick. Then option it out the way you want. Then keep the boat mainly flat when she's on board the first 2 seasons. Wife on the water in a boat you like equals the right boat.

She ain't happy, the family ain't sailing. Much.
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post #40 of 64 Old 01-14-2012
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I understand and agree at both opinions. I will try as much boats as I can before buying, and won't choose before I can feel the wheel of a boat like I can feel the wheel of a car. I have a lot to learn in regards of sailing but I will do everything to get the right way and be able to recognize the smallest differences between each boats. For the moment, except for the beauty and some particularity of the boat ( I have own many RV (to pull my race car).) I don't know much about what a good boat feels like, but I am a fast learner. e.g. my RV now is a Mercedes Benz B class diesel; small, economic, very well design and easily pull my trailer. As to the wife, Carole had followed me at every races I did ( over 200 ) over the past years and says that she will follow me to the end of the world, so not a problem there, but I know what you mean, if the wife's happy ...

Andre
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