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  #11  
Old 03-19-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

Hi guys, thank you for the detailed responses. Cliff you are right, I did have uncomfortable feeling when H28.5 heeled, that we are going to roll over. It takes time to get used to. I’m actually fascinated now by 29' Columbia 8.7: the woodwork quality, the cabin size and abilities Columbia 8.7 Specifications. Unfortunately I do not see J 29 on sale in South Florida. I think I can get Columbia around $12k. What do you think?
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Old 03-19-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

Now your going in the wrong direction for distance traveled per day. PHRF for the 8.7 is 222 and the H 28.5 was a 177 and the J 30 a 147 all Lake Erie #'s. This is where the Slow Boat to China really means something with the Columbia 8.7, If you bought the boat for $12K it is quite possible it needs a complete re-fit. New Standing rigging and running rigging and now we just spent maybe $3-5K. Since your thinking of going from the New England area to Florida then open your search to the New England area as well. A boat from the Great Lakes or the Atlantic North will have so much less wear and tear on it compared to a boat from the South. As you know the boats up North sit on the Hard for a good 5-6 months so that's 5-6 months less use per year.

We do a 2 week vacation on our J 29 and I have friends that climb on board and they wonder how we do 2 weeks, because we don't have all the furniture that they do. My wife sums it up pretty simple J 29 living is like tent living and a big cruiser is like motor home living. You would be amazed at how much distance we can put on some of these big cruising boats. We have some friends who have a Beneteau 36.3 with a roller furling main head sail and a 3 bladed prop and another set with a Hunter 333 and just doing a local port to port sail we will be at the marina hours before them and if it was a beat all the way there then were really talking hours. The J 29 can really go to weather. Another factor is how well the boat can point, one that don't make for very long trips and sometimes being out on the water for now with the Columbia 8.7 5-6 days longer could mean the difference of being in a very bad storm to not.

Cliff
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Old 03-20-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

One other thing it's not really a $12K boat, it's a $18K boat you just haven't spent the other $6K yet. The thing with old cruising boats is the owners don't keep them up dated. They have old rigging old sail's and old motors. If they did up date them then they would want more money for it. I just bought my J 29 over the winter it came with 3 Mains 8 head sails and 3 spinnakers, previous one I bought came with 19 sail's. So I was siting good for sail's for along time. You truly get what you pay for and with old boats you get old roller furling original sail's and old instruments and just plain old everything. So a lower priced boat really is not the deal it seems.

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Old 03-20-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

I know C-Rock and a lot of what he says is true. No doubt that the J29 and J-30 are better sailing boats than the 28.5. If you want to race they are usually a better choice. If you are doing coastal cruising it is not necessarily so. The J's tend to be beat on a little more. Although the J's construction is robust the execution was lacking a little in these 80s boats. It is hard to find a J-30 under $30,000 that does not have core problems and delamination in the transom and deck. Rudder problems are another area on these boats. Even C-Rock has had to do some core replacement on the Js he has owned.

The performance of the J's comes at a price in comfort and accommodations. The low freeboard of both the 29 and 30 makes for a wet ride. As they were originally designed as race boats they require a bit of crew as moveable ballast to keep them flat. This partially offset by the fact that you can sail both the 29 & 30 under main alone in moderate to heavy winds. Both the 29 and 30 do not meet the stability index for offshore racing. That does not mean they are not relative stiff but it does mean they do not recover well from a capsize.

The J-30 has a reasonably spacious interior relative to the 28.5. The J-29 is a tent camper. Another thing to remember is that all of these boats motor at about the same speed. The 28.5 has an 18hp Yanmar, the 30 has a 13hp Yanmar and the 29 inboard has an 8hp yanmar. If you are considering sailing the boat back from Miami, the 29 with a 8 hp motor in the ICW would be annoying at best.

As a newbie the J-29 and 30 might be a little bit more difficult to manage. BTW- My buddy had a Columbia 8.7. Wide body cruiser. Heavy duty hardware. "Wineglass" transom makes the boat a bit "rolly" with a following sea. He had bulkhead delamination at the chainplates, deck cracks and rudder problems with his before he got rid of it. Boat was not a responsive sailing boat.

Cal 28-2, C&C 29-2, Tartan 28 are all viable alternatives to a 28.5. If you are performance oriented, a S2 9.1 is a good alternative to the J-30 and faster too.
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Old 03-21-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

Sandusky Sailor knows I am a J Boat guy I love my J 29. The C&C 29-2 is a nice boat as well S 2 9.1 very nice as well. Yes the J 30 and the S 2 9.1 are more performance oriented there more of a racing direction where as the other boats mentioned are more of a cruising direction. Just get on one or all of them and keep in mind what you will doing more with the boat.

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Old 03-21-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

You may think I'm crazy, but I have seen today a Golden Hind 1975. What a beauty!
…The original design, drawn up by Maurice Griffiths, was commissioned in 1965 by a British coffin manufacturer, Hartwell’s, that decided to try its hand at boatbuilding. They built 120 Golden Hinds in plywood over six years, whereupon their yard manager, Terry Erskine, took over in 1971 and began building the boat with a fiberglass hull and a wood deck and cabinhouse. Erskine closed up shop in the early 1980s, but in 1995 production was resumed by Golden Hind Marine. Using Erskine’s molds they built only a few fancier, more modern “Mark II”... Do not forget that I have to live on board for 4 month. Its not a fastest boat, but in this boat I can go around the world. No doubts about it. I may get one for $9500. I know its hard to get parts for the original engine, the cabin built from solid mahogany... Look at this one: 1969 Golden Hind sailboat for sale in Massachusetts
not the one I can get. Don't look like a coffin.
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Old 03-21-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

Yup I think your crazy and the phrase "Lead Sled" comes to mind. Only way that boat is going to get from Boston to Miami in 2 weeks is by truck.
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Old 03-21-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

Quote:
Originally Posted by MishaB View Post
You may think I'm crazy, but I have seen today a Golden Hind 1975. What a beauty!
Misha, with respect.... If you go from a H28 to a Golden Hind within a week or two it's clear you don't really have an idea of what kind of boat you want/need nor, likely, a clear sense of what the differences would be.

If I had to go with a half glass/half wood boat it would most certainly be a wooden hull with a glass deck, not the other way around. Do the "Mark IIs" have glass decks?

Purchase price is important because you need to have a budget and know what you can afford, but before you get there you really need to figure out what kind of boating you want to do, where you want to do it and what type of boat suits that best.

I think more research is in order..
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Old 03-24-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

Ok, common sense coming back, thanks to you, guys. Today I’m going to look into 1982 O’Day 30’. According to owner, for last 10 years, it was barely used, only regularly maintained. It’s around 15k. May be I can bring to 14K. I will go through the boat using list of checks I have compiled from different sources. This type of boat should not have many problems, according to reviews.

Material
Stick with fiberglass construction if you're a beginner -- most wooden boats require a good deal more maintenance and care, and damage and rot in wooden boats can be hard to find without a massive teardown and/or lots of professional experience.
2
Check for: boat pox (blisters on the bottom); spongy deck; leaking chainplates; water running down the inside from the hull-deck joint; severe cracks around deck fittings and mast step; fittings pulling out of the deck; large gelcoat gouges below the waterline; cracks along the top of keel; wobbly rudder; wobbly driveshaft. These are all potentially expensive fixes.
3
If the gelcoat looks dull or faded, make sure it just needs a polish and not a new paint job.
EditDeck and Cabin hammer-Sounding a Hull (Tap-Test)
Do my best
In cabin sailboats, much more damage involves leakage of rainwater from above than seawater from below. Check for signs of leaking decks and cabintops, such as streaks, stains and mildew inside the cabin. Watch for gobs of sealant around the portlights (windows), which is a sign that somebody has been chasing down leaks.
2
Leaking decks can lead to very expensive damage to the deck itself and to bulkheads below. Many fiberglass boats have decks with plywood or balsawood core material. If water has leaked in around improperly sealed deck fittings, the plywood or balsawood core of the deck may have delaminated and rotted. If you find spots or areas of the deck that are mushy in the least, run away. This is a huge pain to fix.
1. 3
Water damage and rot in the interior bulkheads and woodwork may cause more than cosmetic damage. In some boats, the chainplates (attachments for the rigging that holds up the mast) are attached to plywood bulkheads inside the cabin. In some boats, the interior woodwork holds up a deck-stepped mast. If such structural woodwork is water damaged, rotted, or otherwise unsound, be alarmed.
Engine
1. 1
Steer clear of rare or very old engines unless you're certain there's an adequate supply of parts.
2. 2
Do the Smoke Test: healthy diesels make small amounts of black smoke with some white on cold starts. Sick ones make blue or continuous white. Diesels are generally robust but require a strict schedule of oil changes. Bonus points for proof of maintenance.
3. 3
Check for fuel leaks and a working bilge blower in gasoline engines. Again, bonus points for maintenance records and a spare parts kit. Common ailments of gas engines: wet or worn-out electrical, bad points and plugs.
4. 4
Before the seller cranks the engine, check to see if it is already warm. If the seller took the trouble to warm up the engine before showing you the boat, it may be hard to start the engine when cold.
Sails and Rigging
1. 1
Take all of the sails out of their bags and spread them out. Look for chafing, repairs, stretches, pulled-out stitches and broken slides. Mildew is harmless but tough to get rid of. Check spinnakers for excessive bagginess. Hoist the windward sails and check for excessive draft and stretch. Remember that replacing the sails can cost you half the price of an old sailboat.
2. 2
Rigging will show the general quality of the boat's maintenance. You can pretty much count on replacing a lot of rigging on any old boat, though. Check for worn pins and shackles, unraveling wire, broken blocks, worn-out lines. These items are relatively easy to fix and replace, however. Winches should work smoothly, but if they don't, you can almost always get them running right with a quick cleaning and greasing.
3. 3
If possible, hoist all the sails and work all the halyards, sheets, winches and furlers.
Troubleshooting
1. 1
Check the wiring -- it's commonly done by people who have no clue about what they're doing. If you have no clue, then get an expert.
2. 2
Check seacocks. Beware if they're seized open.
3. 3
Look for leaks around portholes and hatches.
4. 4
Work the engine controls; cables and linkages should move smoothly. If possible, do a battery load test.
5. 5
Check spreader and mast lights. Listen for wires banging around inside the mast -- a sure way to lose a night's sleep.
6. 6
Dodgers and other canvas get bonus points for being Sunbrella and having unfogged plastic windows .
7. 7
Make sure safety equipment complies with government regs and in good condition. In the galley, the propane or CNG should be installed properly.
8. 8
Ensure that the bilge doesn't smell like a bilge.


Anything missing?
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Old 03-25-2012
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Re: Hunter 28.5 1985 buy or not to buy

Looks like that will cover it, "GET IT SURVEYED" this alone will answer all your questions. It will cost about $500.00 or so for a survey. Get a surveyor who is a sailor be there when it's surveyed and check out the surveyor ask for references. Plus when the surveyor finds problems and he will this is a tool to get the price to where it should be. It is a buyers market if it comes through the survey ok and the asking price is $15K I would offer maybe $10K and buy it for around $12K. You can always go up on your offer but once you make that offer you can't go back down. IT IS A BUYERS MARKET, it will need new sail's and all new running rigging. I would bet it has all original sail's I would get a quote from a sailmaker for new sail's.
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Last edited by CliffRuckstuhl; 03-25-2012 at 08:07 PM.
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