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el 01-12-2004 06:15 AM

Help save our marriage!!
My husband & I are ready to make a purchase, but we are having heated arguments over which boat. He wants the construction quality and performance of a Tartan or Sabre, while I absolutely love the classic looks of the Cabo Rico. Yes, I know that we have to make compromises, but I must ask: are there any truely well built boats that sail as good as the Tartans and have the classic lines of the Cabo Rico.

Our Specs:

- we will be sailing the Bahamas, VI''s, Antilles, S. America, central America

- 38-40 ft

- under $175,000

- aft cockpit

- max 6'' draft


WHOOSH 01-12-2004 10:36 AM

Help save our marriage!!
El, would it help things at all if I were to assure you that ALL of the boats you are considering, well prepared and safely equipped (need I add, competently navigated), will do just fine. Your trip is safe even if you selected one of this group via darts & blindfold, you''ll have enough storage and sailing performance and, besides all that, you''ll mostly be relying on ''systems'' (rig, electrical, mechanical, navigational) that are very transferable and can live on any of the boats you are considering.

In truth, this might not have much to do with boat choice. Why not one of you give the other one an advance birthday gift: a red ribboned box that, inside, has a card which says "You get to pick".


sadie14 01-12-2004 11:27 AM

Help save our marriage!!
Are you buying new or used?

I love traditional boats, also, and my boat had to make my heartstrings sing. My living area had to have a lot of wood and no plastic. None of this has to do with how she sails, but we managed to find it all in one package.

ALL your boats are great. Take the time to do pro/con lists separately and jointly. Take the time to spend an hour or more in each boat using the settees, pretend to wash dishes/cook, play at sleeping, peeing, and holding on in rough weather.

Can you sit in the cockpit together, can you lay down there? How do the decks feel, pretend to hoist sail, to hang on, to move back and forth and up and down on the cabin top. Get in an out of the cockpit. Stand back and look at the boat.

DO this together. Can you move around each other comfortably? How do you both feel after an hour on the boat? Don''t try to do all three boats in one day. And do take a notebook each to write your thoughts.

Compare all the specs, weight, displacement, water/fuel tanks, etc. Get on the email lists and ask owners if they have one, did they look at the others?

Both need to keep an open mind, comfort is very important for long distance/long term cruising. The fastest boat may not be the most comfortable. We chose stable, heavy, full keel, good sailing abilities, but will probably not win any races (although her type has). Don''t let the analysis cause paralysis -- feelings count, too.

We purchased three boats. The first was to sail and play with. The second was to liveaboard, the third was to liveaboard and cruise comfortably and safely.

It''s a tough decision, but with care for each other, you can make it together.

el 01-12-2004 11:58 AM

Help save our marriage!!

My husband is of the opinion that we will be sacrificing a good deal of performance & perhaps some quality if we go with the CR38. If this is not the case (if the difference in performance is slight) we DON''T have a problem!!

We also feel that all 3 boats should do a good job for our intended use (cruising, not racing). I don''t want to put words into your mouth, but are you saying that there is not that much difference in performance between Sabre & CR. Unfortunately, we are not experts in this area and rely heavily on the limited information we have been able to gather on the 3 boats.


We have done the things that you suggest. We have beatin it to death. We know that we will be happy with any of the 3, but it comes down to: do we give up some performance for a damn beautiful boat. (I guess you can tell which one gets my vote)


Silmaril 01-12-2004 01:04 PM

Help save our marriage!!
All the boats you list are very nice, well equipped cruisers. BUT.... the CR is substantially slower than either the Saber or Tartan.

I know it is used for racing, but take a peek at each boats PHRF handicap. That is the handicap guide for most cruising boats.

All things being equal, with both boats sailed by competent crews, a boat that rates 100 is 20 seconds per mile "faster" than a boat that rates 120.

As an example: a boat that rates 100, will arrive 2,000 seconds (about an half hour) before a boat that rates 120 over 100 miles. Go to 1,000 miles and the gap builds to about 6 hours.

No big deal, right? The Sabre 38 rates about 120 or so (plus or minus for rig, cb etc.) the CR 38 rates 177. Now we are talking real numbers, almost a minute per mile! Over 100 miles, we''re talking an hour and a half, and over 1,000 miles over 16 hours!

The ratings also give you an idea how easily driven a boat is, meaning it will take less sail and effort for a given boat speed.

Don''t get me wrong, the Cabo''s are wonderful boats, but if I was trying to make decent time in all weather conditions, and not get beat up in a blow, I''d look to a more modern design.

bob-m 01-12-2004 03:17 PM

Help save our marriage!!

Both Sadia and Jack have given you sage advise. The very fist thing you need to do is define how the sailboat will be used (you have done that). Now fit the boat to the use not vise versa. Unless you are considering an absolute slug, speed should be way down on your priority list. True cruiser (not weekend wannabees) are rarely in a hurry. They plan ahead, only move with good weather windows, rarely beat to windward and will probably outlive all the "go-fast" crowd.

From everything I have ever heard about Cabo''s, you will be making a great choice. Remember, you are not just buying a sailboat, you are buying your home!

Get your hubbie to follow Sadie''s advise and you will have the home that you truely want and will be proud of.

paulmcquillan 01-12-2004 08:58 PM

Help save our marriage!!
Lots of good advise, but I didn''t see one bit of info that might help you with the selection. Where will you start your sailing, and then later where do you expect to stop/pause/hang out for a whle?

The tradewinds will work well for any of the boats, and the speed differential in those conditions may not be that important to you.

Get up to higher lattitudes and you''ll find the wind more often on the nose. We ended up picking a more weatherly boat (which happened to also be faster) simply because many of our local destinations are up wind. And we are in Southern CA about N34 deg.

el 01-13-2004 03:54 AM

Help save our marriage!!
sadie & jack & bob

I want to sincerely thank you for your help. Your comments helped my husband realize that "the analysis was causing paralysis". He had lost sight of the bigger picture. Our next boat (the Cabo Rico!!!) will hopefully be our home for many years to come. Sometimes you just need to hear it from others.

Thanks again!!!

sadie14 01-13-2004 05:14 AM

Help save our marriage!!
I suspect that the Cabo will be more comfortable than the other two, but cannot prove it.

Does anyone have the Holtrop-Saildata excel spreadsheet?

I personally don''t want to get there faster if I am more exausted and beat-up from the effort of doing so. A sea kindly, comfortable vessel will allow you to be ready to go sightseeing after you arrive, rather than sleep and heal for the next 3 days.

Also, you spend a lot of time anchored or dock side, and that needs to be accounted for as well. (Unless your not living aboard.)

Please let us know what you end up doing.

928frenzy 01-13-2004 09:25 AM

Help save our marriage!!
I too like the classic lines of the CB more than the Tartan or Sabre. The fact that it is slower may also bely its more comfortable motion in a seaway.

If most of your sailing will be nearshore, then the faster boats would be a better selection. But you indicated you plan to live on it, which seems to imply you want a passagemaker. If so, speed is not nearly as important as comfort. True, you don''t want to have a slug, but I don''t think the CB38 falls into that catagory.

Lastly, I envy your ability to make such a choice. Most (like me) can only dream of having the options you mentioned.

~ Happy sails to you ~ _/) ~

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