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  #1  
Old 03-04-2004
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Bavaria Yachts

I am searching for my next (New not used) boat in the 42'' 47'' range.

I have been looking at Bavaria Yachts (Bavariayachts.com) and all I can say is wow.

There has been no mention of Bavaria on here as far as I could tell and I am wondering what the story is with this boats.

On Yacht World, It seems that there are many of them but they are all In AUS or Europe. Can someone tell me what the story is behind these boats and why they are evidently not so popular in the USA?

Would purchasing a Bavaria 44 or 49 be a mistake?

Please let me know..

Thanks..
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Old 03-04-2004
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Bavaria Yachts

well those are built in Germany. actually in BAvaraia far away from any water.

They do built them very modern and use the newest techniqyes for high volume output.

However if you go on the german forums, than you find endless tales of people complaining from keels who pushed upward into the hull over the winter to may other destructive things. They are a lot of boat for the money... but have a questionable reputation in germany.

Why not a few feet smaller and much better like a sabre or tartan

Thorsten

I havent said anything about catalinas did I ? Somewaht the same mass produced boat, looks good in many peoples eyes, has lotsa room , is a lot of boat for the money. Still a lot of people hate them ( for whatever reason . I dont want to start something here, but i can see the similarities )
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Old 03-04-2004
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Bavaria Yachts

Jack:

Bavaria Yachts are reportedly the largest builder in Europe. They are the classic ''price boat'' builder, which is to say they develop a marketing goal - e.g. a new 35 foot fractionally rigged sloop that will cost less than 80K Euros - and then they make a series of manufacturing decisions to deliver the boat accordingly. Some of their cost efficiencies come from automation (which may/may not be a good thing re: build quality) while other cost savings are simply due to modest fit-out, light scantlings and an emphasis on speed over thoroughness WRT production. When Practical Boat Owner in the UK recently did a review of the factory and its product (vs. any specific boat) they observed that the one laborer in the plant who seemed to enjoy job security was the fellow with the caulking gun who could fill all the unclosed seams and joinerwork gaps. That certainly sums up my impression of how they look, and I find the functionality of their cockpit, layout and such to be disappointing.

But...if all this is fair, how come they build and sell so many boats? You have to visit Europe to appreciate how active are their sailing clubs and training schools over here. Legislation requires course completion for any amount of sailing, and many folks can''t afford to own their own boat. Thus, charters and sailing schools are huge buying groups...and as you would suspect, schools and for-profit businesses appreciate the low entry price point. In truth, so do most buyers. Given the limited use most of us make of our sailboats, perhaps a Bavaria is a more suitable choice than it deserves to be more many buyers.

Jack
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Old 03-05-2004
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Bavaria Yachts

I have to weigh in with the others on this. My sense of the Bavaria''s is pretty much as the others have noted, Crawling around the bowels of one, the glass work looks poorly done with comparatively wide spread use of non-directional fabrics, dubious construction details and not particularly well developed rig and hull designs. They are cheap to buy but I would hate to own one. I was on a roughly 3 year old one last summer and was amazed at how beat up this boat looked. Obviously this is way too small a sampling to tell anything about the long term prospects of a whole line of boats especially since I do not know any details of the boat''s history.

My sense is that you would be much better served with boats like the Elans, Hanse, Dehlers, Beneteau First Series or with a bit more budget with something like a Tartan, Sabre, J-boat cruising series. Even Hunters, Catalinas and Beneteau''s number series seem to be better constructed and detailed than the Bavarias.

(A peince of me is particularly disappointed in the Bavarias,given their reliance on America''s stereotyping of anything German as somehow better made and their failure to deliver on that inference.)

Jack, one minor but not terribly relevant point, as far as I know, the Beneteau group is the largest producers of sailboats in the world pretty much dwarfing the other companies. The last statistics that I saw, thier porduction was greater than Hunter and Catalina combined. At that time Bavarias were a pretty distant second place in the European marketplace. What I don''t know is whether the published numbers were for all of Beneteaus'' many divisions and multiple worldwide production facilities. Do you have more up to date data that suggests that Bavaria has passed Beneteau somehow?

Jeff
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Bavaria Yachts

Jeff H,

I see on the board today comments about the Farr design being ''rolly'' and uncomfortable at sea. Do you find in your experience that this translates to the newer First series, 36.7 and 40.7, as well?

Mike
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Bavaria Yachts

I have not had the opportunity to sail a 42-47 Bav but have chartered their 36 and 32 models. The sailing characteristics would not be relevant for you but the construction and layout may be: they are aesthetically pretty boats, they market them as if they are a BMW car, with a certain pride of construction etc. that edges towards unwarranted arrogance. To summarize my experience, they did not appear to me to have an edge over a similar sized Hunter, whatsoever, in fit, finish and sailing behaviour. I ended up with a used Beneteau when the day to purchase came. I still like the Bavaria''s style and the passengers feel special when they are in the salon, it is quite elegant. They are as good as but not better than, is my opinion--
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Jeff, I think PBO''s statement was that the Bavaria factory (not ''yard'', mind you...) which they visited was the largest volume producer among all the (other, individual) factories in Europe. That''s as opposed to how many hulls of a given brand are built, Europe- or world-wide in the same period.

Sorry if I didn''t say that right...

Jack
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Old 03-06-2004
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I can see that. Thanks for the clarification. I like your other point. It is funny how at some point in my lifespan boats ceased being built at boatyards and began being built at factories.

Regards
Jeff
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