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-   -   Got my title for the 30 footer.. (http://www.sailnet.com/forums/boat-review-purchase-forum/9353-got-my-title-30-footer.html)

john232 03-17-2004 09:44 PM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
I finally received my Title in the mail for the Santana 30 that I bought from an Insurance Company last year. The boat was salvaged and sold to me. It needs a new Keel and some engine work but everything else is in excellent condition. THE GOOD NEW IS that the Title is not a Salvage Title, it is a regular Title (as if the boat had NEVER been Salvaged) I am very happy about this and now I know that when I decide to sell it I will get market value for it.

Jeff_H 03-18-2004 01:51 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
In other words, are you telling us that despite the biblical reference of your nom d''net you, are perfectly comfortable selling this boat without disclosing that this boat was wrecked sufficiently hard to require a new keel and that you somehow think that this is a vaguely ethical thing to do as long as the the title does not say ''Salvaged'' on it?

Or are you telling us that you are not really ethically several steps below a used car salesman, and so despite the fact that the title does not disclose the fact that the boat was wrecked, you have enough moral fiber to sell the boat at the market value of a boat that has been wrecked rather than the market value of a boat that has never been totalled?

Jeff

WHOOSH 03-18-2004 03:11 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
"THE GOOD NEW[S] IS that the Title is not a Salvage Title, it is a regular Title (as if the boat had NEVER been Salvaged) I am very happy about this and now I know that when I decide to sell it I will get market value for it.

Sounds to me like the Free Lunch program is alive and well, wherein some folks look forward to a free lunch that others should pay for.

What was the name of that best-seller a few years ago? Something like "Everything I needed to know in life I learned in Kindergarten".

Jack

Stede 03-18-2004 04:43 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
Jeff_H & Whoosh,

I question your remarks towards John232. Are they based on the desire for an accounting of the man, or are they stones of condemnation without justification? Are you worthy to be the jury,judge,and executioner based on a few lines of text that can easily be mis-construed? Surely the unjust, will see the unjust as unjust, will they not?

Sailormon6 03-18-2004 05:17 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
Stede,

Jeff and Whoosh are right. Actually, it is not only an ethical obligation, but it is also a legal obligation to disclose known defects that would materially affect the value of property. The day is past when a seller could alter an odometer to hide the mileage of a car, or sell a flood-damaged car without disclosing its history, or make cosmetic repairs to hide a serious structural defect in property.

That fact that the Title is a regular Title, and not a Salvage Title, doesn''t relieve him of the legal and ethical duty to disclose the boat''s history. It just makes it easier for him to hide it.

To put it in perspective, how would you feel if you bought the boat for full market value, not knowing its history, and then found out that it had serious, hidden damage that the seller knew about, that destroys much of the value of the boat? The worst part is that you then have to decide whether you are going to make disclosure to prospective buyers, or whether you are going to compromise your own principles and not make disclosure, so you can get your money out of the boat.

Stede 03-18-2004 05:39 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
Sailorman6,

To me, the issue here isn''t about whom is right or wrong about a boat.Should stones be cast for the man before he accounts? Should we speak before we listen? Does the council of wisdom welcome hate? If I am guilty, and have errored in my ways,make your charge against me.Let me see my fault. Then I may learn.The whipped dog returns to his Master out of love, not out of the desire for punishment,does he not?

Jeff_H 03-18-2004 08:37 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
Stede,

Mostly like you, all I did is simply asked a couple pointed questions. If any one is throwing stones it would appear to be you. I did not make an assumption of right or wrong doing. My questions did not assume a particular action and was not judging or casting a stone. My questions were posed with the hope John323 would answer those questions honestly and judge his actions for himself.

Respectfully,
Jeff

Sailormon6 03-18-2004 08:48 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
You''re right, Stede. John hasn''t done anything wrong yet, but he''s definitely thinking about it. We''re just trying to encourage him to keep on the righteous path. That''s what friends should do.

Stede 03-18-2004 10:04 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
Jeff_H,

I will not debate with you about the intent of your initial words as you "posed" questions to the man. I will tell you this though. I''ve witnessed numerous times on this board where people "posed" unjust accusations of your comments in a similar style and you weren''t as appreciative of the design then.Board members here came to your aid.But that was in the past, wasn''t it? So shall we reap what we sow.

Jeff_H 03-18-2004 11:34 AM

Got my title for the 30 footer..
 
Look Stede, I don''t think that I have a beef with you. I do think that the original post of this thread was more than a little ambiguous and one possible logical interpretation was to suggest that because the title came back without noting that the vessel was ''salvaged'', that perhaps John232 was suggesting that he would try to sell the boat without full disclosure of the damage. If that was the intent of the original post, then I feel that there is no reason not to question the morality of trying to palm off this vessel in that manner. I am not judging him but if that is his intent then I would think that it would be appropriate for John232 to do some soul searching.

Of course there was another possible interpretation which implied that John232 merely planned to sell the boat for the fair market value for a repaired salvaged boat. That obviously is a different story all together.

My earlier post to you was merely to point out that I was not condemning John232 without knowing what his intentions are but having listened to John''s description of this boat, I posed the somewhat provocative rhetorical questions hoping to either get a clarification that I was mistaken or to stimulate a bit of soul searching.

Respectfully,
Jeff


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